I wonder what being NT feels like?

[AffIt]

I'm mostly quite happy in my autistic headspace, but every now and again, when I'm having a bad day, I wonder what it's like to be 'normal' and not have a head which feels like a sack of cats.

Take yoga: apparently, yoga is brilliant, but it just makes me angry and then to want to go to sleep, which I can do at home for free, so I resent having to pay for it, which then makes me more angry, and annoyed at not being very bendy.

It must be lovely to just be able to switch off your brain, or, at the very least, just live with it.

[Adventurine]

I’m sorry you feel that way, @toughgrandprix, but I think you’ve taken the wrong impression of my relationship from my post. First of all, “them” refers to my husband and children. That’s who I’m discussing. My family. Not everyone. I can only speak for the experiences I have around the people I know. I can’t even say what it’s like to be them. I only know what I see, which isn’t a window to their mind. And as for my relationship… It’s not codependency, it’s a team where each of us appreciates the others strengths and supports them in the areas where they need it. There are many things my husband can do that I struggle with and I am happy to discuss them, but this thread was what it’s like to be NT and I felt I could offer a perspective as an NT person who married someone ND, had three ND children and had to work out how best to support them on my own, because society is less tolerant of them than me and doctors give a diagnosis and consider their work done! I could list many things that my husband and children can do and understand with ease that I cannot, but society is more concerned over whether or not they know when it’s their turn, what’s coming next, what the unspoken rules are, etc. That’s what I was attempting to communicate. I have a lot of privilege with just knowing these things and being able to cope in almost any environment and my family are at a disadvantage because they do not and are expected to behave as if they do. Even when life is going smoothly for me, it’s always harder for them and I try always to remember that.

[AlternativelyWired]

I don't think Adventurine was othering at all. Her post is very understanding and to me shows how accepting she is of ND and is aware of her husbands difficulties and steps in to help. To me that's a team, not a codependency.

[RampantIvy]

I though @Adventurine's post was brilliant.

[toughgrandprix]

@Adventurine

Hello.

I'm NT but my three children and my husband are ND.

I can see the look on my husband's face sometimes when I can organise something he's been struggling with and it's not a challenge for me. I can't work out if it's relief that the task is done, resentment that I can do it or a mixture of the both. I imagine the latter. I don't swoop in to rescue though, he would hate that. We've been together a decade and I can usually see when he's reached the point that he's starting to feel overwhelmed. Sometimes I miss it though, and he will have a meltdown or completely withdraw. Very few people tolerate the traits of autistic or adhd adults, let alone support them, I've found. Far less than tolerate and support them in children.

We struggled recently because my husband's name went on the finance for our new car, purely because our daughter was sick and I was with her. Because his name is on the finance, anything that needs sorting with the car has to go through him. I've tried to change it, they won't do it. We've found a few issues with the car and he absolutely cannot summon the energy to deal with those. To make the call to the dealership, explain the issue and insist on resolution. He can't streamline his thoughts like that. If I called them, I would have a clear objective and I would know exactly what I expected from the call and would be able to steer the conversation to that end. He would not. He would be unable to stay on topic, unable to process what they were saying and respond to it appropriately and wouldn't be able to stop relating the situation to (what would seem to be) entirely unrelated things and talking about them at length.

I have a level of privilege that he does not, and that my children do not. I can stay on topic. I can remember what I was doing. I remember what I was asked. I know what needs to come next even when the unexpected has happened. I know what everyone needs and when they need it.

I can see how difficult it is for all of them in terms of organisation, productivity, socially etc.. but I can't ever really know what it's like to be them. All I do know is that, even with all the amazing ways they think and the unexpected skills that gives them, life is so much more difficult for them to navigate than it is for me.

Yikes, I really disliked your post, especially all of the 'them' references which succeeded in 'othering' ND people on an ND board. Slow handclap.

I also think you'd benefit from counselling for your codependency.

[Kanaloa]

Definitely start a thread. Explain what’s your specific struggle and I bet a lot of people can offer ideas and perspective. With meeting up I can’t offer any ideas! I have learned though that things like ‘we must go for a coffee’ seem to basically mean ‘we will never go for a coffee.’ Not sure how you ascertain whether they actually want to go for coffee other than saying ‘great let’s go on Friday!’

