My feed
Premium

Please
or
to access all these features

WEBCHAT GUIDELINES: 1. One question per member plus one follow-up. 2. Keep your question brief. 3. Don't moan if your question doesn't get answered. 4. Do be civil/polite. 5. If one topic or question threatens to overwhelm the webchat, MNHQ will usually ask for people to stop repeating the same question or point.

MNHQ have commented on this thread

Mumsnet webchats

Webchat about women/mums in politics with Stella Creasy and Caroline Nokes - 1st February

259 replies

JuliaMumsnet · 31/01/2022 09:37

Hello,

We're delighted to announce a webchat on the 1st February, from 12.30 to 1.30pm with Caroline Nokes MP and Stella Creasy MP about women and mothers in politics. We know that women - and particularly mums - are underrepresented in politics, and that the makeup of those walking the corridors of power affects the decisions that are made. The webchat is part of the work we’re doing to explore the barriers for women and mums and see what can be done to encourage more of them to get involved.

Caroline Nokes is the conservative party MP for Romsey and Southampton North and the current Chair of the Women and Equalities Select Committee in Parliament, where she is leading an inquiry into menopause in the workplace. Since her election in 2010 she has served as a Minister in the Department for Work and Pensions, the Cabinet Office and was Minister of State for Immigration in Theresa May’s Cabinet.

Stella Creasy is the Labour and Co-operative MP for Walthamstow in North East London. She’s worked on legal loan sharks, legalising abortion in Northern Ireland, to tackle tax evasion and the impact of the private sector on the NHS and for stronger action on violence against women and girls. Following the birth of her first child in 2019, she became the first MP to appoint a locum while she took maternity leave.

Please join us here on Tuesday 1st February at 12.30pm. If you can’t join us on the day, please leave your question here in advance.

As always, please remember our webchat guidelines - one question per user, follow-ups only if there’s time and most questions have been answered, and please keep it civil. Also if one topic is dominating a thread, mods might request that people don't continue to post what's effectively the same question or point. (We may suspend the accounts of anyone who continues after we've posted to ask people to stop, so please take note.) Rest assured we will ALWAYS let the guest know that it's an area of concern to multiple users and will encourage them to engage with those questions.

Many thanks,
MNHQ

Webchat about women/mums in politics with Stella Creasy and Caroline Nokes - 1st February
Webchat about women/mums in politics with Stella Creasy and Caroline Nokes - 1st February
OP posts:
Report
StellaCreasy · 01/02/2022 13:52

@thepastisanothercountry

Thank you for answering on all woman shortlists - glad to hear you weren't on one - they are an insult though I understand why some people see the benefit.

This is not so much a question as a comment.

I was in fact a councillor on one of the large city councils with a baby 16 years ago. It was tough but was allowed to take my baby to meetings provided I didn't breast feed in the chamber and she didn't disrupt the meting (which mainly she didn't). I found councillors of all parties to be supportive of my position and many of them ended up holding the baby!!

Creche availablity was absolutely non existent and there was certainly no option for a proxy so I had to drag the poor lass about and get on with it. I was utterly determined to carry on representing my constituents because that is what they elected me to do - I used to take casework calls and run constituency meetings with a baby in my arms, never mind door to door canvessing and leaflet delivery but still managed to get re-elected in a very marginal ward and later to chair a major scrutiny committee so can't have done too terribly.

That was 16 years ago. It was tough but I don't regret it. She's grown up with quite a social and political consciousness and I'm very proud of her :)

AWS is only an insult if you think the other people on the list are a walkover or that somehow being a man in itself makes you a better candidate. There were 27 other women who put themselves forward for Walthamstow - it was a tough process and I'm proud to have been selected in that way! Shocked to hear you weren't allowed to breastfeed- thats a protected right.....and worried that we act as if this has to be a struggle rather than holding to account both local and national government to make sure it is easier to combine family and political life because that benefits a wider range of candidates and so our democracy.. great to hear about your daughter and how proud you are of her!
Report
DismantledKing · 01/02/2022 13:49

Thank you for your response.

Report
thepastisanothercountry · 01/02/2022 13:48

Thank you for answering on all woman shortlists - glad to hear you weren't on one - they are an insult though I understand why some people see the benefit.

This is not so much a question as a comment.

I was in fact a councillor on one of the large city councils with a baby 16 years ago. It was tough but was allowed to take my baby to meetings provided I didn't breast feed in the chamber and she didn't disrupt the meting (which mainly she didn't). I found councillors of all parties to be supportive of my position and many of them ended up holding the baby!!

