My 12 year old is being horrible.

[BackieJerkhart]

It's really getting to me. He has been horrible all summer. He just arrogantly refuses to do anything he doesn't feel like doing and he knows I can't do anything about it. He is currently grounded for 3 weeks because of his behaviour last Monday morning. I have taken his phone off him and am only allowing PlayStation when he has shown me good behaviour. When he is feeling compliant he is lovely, he will empty the dishwasher (his one and only chore) and will sit and have a cuddle and chat with me but if he doesn't want to do something (like get out of bed!) he just refuses and lies in bed until midday. I told him all summer that the week before school starts back he will be going back to a fixed bedtime and getting up at the time he will have to for school. He is starting secondary school on Friday and it's a much earlier start than he is used to for primary school. I woke him this morning and he just refused to get up. I opened his curtain and window, took his duvet and pillow off him, tickled him, sang badly out of tune but he just said no he wasn't getting up. What do I do if he refuses once school starts? I feel totally helpless and he knows it.

[Out2pasture]

Agree with hoople.

[Hoople]

Don't for goodness sake, call the police if he storms out the house. What terrible advice. Complete waste of resources that are stretched to breaking point as it is. The police aren't there to deal with vaguely naughty pre teens

[BackieJerkhart]

I am hoping that he will get involved in a lot more sports when he starts secondary school. The school has a great extra curricular programme and is very sports oriented.

[AvoidingCallenetics]

I think you did everything right. Not mean at all to take the devices with you from the house - you are just ensuring that he cannot ignore your rule of grounded = no electronics. If you'd have left them, you would have come home to a dmug kid who spent all day on playstation and who totally got all his own way.
You have to get control of him now because one day soon he will be bigger and stronger than you.

If he storms out of the house against your wishes, call the police.

Agree with advice to give him a choice but not allow him to ruin yours and ds2's day. If he doesn't want to join in then he stays home alone and if he is grounded then he stays home without the consoles/mobile phone.

[BackieJerkhart]

Ok, agree this is a horrible cycle of punishments after punishments. But what do I do?

How should I have dealt with last Monday morning? Should I have just let him go to the club?

His sport is led by a male coach and I signed him up for boxing boot camp that was running ten whole summer but he decided after the first week he didn't want to go back to it.

His dad definitely isn't in touch. I check his messages on his phone and the PS4.

[Hoople]

I agree with Painting. You need to end this perpetual cycle of punishments and just stop punishing for everything. Lots of long and involved consequences going on here

[Out2pasture]

I would increase the sports, ideally one with a male coach. In the summer time (off school) I would aim for intense sports training 4-5 days a week. Term time 3-5 times a week.

[MissEDashwood]

I know he may appear too old for a chart, he might even comment, Mum I'm not a baby. At that point I would say to him, behave like a 12 year old, you will get treated like one! Do you need me to tell you how the chart works, this is solely for your benefit not mine.

This may have been answered, but is he fatigued at all, so he needs the sleep.

Actually this may be a good way to go, I'm really worried about you and all the sleeping, so we're off to the doctors, they can test your blood and make sure you're ok. If there's anything you want to talk about but cant find the words, write a letter, just so I understand, as your behaviour is worrying, I want to get you the help you need.

If you've a diary or even on your phone keep a track of the incidents to see if there's a problem.

Is there anyway his Dad could get in touch? Like social media? His Dad or a friend / family member could be stirring the pot as it were.

Sorry you're having to go through this

[PaintingByNumbers]

Honestly, it sounds like a whole load of trouble you are creating for yourself here. Are your worries eg about him ending up like his dad, guiding your behaviour
3 week ban, during holidays, no build up eg a one day ban. Why? Just a massive problem for you as well as him
Banning camp = him at home bored. Why? Massive problem for you as well as him
Getting him up early unnecessarily. Why? Unnecessary battle you cant actually win

How about giving him some time and space and only starting fights you can win and imposing punishments that dont punish you both? Just leave him in bed, its fine, go out, let him know, let him do activities if he actually wants to (so he would get out of bed for that!)

Its hard, its going to get harder, you need to get smarter

[BackieJerkhart]

Yes he has several friends that live really close by and he can go call for. Two of them he has an on again/of again kind of friendship and I never know from one day to the next if they are speaking or not.

[Christinayangstwistedsista]

Does he have much of a social life?

[BackieJerkhart]

how much physical activity is he getting?

