Thumb-sucking six year old

[Italiangreyhound]

My daughter is six, almost seven and is still sucking her thumb.

She started doing it in hospital as a new-born baby. I had tried to give her a dummy but she never took to it.

Years later at about two or three, I asked my health visitor, she told me it was fine and that DD would stop by herself!

However, so far she has not!

It is effecting her teeth, as the dentist said it might.

I have tried everything! Horrid tasting nail polish designed to make adults stop biting their nails, threats of punishment, offers of reward, showing her pictures of buck-teeth on the Internet and even trying to get her to say how she will stop!

Although she says she wants to stop she just seems unable to.

If you can suggest anything helpful, please do.

Many thanks.

Not sure I can help, except to say that I sucked mine until I was 7 - which was the year I went from Infants' School to Junior School and that was the incentive to stop (which I did). None of the foultasting preparations my parents used stopped me - one or two sucks and they were gone anyway - it was just me deciding that now I was going to Junior School it was too babyish to still be sucking my thumb.

So I stopped.

My teeth weren't that badly affected thank goodness.

Um - presumably there is no division at your DD's primary school - so you can't use the "you're going to big school now and you don't want to look babyish, do you" thing - or can you? Do any of her friends still suck their thumbs? Peer pressure might help...

My DD was exactly the same, sucked her thumb from a few days old up until a few weeks before her 7th birthday. I'm afraid to say that the only thing that worked for us was bribery!! We found something that she really really wanted (that a lot of her friends also had) and told her that she could get it after she stopped sucking her thumb for a month. She managed the month (with a bit of help from a sock on her hand occasionally) and she got her reward. She has the occasional slip up, usually when she is not thinking (like watching TV) and I point it out and quickly move her on to something else. It seems to be working and I hope it last because it has affected her teeth although the dentist keeps saying that they will change as she grows and we'll wait and see how they are when she is older.

I'm rambling a bit now and probably haven't been a lot of help but at least you know you are not alone!

The only thing that stopped DS1, at age 7, was the orthodontic brace he had fitted to correct the damage and which then prevented him from getting his thumb in.

Which isn't much help.

It looks like DD is heading the same way.

DSs orthodontist suggested putting long socks on both DDs arms at night to stop her, taping them at the top so she couldn't get them off. breaking the habit at night would help break the habit in the day too.

In fact, I wonder whether a pair of tights, put on her arms under her
PJ top would work...

Hi Italian! I have a thumb sucking 6 year old too. She is 7 in Jan. She sucks hers alot. in our case, so far, this hasn't affected her teeth.

We haven't done much to try to stop her tbh, but have laid down rules (and so have the school) that she shouldn't do it during the day. They stop her whenever they see her doing it. But she does it all the time!

I personally don't worry about it being babyish or an issue at all. The only reason I would want her to stop is because of the teeth issue. I also sucked my thumb and did stop at some stage (mostly!), and as you don't see many adults walking around sucking their thumbs, do think that most children will stop of their own accord when peer pressure becomes an issue.

Perhaps I am wrong, but I remember how nice it is to suck your thumb, and don't want to deprive her of that unless the dentist very strongly recommends that she needs to stop immediately!

Thumbwitch, Pinkx3, SoupDragon and BeattieBow thank you all so much, that is most helpful.

I found this great site: www.oliverthebear.com/

?DO'S
? Do be encouraging
? Do praise any small achievements
? Do offer an incentive or present to motivate the child
? Do record their achievements on a chart or book
? Do keep it fun and interactive
? Do use aids - such as bandaids, paint-on potions or guards, if the child is happy to use them
? Do provide a secure and loving environment
DON'TS
? Do not nag or put pressure on the child to stop sucking
? Do not fuss or make it a big issue
? Do not use interceptive devices if the child does not want to stop
? Do not worry, or be overly concerned
Good luck!?

StrandedBear - lurking if fine. It is a big thing but your child sounds quite young. Hope something is helpful.

My 7 yr old sucks her thumb at night and as caused some serious damage to her teeth. She has pushed her top front teeth out and her bottom front teeth inwards. She now can't pronounce sounds like ch, str etc.

We have tried the nasty tasting nail stuff, bandaging thumb, praise, strong talk from the dentist etc.