Creche availablity was absolutely non existent and there was certainly no option for a proxy so I had to drag the poor lass about and get on with it. I was utterly determined to carry on representing my constituents because that is what they elected me to do - I used to take casework calls and run constituency meetings with a baby in my arms, never mind door to door canvessing and leaflet delivery but still managed to get re-elected in a very marginal ward and later to chair a major scrutiny committee so can't have done too terribly.

That was 16 years ago. It was tough but I don't regret it. She's grown up with quite a social and political consciousness and I'm very proud of her :)

Report
StellaCreasy · 01/02/2022 13:48

@DismantledKing

Could Stella please address the abuse given to Rosie Duffield, and the lack of support from the Party?

sorry just seen this as still struggling to keep up with how the threads work. Not going to go into detail in public but would say absolutely, have been in touch with Rosie to offer her support because no one should experience abuse or abandonment within public life.
Report
TeenPlusCat · 01/02/2022 13:48

@EastWellowBride

Romsey is not ready for a woman
But the previous MP was also a woman!

And very good she was too.
Report
JustineMumsnet · 01/02/2022 13:48

Ok that's it folks - Thanks to Stella and Caroline for coming along - and props to Stella for doing it with a baby on her lap. Thanks for your participation.

Report
StellaCreasy · 01/02/2022 13:47

@TedsFederationRep

How do you define "gender"?

Do you understand why so many women believe that any parliamentary bill that includes the phrase "sex or gender" is actually doing the job of trying to remove or deny our sex-based rights?

they would be mistaken- for example, by including this in hate crime laws we can learn from best policing practice. Would flag that hate crime is about holding to account a perpetrator- for example, if they perceive someone to be a particular ethnicity and attack them, then their perception is critical to the crime. Including Sex or gender in hate crime would for the first time give women the protection from being targeted for who they are, and ensure no perperator could have a defence which is based on demeaning the victim or be overlooked because of wrongly assigning a victim.
Report
PIectrumEIectrum · 01/02/2022 13:47

I'm wondering if the clear ongoing & unresolved issues at hand, continuing to dominate and distract from whatever aim both politicians had for this 'chat', have helped either understand how continuing to skirt around this issue rather than engage with women, is not a winning strategy at all.

Disappointing.

Report
babyjellyfish · 01/02/2022 13:46

What sex based rights do you think are not protected?

We no longer actually have words to identify biological sex in humans. The words "woman" and even "female" can now apparently refer to gender identities, which means that there is no longer a word which means "all biologically female humans", excluding all biologically male humans.

How can you defend sex based rights if you have no way of identifying the people who benefit from those rights?

Report
EastWellowBride · 01/02/2022 13:45

Romsey is not ready for a woman
But the previous MP was also a woman!

Report
jeaux90 · 01/02/2022 13:44

I'm so angry that as a tax payer the system doesn't work for me, the police, the legal system etc.

As half the population whose tax bill doesn't discriminate based on my sex why is it that women and girls get substandard service when it comes down to policing and prosecution on VAWG/Rape.

Perhaps we should get a rebate?

Report
DismantledKing · 01/02/2022 13:44

Could Stella please address the abuse given to Rosie Duffield, and the lack of support from the Party?

Report
justaftb · 01/02/2022 13:43

(Personally have been called out when highlighting that trans and cys are DIFFERENT - not one is better or superior than the other, just different - and seeing others having the same conflicts is somewhat reassuring!)

Different - you can say that again. In that some are women and some are men. No woman is a subset of "woman" and therefore no need for the 'cis' prefix. Men who identify as their idea of a woman have no place in a discussion about women and mothers in politics.

Report
Ereshkigalangcleg · 01/02/2022 13:43

Unlike the previous inquiry the Women and Equalities Committee did on this we absolutely did take evidence from women's rights groups - I always try to listen to both sides.

That's very admirable, but then in that case I'm not sure why you're asking what women's concerns are about sex based rights?

Report
ArabellaScott · 01/02/2022 13:43

@RoyalCorgi

What sex based rights do you think are not protected?

Women's sex-based rights to single-sex changing rooms, toilets, hospital wards, prisons, domestic violence refuges, rape-crisis centres, intimate personal care, mammograms, sports as well as any competitions, shortlists etc traditionally open only to women.

All 'sex based' rights vanish when sex becomes a meaningless category that one can opt into or out of.
Report
CarolineNokesWebchat · 01/02/2022 13:41

@Zandathepanda

One of my daughters would like to go into politics and mostly leans towards Labour but after seeing what has happened to Rosie Duffield, says she couldn’t hack it. A while back I would have told her to carry on. But there seems no dignity left in cabinet either. Is there any point?

