Wench...?

[Dummycrusher]

What are people's opinions on a woman calling a woman a 'wench' as an insult?

It really doesn't sit well with me but I wondered how other people feel about it.

[KimikosNightmare]

@RoseslnTheHospital

@Vursayles except that the person using it was trying to be insulting towards the consultant that was trying to push an unwanted c section. So she obviously thought it was an insult.

Yes the person who said it is rude and thick.

[KimikosNightmare]

@Dummycrusher

@Vursayles I wasn't looking for something to be offended by. I found it uncomfortable that a female doctor was referred to using a word that marks her as subordinate to men, and particularly uncomfortable that it was a woman saying it in a group which is supposed to be pro women's rights. Hence I came onto a feminism page to explore others' feelings towards this word and have learned about its usage. You have the benefit of your knowledge of black country dialect, but remember that others may not!

It's got nothing to do with Black Country dialect. The person who called the doctor "a wench" is clearly as thick as mince. There's nothing inately insulting about the word.

[bigbootyjulie]

I suppose it depends on the speaker's dialect e.g. the Black Country example. Where I'm from, people would say "doll" as a alternative word for woman/girl, without meaning any derogatory connotation. But I'm guessing in this context wench was used as a more "polite" alternative to saying bitch.

[Dummycrusher]

@Vursayles I wasn't looking for something to be offended by. I found it uncomfortable that a female doctor was referred to using a word that marks her as subordinate to men, and particularly uncomfortable that it was a woman saying it in a group which is supposed to be pro women's rights. Hence I came onto a feminism page to explore others' feelings towards this word and have learned about its usage. You have the benefit of your knowledge of black country dialect, but remember that others may not!

[deydododatdodontdeydo]

@Antarcticant

Believe it or not, I've heard it used affectionately, as a term of endearment, where I live, up north. Not keen on it myself but it's no worse than any other inherently misogynist insult.

Me too. I've heard boyfriends use it to their girlfriends in an affectionate way, I've heard serving wench used in a non-derogatory way, but nevertherless it can mean prostitute too.

[RoseslnTheHospital]

@Vursayles except that the person using it was trying to be insulting towards the consultant that was trying to push an unwanted c section. So she obviously thought it was an insult.

[Vursayles]

It’s Black Country dialect meaning woman or girl. It’s in no way derogatory and shouldn’t be take as such. The BC dialect has some fascinating words and phrases with great historical richness behind it. I don’t see the point of looking for things to be offended by, isn’t life too short?

[KimikosNightmare]

Thou hast committed— Fornication? : but that was in another country; And besides, the wench is dead.“

is the famous quote from Christopher Marlowe's play The Jew of Malta

The quote is used as the title for an episode of Morse and one of the Morse novels.

The line is also used in a poem by T.S Eliot.

The person who made the insult is either fantastically well read (the point about the unnamed "wench" in The Jew of Malta is not that she was a fornicator but that she was of no concern) or more likely thinks it means something completely different.

[PeekAtYou]

I've read on here that is is friendly like the word lass or hun in some areas up north.

[BlankTimes]

Serving Wench, barmaid or waitress in a tavern, where the clientele arrived on horseback.

I don't think the pregnant woman's use of 'wench' to the consultant is correct. Agree with @KimikosNightmare's quote.

[Discovereads]

wench just means a young female servant. It didn’t mean prostitute. But in the past socially superior men did force themselves on female servants so they were sexually accessible although they were never paid like a prostitute would be.

[JanglyBeads]

Yes, famously used in Anita and Me set in the Black Country.

[Papergirl1968]

It's just an old fashioned term for a woman here in the Midlands, used by older people. My late DF would occasionally use it to refer to my sisters and me, e.g. "I told your mom that we ought to have you wenches round on New Year's Day." Or "I saw a young wench slip on the ice. She did go a sender."
I know he wasn't meaning it in a derogotory way.

[KimikosNightmare]

@Dummycrusher

Context was a pregnant woman on a group geared towards women's rights in pregnancy/birth referring to the female consultant as a 'wench' for trying to pressure her into have a c-section.

To quote Inigo Montoya

"You Keep Using That Word, I Do Not Think It Means What You Think It Means"

Wench makes no sense in this context.

[KimikosNightmare]

It doesn't mean prostitute. It's a servant or lower class person. Or a busty wench in a Carry On film. Very odd choice of word.

[Dummycrusher]

@RoseslnTheHospital , i think you've put your finger on it there with 'only used for women in a subordinate position'. Thanks for putting into words what was bothering me about it.

[RoseslnTheHospital]

Name calling over a disagreement is never going to go well, and reaching for a name that's only used for women in a subordinate position is always going to be problematic. It's also an odd choice of insult for someone with a position of authority over you.

[Antarcticant]

Believe it or not, I've heard it used affectionately, as a term of endearment, where I live, up north. Not keen on it myself but it's no worse than any other inherently misogynist insult.

[Dummycrusher]

Context was a pregnant woman on a group geared towards women's rights in pregnancy/birth referring to the female consultant as a 'wench' for trying to pressure her into have a c-section.

[Mandodari]

Depends on the context. Doubt many of the usual neanderthals insulting women would use it.

[Basilbrushgotfat]

Yep it's an old word that used to mean prostitute but was also used to refer to young women and girls, by a social superior. So I wouldn't say it ever had a flattering meaning, unless used in an endearing fashion (possible).

Context today is everything, but I'd err on not using it and probably wouldn't appreciate it being said to me!

[deydododatdodontdeydo]

Well it's an archaic term for prostitute isn't it?
If a woman is calling another woman it as an insult, it's similar to calling her a whore.
I don't think it's meant to sit well, it's meant to be an insult.