[GreenCard]

Thank you @Kanaloa @SoggyPaper and @Mabelface blunt I can do and I like, it’s on the issues I have with other people and their white lies and glossing over things and being expected to toe the line, I can’t not call people out on it! I’ll start another thread sometime thanks, currently trying to work out how to do the friendship thing. I’m all or nothing and can’t hold onto them and have no idea where to pitch replaying to messages wanting to meet up/presents etc. I think the only way people will want to stay is off I give them the full hotel experience with chocolates on the pillows and slippers and fluffy dressing gowns then I’m mightily pissed off when people want to stay! I want them to come back I really fucking don’t at the same time 😂

Another voice to say that this thread came up in active and the disclaimer wasn’t there for me.

[Emmelina]

I’ve not been confirmed as ND, but 2/3 children (so far, trying to get assessment for the third!) are autistic so would not be surprised if I am also as see a lot of me in them.
Anyway. We have a copy of the “all cats are on the autism spectrum” book, found it really helpful to have something to relate to. But my eldest feels as you do OP - and she said what we really need is sort of the opposite of that book to show the “weird” things NT’s do!
someone should write one. Or if it exists already please tell me what it is! I’d have a very happy 14 year old :)

[Clarice99]

@AlternativelyWired

@Adventurine I think your post is fantastic and I'm glad you posted here. It's lovely to hear of someone so supportive.

Second that!

[Adventurine]

Thank you, @AffIt and @AlternativelyWired, you’re both very kind. I’ve now read through the thread and I was sad to see some unhelpful and patronising responses. My loved ones have similarly infuriating interactions at work and school. As I’ve said, I don’t know what it’s like to be in my husband’s head or my children’s, but I know they don’t need anyone dismissing their experiences or explaining their own minds to them. Especially not when the person doing so has no lived experience!

[AffIt]

@Adventurine, thank you for posting.

I think your post is a great example of how to listen and react appropriately and respectively, as opposed to just stomping all over things.

[AlternativelyWired]

@Adventurine I think your post is fantastic and I'm glad you posted here. It's lovely to hear of someone so supportive.

[Adventurine]

I apologise, this was in active threads and I thought it was a Chat topic. My response wasn't meant to tell anyone what their lived experience is like as if I know it. I only know my husband's and my children's and even that only from my own perspective.

[Adventurine]

Hello.

I'm NT but my three children and my husband are ND.

I can see the look on my husband's face sometimes when I can organise something he's been struggling with and it's not a challenge for me. I can't work out if it's relief that the task is done, resentment that I can do it or a mixture of the both. I imagine the latter. I don't swoop in to rescue though, he would hate that. We've been together a decade and I can usually see when he's reached the point that he's starting to feel overwhelmed. Sometimes I miss it though, and he will have a meltdown or completely withdraw. Very few people tolerate the traits of autistic or adhd adults, let alone support them, I've found. Far less than tolerate and support them in children.

We struggled recently because my husband's name went on the finance for our new car, purely because our daughter was sick and I was with her. Because his name is on the finance, anything that needs sorting with the car has to go through him. I've tried to change it, they won't do it. We've found a few issues with the car and he absolutely cannot summon the energy to deal with those. To make the call to the dealership, explain the issue and insist on resolution. He can't streamline his thoughts like that. If I called them, I would have a clear objective and I would know exactly what I expected from the call and would be able to steer the conversation to that end. He would not. He would be unable to stay on topic, unable to process what they were saying and respond to it appropriately and wouldn't be able to stop relating the situation to (what would seem to be) entirely unrelated things and talking about them at length.

I have a level of privilege that he does not, and that my children do not. I can stay on topic. I can remember what I was doing. I remember what I was asked. I know what needs to come next even when the unexpected has happened. I know what everyone needs and when they need it.

I can see how difficult it is for all of them in terms of organisation, productivity, socially etc.. but I can't ever really know what it's like to be them. All I do know is that, even with all the amazing ways they think and the unexpected skills that gives them, life is so much more difficult for them to navigate than it is for me.