Her dentist says he can do nothing until she's about 12 when all teeth are through, saying it was because there may end up being more to fix so why put a brace on now and then spend more years wearing one again for something else (better to do it all in one go). Should mention that her jaw is slightly out of line too.

I really need some help here. At parents evening I was told she has to work on misspellings words starting with ch etc becasue she's spelling them how she pronounces them, so it's now her foremost IEP target.

Should I get a 2nd opinion from another dentist - he didn't seem sympathetic about the pronounciation problem but it's obviously becoming an major issue.

just want to add to mums of other thumb suckers: dds jaw out of line jaw is not something to do with sucking thumb, and that her thumb sucking is moving her teeth because she bites down and pushes hard against her teeth whilst sucking her thumb which has accentuated an already naturally overshot jaw.

(just so you don't all panic)

My sister still occasionally sucks her thumb at 40 - she regularly did until she was about 15 and then it started to tail off but when she's very tired or emotionally stressed she will do it (don't know how, I've tried with mine and it makes me gag now!)
She has a more receded jaw than the rest of our family and I have wondered if it's because she used to push hard against the back of her top front teeth, her thumb almost vertical, so her hand was pushing back against her lower jaw as well. She needed braces.

I needed braces but not because of thumb-sucking - I didn't knock my teeth out of line at all, but I had too many teeth for my mouth, so had some removed and the brace was just on one eye tooth to move it backwards.

DS though - he has already pulled one of his front incisors out of line, which is a bit of a worry because apparently the adult teeth use the line of the baby teeth as a guide to grow through - which suggests his adult front incisor may also be out of line and he will need braces for it. :(

kissingfrogs, your dentist is wrong.

DSs have had braces since they were 7. In DS1s case, it was to correct thumb sucking damage. I noticed the damage to his teeth but it was only when I saw the photos they took of his profile that I saw what he had done to his power jaw too, making his chin recede. The first part of the treatment was to widen top palate to recreate the lost space and this, somehow, corrected the over crowding at the bottom too. Then the brace was changed to one which meant he can't open his mouth (or rather they have to keep their mouth shut to stop it digging in the gums)... This means lower and upper jaws grow properly together and trains him not to sit like a slack jawed idiot :) This isn't as cruel as it sounds, honest!

The change is phenomenal. He is now 12.5 and his jaw is now wonderful and square and his teeth are beautifully straight. he now has to wear the brace for 14 hours a day (mostly over night) and will have to wear it over night until he stops growing which will ensure the teeth don't drift back as they often can after traditional treatment.

DS2s issues were slightly different but, at 10.5 he has the most amazing Cameron Diaz broad grin.

There was a web chat reasonably recently on MN with, Anton Blass (?) which says the same thing.

It wasn't cheap.
It cost over £4k per child.
However, after paying £800 very 6 months until it was paid, there is now no cost for the remainder of the treatment unless one of them loses or breaks their brace. It doesn't seem as expensive when already out over the full treatment time.

Dd1 is 6 and dd2 is 4. They both started sucking their thumbs the night they gave up their dummies .

Dd1 has wonky adult teeth at the bottom, dd2 has pushed her front teeth out.

We have tried an incentive chart, but it hasn't worked. Dd1 only sucks at night, but dd2 does it subconsciously throughout the day.

I shall watch this thread for more ideas!

I honestly believe that you cant stop a child sucking their thumb if they are not willing to do so. They have to play an active part in it, you can't force them. [bitter experience]

Long post - please note I am NOT advocating any of this advice for others, or any of these websites, I am just exploring these issues for myself and my dd.

Reading up on the topic, as I have been since I first posted, I would say, thumb sucking is a habit associated with comfort. It is a hard habits to break when children want to do it and very, very difficult for children who do not want to stop!

If a child wants to stop you can try replacement behaviour. Find a habit that also has the comfort feature.

I am not mad about the idea of giving my six year old a dummy but a dummy instead of a thumb is something I have considered, for bedtime only, so that she could give it up/we could remove it when she is older.

I have also read the advice to find something your child can do with their hands instead of thumb sucking. For example rubbing a piece of material that feels good. This could help a child go to sleep.

Some kids have ?lovelies? or bits of cloth they hold. I think of Linus from the Peanuts cartoon and his blanket. These things might help children to soothe themselves to sleep. Just make sure it is not something long and thin they could strangle themselves with in the night. You have to think of these things.

