How do you protect the siblings? 😢

[Peachyqueen]

DS(8) has autism. He is very quick to anger and this has resulted in him harming his younger brother (3). Today I left them alone for 2 minutes to go to the toilet, and in that time Ds8 slapped his brother incredibly hard around the face because "he was annoying me".

How the fuck do we deal with this!!

I immediately removed DS8 from the room (sat on the stairs). I comforted DS3 and made sure he was OK. I stayed with him while DS8 had time out, during which he was crying, shouting and spitting as he didn't want to be on the stairs. I explained in calm, measured tones that his behaviour was unacceptable and tbst I was very disappointed etc.

This is becoming far too common an occurance. He has held him under duvets and pillows, pushed him and I stopped him from jumping on his arm the other day - it would have broken if I hadn't stopped him 😭

This all feels so overwhelming and I am struggling with both disciplining an autistic child, which is pretty pointless but I do it anyway; and with protecting my youngest who is only guilty of being a typical 3 year old.

The thing is, my DS8 is the loveliest, kindest child the majority of the time. When he is angry or thinks he has been wronged, he becomes so violent. Its hard to witness.

We are talking with our GP on Monday but I am so out of my depth here. I have cried so much and don't know what to do to help them both.

[Sagapo2411]

@Peachyqueen I can totally understand your situation, I was in similar for a long time regarding the school, we are not experts in the process as parents and it is damn hard and you trust the people around who are supposed to know that they are doing. It's hard to get an EHC to panel so we'll done for managing to get it in place at all!

I'm afraid I can't help much with your original question but I can sympathise. I am no expert but things I have read and have tried include

• redirection ie 'it is not nice to hit your brother hit the couch instead' keep it short and apologies for after they are calm.

-keep interaction at a minimum, avoid eye contact or any reaction from you that is physically possible until they are demonstrating positive behaviour. This is so it does not become an attention thing. Don't know if it's best to say this will be happening in future when they are calm.

-do not give in to what they want from the behaviour so in your situation an example could be "I wanted that toy, he wouldn't give it to me, so I hit him" no matter how much he kicks screams and punches he does not get that toy. Otherwise it has worked and your Ds will learn that.

I don't know if any of the above will be useful and as I said it's just from things I've read and looked up myself.

Life can feel tough so don't beat yourself up over little things, you've got this!

[AReallyUsefulEngine]

I wasn’t the one derailing the thread. I answered your OP and suggested several sources of support and explained how you can get further support quicker via an EHCNA. Jamoncrumpets posted the same points I did by posting “EHCP could be in place by now” and “The onus is on you as a parent really…”. If you didn’t want me to challenge your rudeness perhaps you shouldn’t have posted it in the first place.

LAs and schools often incorrectly tell parents their DC doesn’t need or won’t get an EHCP but the parents go on to successfully apply themselves.

[Peachyqueen]

I know we didn't have to wait. The school delayed things considerably and we wanted to wait for a therapy report to support the application to ensure it got to assessment stage.
I won't lie, the school Senco has been less than helpful. She has told us every time we see her that the application wouldn't get past panel and therefore delayed submitting it. Luckily his teacher and the class TA thought otherwise and have really fought for him (as have we).

[Peachyqueen]

@AReallyUsefulEngine

I don’t know how you could read any of my first 3 posts as a criticism or how you don’t think they didn’t answer your question. The fourth wasn’t a criticism it was pointing out you didn’t need to wait. And if you perceived that as a criticism I don’t know why you didn’t perceive jamoncrumpets’s second post in the same way as it was saying the same thing.

At the risk of a rude reply again, you didn’t need to wait for a diagnosis for any of the support mentioned. It is all based on needs, not diagnosis.

I neither have the energy or patience to do this back and forth with you. I apologised and admitted that I mis-read your tone. Please stop derailing my thread.

[AReallyUsefulEngine]

I don’t know how you could read any of my first 3 posts as a criticism or how you don’t think they didn’t answer your question. The fourth wasn’t a criticism it was pointing out you didn’t need to wait. And if you perceived that as a criticism I don’t know why you didn’t perceive jamoncrumpets’s second post in the same way as it was saying the same thing.

At the risk of a rude reply again, you didn’t need to wait for a diagnosis for any of the support mentioned. It is all based on needs, not diagnosis.