Not enough. One of his hobbies is a sport (that he does enjoy) but is only 45 minutes once a week. I have supplied him with several bits of equipment so he can practise at home if he wants. He also has a bike and scooter but rarely goes out on them. We also have a park right opposite our house that he used to run laps off but he has stopped doing that now. I try to persuade him but he says he can't be bothered.

One to one time can be tricky with DS2 always here. He can be very demanding. I'm also not sure DS1 would want any one to one time with me at the minute.

[teaandakitkat]

I'm having the same trouble with my 11 yr old right now. Endless defiance, arguing, cheek, slamming doors, picking fights with his brothers.

I take electronics away for an hour after counting to 3. So yesterday I asked him to clean his teeth and he wouldn't. I said I will count to 3 and if you haven't started I will take your phone away for an hour. At first I ended up taking his phone almost all day but now I'd say 2/3 times he does what he's asked so that's progress, right? Even if he does whatever he's asked with lots of attitude and doorslamming and heavy sighs.

We also have a no gadgets in the bedroom at night rule and he fights me on that one almost every single day even though I never ever back down.

It's so wearing, and so hard to not react. I feel for you.

[Christinayangstwistedsista]

Can you get some one to one time with him?

Can the two of you do something fun together and when he is relaxed talk to him like a adult, talk to him about your concerns etc

I've found with my DS it works if I pick my battles otherwise I would be like a raging banshee all of the time

[drinkingtea]

Backie that's usually a good thing. Most kids are fairly well behaved at school but lose it where they feel safe and loved. If they're playing up at school it's a whole new level.

Kids who play up only at school are rare unless they have a Sen school isn't catering for properly, and kids who play up in both places are more problematic than those who just play up for their parents!

[Out2pasture]

Teens are hard, how much physical activity is he getting?

[BackieJerkhart]

And he is of course an angel in school and his clubs. Never any trouble from him there. He saves it all for me at home. I suspect his teachers wouldn't believe me if I told them what he is like at home.

[BackieJerkhart]

Yes just the 3 of us. Their dad isn't allowed contact due to SS intervention. I could liken DS's lack of respect to what he has witnessed his dad doing in the past but it helps no-one and just makes me resentful.

[Christinayangstwistedsista]

Did you have any negative reports from the school or the club?

[Christinayangstwistedsista]

It must be a nightmare, I have a12 year old D's and his attitude is changing but not as bad as this. You don't mention a df, is it just the three of you?

[BackieJerkhart]

Yes I think clean slate tomorrow is the way to go. I never seem to manage the right balance between relaxing the rules and coming down hard. It's always one or the other and it messes up the whole dynamic.

Agree out I think the long punishments are not working but I just never know what else to do. I can take consoles away but that's about it. He goes to two hobbies in term time but I don't want to start withdrawing them as punishments.

[CauliflowerSqueeze]

Ok. With the friend and him mocking you, I would say on another occasion "that's rude and I would like an apology now or your friend will have to go home".
If he says no then immediately arrange for the friend to go home.

3 weeks is miles too long because now you're in a position whereby you have to stick at it or he will think he can negotiate but it won't have any effect.

On another occasion keep it to 2 days and remove everything he likes.

[Out2pasture]

Everyone deals with situations differently. Personally I find long punishments hard on me and difficult to maintain. Probably ineffective in the long run for my group (grown up now).

[drinkingtea]

wanted and raced = ranted and raved

[drinkingtea]

Does sound very difficult - my DD will be 12 in two weeks, and when she (once) did the mocking me to show off in front of friends thing I wanted and raced at her then and there and let her know that one more tiny thing and the friend's parents would be called immediately, and she wouldn't have another sleep over for a year - DD cried and admitted she was being mean to me because her friend was mocking her about being sent up to bed (to watch a film in the TV/ DVD we carry into the bedroom if they're having a sleepover) at 10pm. We agreed the friend is an arse and not to invite her again...

Can you do a clean slate thing tomorrow? Not giving electronics back but agreeing you are on the same side and asking how he'd like to speak the last week of his holiday (being clear electronics are not an option as that ship has sailed)? If all he wants is lie ins maybe you can meet half way in that, given he is still on holiday. Bedtime returned to routine but let him lie in, knowing that if you and ds2 want to go out before he's up he'll be home alone electronics free and have to read a book

DD has to be up at 5:45 in term time but I'm not making her get up at that time even one day before she has to! I get up at 5am for early shifts but don't start getting up at 5am on my days off or when I'm on lates, so no need for kids to either IMO.