I am thinking of all these things and what I can get my daughter to work with but she must see the need for it or I think it will not work!

If the child must be motivated, maybe this book mentioned at this website might trigger the child to want to do give up:
www.oliverthebear.com/

You could try different things.

Ask your child how they feel because I think (IMHO) it is all about them, not about you, so if they feel good they will want to implement the new thing and if they feel bad (or others make them feel bad) they will be unlikely to want to make it work.

An adult thumb sucker I know likened it to weight lose or smoking. If you are not motivated to lose weight or give up, then people just nagging you to try and give up or lose weight will actually make you NOT want to do it more! And I know this because when I smoked (years ago) people going on about smoking didn't work and I still struggle with my weight and pressure to lose weight has the opposite effect!

I also think that everyone has different stories of why their child's thumb sucking has or has not damaged their teeth. Maybe to some extent we will never fully know if it has altered their teeth or contributed to it, unless a professional can tell us (and even they may not have all the answers!).

For me personally it is all about giving my child the tools to give up when she is ready, which is what I have learnt from exploring this theme.

I am still getting the ideas together before we (DH and I and then DD and I/us) have a chat about it.

I will also be asking DD for a lot of ideas on how she can stop (if she wants to) and how I can help her, we will give the ideas a score, 10 for the best and one for the worst! We will start with the best ones first.

This site has some helpful advice: kidshealth.org/parent/emotions/behavior/five_habits.html#

?Involve your child in the process of breaking the habit. If your 5-year-old comes home crying from kindergarten because the other kids made fun of his thumb sucking, understand that this is a way of asking you for help. Parents can ask their kids what they think they could do to stop the habit or if they want to stop the habit. Come up with some ways to work on breaking the unwanted habit together.

Suggest alternative behaviors. For example, when if your child is a nail-biter, instead of saying, "Don't bite your nails," try saying, "Let's wiggle our fingers." This will increase awareness of the habit and may serve as a reminder. To occupy your child's attention, try providing a distraction, like helping you in the kitchen or working on a craft.

Reward and praise self-control. For example, allow your little girl to use nail polish if she lets her nails grow. Or every time your son refrains from sucking his thumb, reinforce the positive behavior by praising him and giving him a sticker or other small prize.

Be consistent in rewarding good behavior. If you fail to notice good behavior, it will disappear over time. The new, positive habit must be firmly established before the old one will disappear.?

I read about thumb sucking at en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thumb_sucking and there is some helpful advice here too. E.G.

?If a child is sucking its thumb when feeling insecure or needing comfort, focus instead on correcting the cause of the anxiety and provide comfort to your child.

If a child is sucking on its thumb because of boredom, try getting the child's attention with a fun activity.?

Also some info at:
www.emedicinehealth.com/thumb-sucking-health/article_em.htm

I have read on the Internet of adults using the sucking implements that are designed to help people give up smoking, to help ADULTS stop thumb sucking. Really I am NOT advocating that, I just read about it.

Good luck and can I emphasise I am NOT advocating any of this advice for others, or any of these websites, I am just exploring these issues for myself and my daughter and if anything I say is of use, please do get back and tell us how you get on.

For those who are happy with their own or their child?s thumb sucking, please do not be offended by this thread, it is just my own exploration of the topic.

Thanks.

I swear my DS was sucking his thumb from before he was born - honest to God, his second scan pic, his thumb is nearly in his mouth! When he was born, his right arm stayed bent all the time, putting his thumb up near his mouth (until I took him for cranial osteopathy, which fixed up the bent arm but he still sucked his thumb) He does it now when he's sleepy or cuddling up - it's a part of his settling down/comfortable routine - and I'm trying to get it to a point when that's the only time he does it.

Apparently, what shapes the teeth and jaws correctly is your tongue position and keeping your mouth shut. The tongue ensures the teeth are in the right position and keeping your mouth shut means the jaws grow properly together, in a forward direction. This means that problems can occur without thumb sucking. My personal belief is TV and computer games which encourage that blank eyed, slack jawed look :) The position of the Tongue when swallowing is also, apparently, important. It was all fascinating anyway and I find myself looking at the profiles of children now!