[Peachyqueen]

@AReallyUsefulEngine

What a rude poster. I think you find I also answered your question including posting about social care assessments.

Apologies, I am incredibly sensitive around this all at the moment and it seemed to me that you were just pointing out all the things I was doing wrong or had waited too long to do. He was only diagnosed last summer, COVID delayed things hugely.

I understand you were trying to help but I read some of it as criticism. Guess it's hard to tell tone on a forum.

[AReallyUsefulEngine]

What a rude poster. I think you find I also answered your question including posting about social care assessments.

[Peachyqueen]

@jamoncrumpets

We are having a social care assessment for this exact reason, as my DC cannot tolerate their sibling. It's looking likely that we will receive direct payments towards a PA for weekends and after school, and there will be holiday club access during school hols. It's a heartbreaking process to go through but if it leads to a happier and calmer home it has to be worth it.

Thank you for being the only poster to actually answer my question 💐

I'm glad you're getting somewhere. I'm looking into social care assessments today.

[jamoncrumpets]

@Peachyqueen

EHCP submitted this week. OT assessment pending, hopefully in September. No social care assessments.

Am not aware of ABC reports or Sibs but will look into it.

It's so difficult when you are literally diagnosed and discharged immediately 😫

It is difficult but you have to really do the research and the reading. EHCP could be in place by now.

Suggest IPSEA as a starting place for working out what you're entitled to, and how to go about accessing it all. The onus is on you as a parent really, don't wait for anyone else to refer your DC.

[jamoncrumpets]

We are having a social care assessment for this exact reason, as my DC cannot tolerate their sibling. It's looking likely that we will receive direct payments towards a PA for weekends and after school, and there will be holiday club access during school hols. It's a heartbreaking process to go through but if it leads to a happier and calmer home it has to be worth it.

[AReallyUsefulEngine]

You didn’t need to wait 8 months, you could have applied yourself. You don’t need reports to apply for an EHCNA as assessments are done during the needs assessment - these can include SALT, OT, psychiatrist and clinical psychologist, as well as an Ed Psych assessment whose advice must be sought.

[Peachyqueen]

@AReallyUsefulEngine

I thought you had applied for an EHCP? You can’t apply for an EHCNA without applying to the LA. It’s the LA who are responsible for EHCPs.

Behaviour outside of school doesn’t necessarily mean the problem is at home. Many DC mask at school and explode at home due to unmet needs at school. It’s called the coke bottle effect. DS’s tolerance at home could well be none existent if he is using all his energy to ‘cope’ at school. And if his needs at school we’re better met you may find there are less explosions at home.

Yes we have, but only yesterday. Its taken nearly 8 months to get it completed dye to reports and issues with the senco. No other LA involvement.

[AReallyUsefulEngine]

I thought you had applied for an EHCP? You can’t apply for an EHCNA without applying to the LA. It’s the LA who are responsible for EHCPs.

Behaviour outside of school doesn’t necessarily mean the problem is at home. Many DC mask at school and explode at home due to unmet needs at school. It’s called the coke bottle effect. DS’s tolerance at home could well be none existent if he is using all his energy to ‘cope’ at school. And if his needs at school we’re better met you may find there are less explosions at home.

[Peachyqueen]

The LA aren't involved at all, everything is private. Luckily our parents are supporting us. We have not had a u support at all.

He gets ok support in school, his teacher is great. It's inside of school and his spontaneous anger and aggression we struggle with.

[AReallyUsefulEngine]

If the LA agree to assess an OT assessment can be part of the EHCNA, along with SALT and psychiatrist &/or clinical psychologist assessments.

You should ask for social care assessments - a carer’s assessment for you and an assessment via the disabled children’s team for DS. The latter can be part of the EHCNA too.

What support are the school providing in the meantime?

[Peachyqueen]

EHCP submitted this week. OT assessment pending, hopefully in September. No social care assessments.

Am not aware of ABC reports or Sibs but will look into it.

It's so difficult when you are literally diagnosed and discharged immediately 😫

[AReallyUsefulEngine]

In the short term they shouldn’t be left alone together.

Longer term is DS1 receiving any support - does he have an EHCP, is he receiving OT, SALT, emotional literacy support…? Have you done ABC charts to see if you can spot triggers?

Have you had social care assessments?

Also look into contacting Sibs.

[Peachyqueen]

Anyone, please.