Yes - there is a point. If we give up and get shouted down we lose. My biggest supporter is undoubtedly my Mum, who gets too little credit so I shall give her some here.
Report
CarolineNokesWebchat · 01/02/2022 13:40

@Ereshkigalangcleg

so genuinely open to understanding what rights these 'take away' as opposed to extend?

Could you maybe sit down with women's groups who are concerned and discuss it? Maybe our concerns are misplaced and that's all it will take to reassure people!

Unlike the previous inquiry the Women and Equalities Committee did on this we absolutely did take evidence from women's rights groups - I always try to listen to both sides.
Report
Zandathepanda · 01/02/2022 13:39

One of my daughters would like to go into politics and mostly leans towards Labour but after seeing what has happened to Rosie Duffield, says she couldn’t hack it. A while back I would have told her to carry on. But there seems no dignity left in cabinet either. Is there any point?

Report
SurfacingLurker · 01/02/2022 13:39

Hi both, thanks for coming today. I hope that if you take nothing else away from this chat, you take note that there's a massive elephant in this room that overshadows everything else. I completely understand your reluctance to talk about this (and our hosts for not allowing it to dominate the conversation), but it is not going away and it's impossible for women to take you seriously if this term can apply to literally anybody at their absolute discretion. Can you not appreciate how this approach may encourage people not to take you seriously?

Report
SFabios · 01/02/2022 13:39

This chat has been insane ...

Applaud Caroline and Stella for navigating it ... ! A tricky one with unfortunately not enough on the actual topic matter intended. Mums in politics.

Thank you though... !

(Personally have been called out when highlighting that trans and cys are DIFFERENT - not one is better or superior than the other, just different - and seeing others having the same conflicts is somewhat reassuring!)

Thanks to all those who tried to make this webchat constructive.... as Stella says, a lot of heat, ...

Report
ADisgruntledPelican · 01/02/2022 13:38

Thank you for your response @StellaCreasy Do you consider any of the posts on here to be unkind?
Because I don't see posters being unkind. I don't see women who I know through the Parliament Project (so women who are considering standing) being unkind. I don't see the women in my feminist campaigning groups being unkind.
What I do see is a passion for politics and getting involved that is absolutely hampered by the fear of death threats; of being inundated with abuse; of being ostracised and bullied by members of their own party if they state their commitment to all protected characteristics including sex.
It may be that you think women should ignore all those issues; should hope the threats are rhetoric and if not that the police will find the perpetrators. And that women need to put their head above the parapet anyway but I'd argue that isn't taking into account the daily harassment women face. Abuse isn't an abstract for most women. It's a reality. And the biggest obstacle I see to women and mums getting involved is that our safety isn't taken seriously by most political parties.

Report
CarolineNokesWebchat · 01/02/2022 13:38

@WhatFreshHellisCismas

What does a ‘normal week’ in politics look like for a working mum? How much time do you get with your children?

I leave home on a Monday morning, and get back very late on a Wednesday (usually). My daughter is 23 now, but I missed most of her growing up, she was year 7 when I was elected. I am very conscious that many MPs who are Mums have made massive sacrifices, but we need them to keep standing. We need people like Stella who prove you can be a Mum and an MP, we need to have the debates around how you can have babies in the chamber. Too many times I have been told I don't look like an MP. That's because I am not a 45 year old man. We have to be more determined to demonstrate that anyone can be an MP.
Report

Don’t want to miss threads like this?

Weekly

Sign up to our weekly round up and get all the best threads sent straight to your inbox!

Log in to update your newsletter preferences.

You've subscribed!

RoyalCorgi · 01/02/2022 13:38

What sex based rights do you think are not protected?

Women's sex-based rights to single-sex changing rooms, toilets, hospital wards, prisons, domestic violence refuges, rape-crisis centres, intimate personal care, mammograms, sports as well as any competitions, shortlists etc traditionally open only to women.

Report
Ereshkigalangcleg · 01/02/2022 13:38

so genuinely open to understanding what rights these 'take away' as opposed to extend?

Could you maybe sit down with women's groups who are concerned and discuss it? Maybe our concerns are misplaced and that's all it will take to reassure people!

Report
AngelicInnocent · 01/02/2022 13:37

But the nuts and bolts are being avoided. Either side stepped by the politicians or disallowed by the hosts.

Report
Please create an account

To comment on this thread you need to create a Mumsnet account.