DSs orthodontist did the majority of the initial consultation looking at DSs face, not in his mouth. He and his fellow orthodontist (his son actually) discussed what they expected to find when they finally looked at the teeth. It was fascinating! Most things they were right about, some things were more severe. Interestingly, they also told me that i had sucked my thumb as a child without ever looking inside my mouth. Obviously they had a 50% chance of getting this right but it wasn't a question, it was a statement of fact.

They refused to treat the brother of a patient because, due to his CP, he would never be able to keep his tongue in the correct position to maintain the position of the teeth. Reassuring as they don't take on patients where they can't get a good result, thus not wasting the parents money.

On the subject of thumbs, DD started sucking within weeks of me stopping breastfeeding, when she was 2.5. Clearly a comfort thing but so so annoying!

A plaster (the fabric kind) wrapped around each thumb at night helped my 6 year old stop.

She also wanted to stop, which of course helped no end

I'm fretting now. What if, as Soupdragon says, the dentist is wrong? I think the only way I'll know is to get another dentist's opinion and see.

I can't afford private treatment. On the other hand I know how much it can knock your confidence and alter the way you come across if you avoid smiling because your teeth are bad (personal experience). So i will try to stick with the NHS but will go private if I can somehow afford a payment plan.

How do get a referal to an NHS orthodonist? Is it through your GP or through the dentist?

Because this is causing speech problems it should be taken seriously enough to refer surely?

kissingfrogs I'm sorry, I've no idea about all the things you have mentioned but I am sorry you are distressed. I am sure if you express your concerns then either GP or dentist can start ball rolling for getting extra help.

I have no idea exactly when thumb sucking causes problems with teeth and when it does not. My reading of the subject seems to be that sometimes thumb sucking causes problems with teeth and sometimes not, and I have no idea why it does for some and not for others. I have read that one factor is the vigor of the sucking, if the thumb is sucked more vigorously then it can do more damage and the later age, as in when children have older teeth - BUT I am just saying this is what I have read. I have no idea about your personal situation but I am sure there will be some help and maybe these problems can be sorted.

Good luck.

IME, it appears to be the depth and angle of the thumb when it's sucked. I had mine firmly rammed into my mouth, up against the roof of my mouth, so very little angular pressure in any direction, and no real teeth positional damage.
My sister, as I've already said, favoured a vertical thumb pressed against the back of her teeth, giving her (I believe) a more receded chin.
My DS pulls against his R front tooth and has pulled it slightly out of line (the outer edge juts out) but it will have very little effect on his lower jaw.

One of my friends is an orthodontist and has suggested to me that if they stop before they are 3, then there is unlikely to be any problem. Of course, DS is nearly 4 now so I am already too late.

kissingfrogs - I don't know how much the situation has changed but my family's orthodontistry was all done privately, even back in the dim and distant past - you had to have REALLY REALLY bad teeth to get it on the NHS. I don't know whether that's still the same or not. We couldn't really afford it either but it had to be done, apparently.

Kissingfrogs, I didn't mean to make you fret, sorry. I only discovered this treatment by accident when a friend took her DD along. If I hadn't, DSs would have had the traditional treatment at the usual time. And no doubt they would have been fine.

The type of treatment my DSs have had isn't available on the NHS. Their orthodontist is horrified that the alternatives to traditional train tracks aren't routinely offered. He actually seems to care about the results, not just the money.

There is every chance your DD will be fine and come out of it with no apparent damage. I was a thumbsucker and, whilst is is apparently obvious to the orthodontist from the shape of my face, it has never been an issue.

Thumbwitch, the DSs orthodontists would say that you did cause damage to your teeth/jaws through thumb sucking and that is why you needed teeth removed. Had you not sucked your thumb and allowed your jaws to grow together properly, there would have been space. As they, quite rightly, pointed out: animals are not given more teeth than they can fit in their mouth. If you look at animals where there is no thumb sucking or other long periods of open jawed stuff, they all have perfectly spaced perfectly aligned teeth. Other factors include the softer foods we now eat which require less chewing. Listening to the pair of them go off on their chosen specialist subject is fascinating!! No idea if what they say is 100% proven fact but is is certainly fascinating.

As an aside, the treatment has also stopped DSs snoring. he will also, I am told, suffer less from blocked up nose symptoms in future. My future DIL (or, I guess, SIL) will love me :o

my ds2 is five in dec he sucks his thumb wen he has his blankis in his hand ,but hes never had a dummy