[AffIt]

@Clarice99

@MNHQ - instead of the same old message, why aren't you taking steps to stop all ND threads showing up in active?

Loads of us have asked for it, countless times, to no avail.

You are enabling the ableism that goes on in this forum. In your shoes, I'd be ashamed of enabling such behaviour. Surely it's time for you to LISTEN to what we are asking for and ACT upon it instead of posting feeble messages on threads that are derailed by NT's?

Brilliant - well said.

[Clarice99]

@MNHQ - instead of the same old message, why aren't you taking steps to stop all ND threads showing up in active?

Loads of us have asked for it, countless times, to no avail.

You are enabling the ableism that goes on in this forum. In your shoes, I'd be ashamed of enabling such behaviour. Surely it's time for you to LISTEN to what we are asking for and ACT upon it instead of posting feeble messages on threads that are derailed by NT's?

[HalloVegBot]

@AffIt

Well, that escalated quickly.

I really wish@mnhqwould remove the ND board from Active Threads.

My apologies. I too saw this in active, did not know it was rhetorical and had been struggling in rehab with meditation as people told me it would be life saving but I just could not get it and thought I was a failure. So I only posted to empathize.

[Rreaq]

As I said earlier, I think I'd give anything for just a day like that, being able to function and do things so normal like the majority of the NT does like go to the shops, restaurants, job but I worry it would be pretty soul destroying for me to try it for a day then have to go back to me. Like if a genie appeared, what would be the minimum I'd want to experience, I don't know, I worry it would be like being on day release from a prison and then going straight back in. Maybe I would just say no thank you, I swing between wanting to experience it and not, even just in the space of writing this post! 😂

Its why online groups and boards like this one mean much to me, I don't function in nt society. So an area to discuss this stuff with fellow nd people going through it is always worth it's weight in gold even though you have cluster fucks like this thread or when people post hate speech etc.

[crossstitchingnana]

*pissed off

[crossstitchingnana]

I am so confused. If you're posting on an open thread, in active, you cannot dictate what people do or don't post. Along as it's not abusive I don't see what the problem is??

I for one get really Lisa's off when I am told what I can and cannot say. My experience is as valid as everyone else's. ND or NT.

[YetAnotherBeckyMumsnet]

Hi all. We're dropping in with a reminder that this board exists primarily for the use of Neurodiverse Mumsnetters. Others are welcome to post but please be respectful. (Apologies that the disclaimer does not show on the app - we'll look into this.)

With this in mind, please don't derail threads as this is intended as a supportive area for ND MNers to share advice and experiences.

Thanks.
MNHQ

[SoggyPaper]

@eurochick

Fwiw this warning does not show up on the app, which is the way I access MN. I've never seen it before.

Well that’s ridiculous. What’s the point in a warning of a large proportion of the users can’t see it?

[eurochick]

@SoggyPaper

It’s abundantly clear - even if you access a thread from active convos - that this us a board for neurodiverse MNers though.

There is a disclaimer on every single thread.

And the information in the OP specifies the query in the title. The OP is very obviously reflecting on her own experience.

NT people coming in to say that they have problems too and what ND people are describing is just normal is not being respectful. This stuff happens all the time, so people are touchy and protective of this board for ND MNers.

Fwiw this warning does not show up on the app, which is the way I access MN. I've never seen it before.

[BarrowInFurnessRailwayStation]

Interesting how NT 'empathy' seems to consist of turning things into a competition then sticking the boot in when people object about minimising behaviour.

[BarrowInFurnessRailwayStation]

This place is ableist through and through.

[SoggyPaper]

I guess at least MN deleted that one. Stereotyping ND people as ‘mathematical savants’ who mock and bully the mathematically less able is apparently not worth deleting though.

Or general ‘how dare you use a board for ND people to discuss your experiences as ND people’ sentiments. That’s absolutely fine. Even more so when ‘other people have it harder than you’ is thrown in to cement that. That can all stand.

You have to call everyone shitheads to get deleted. 🤷🏻‍♀️