To think there isn’t a way of getting kids to listen to you without yelling your head off

[stressedoutandoverwhelmed]

Fully expecting to be told I’m totally unreasonable here but I have not found one if one exists

I have read the books

the book you wish your parents had read
how to talk so little kids will listen

I am sure there is another I can’t remember

and none of the techniques work.

is this just life now? It’s depressing and miserable if so. I’m starting to think that that’s just parenting though.

Christ almighty OP. Go and see your GP instead of this pity party. You’ve created a thread solely to bitch about your kids, disregard everyone who offers advice, and now you’re just lashing out at responses to a thread you created.

Yes, we have constant corrections but it really is constant. I told ds to get down off the table six times yesterday. Bearing in mind he was only sat at the table for the duration of his dinner - that’s a lot. I don’t know what it is or why it’s so hard not to climb on the table but apparently it is.

I did actually pluck up the courage to see myGP a few weeks ago. I’m afraid he couldn’t have been less interested, made vague noises about medication probably not being right and then gave me details of therapy which I can’t access as it’s on during the day when I have a child with me.

Whether you intend to or not you are telling me you are perfect, you have a perfectly behaved child who you deal with correctly. I feel it’s probably best we don’t respond to one another again as neither of us are helping the other or if we’re honest being particularly pleasant to each other.

Actually the stuff you're now sharing sounds beyond normal 5yo stuff. Added to your attempts to use consequences and them not working, there's more going on here.

Have school raised any questions about behaviour or possible ND?

Does your school have an employee assistance programme? Or can you contact Occupational health?

OP, I'm guessing that you teach teenagers, little ones are very different to deal with.
You sound to be at the end of your tether, please do get an urgent appointment with GP, tomorrow. You need help and your GP will be able to help.

Two things. First, you sound depressed and like you have dreadful negative self talk. Stop that immediately. Be nicer to yourself.

Second the NOTHING WILL WORK about the kids. That's not true. You can say it. It still isn't true.

What you are doing is what works in the moment to control behaviour. Controlling children is a small part of our job. The largest part is raising effective adults. Shouting does none of that job. You attempting to say nothing works to assuage your guilt about shouting. It won't work. Consistent boundaries work in the long term. You suffer in the short term. So so much!

No, I don’t think he’s ND but has got a lot of energy and we also seem to have hit a tricky spot for behaviour. We are rubbing one another up the wrong way a lot of late. Hard to say how much of this is an age thing and how much is just me being at a low ebb.

Thanks all. As you may have gathered I posted at an extremely low point tonight. Life has been a bit tricky of late.

No you’re not being particularly pleasant. My child is not perfect otherwise I wouldn’t have had to work on my parenting to get where we are now, and continue to have to implement to same strategies and adjust them all the time. That’s parenting. It’s hard work and relentless. Every time you feel you’ve got it sorted in one phase, a few months pass and they’re in another phase. But you have to actually do something about it, not just throw in the towel and say “nothing works, my children are awful, I just have to shout at them all the time”, then start a thread dismissing anyone who offers their advice. No one offering advice on this thread is saying they or their children are perfect.

If you don’t like what your GP said, talk to another.

@stressedoutandoverwhelmed I see you. You are me 20 years ago. I used to call him the toddler sized tornado, he didn't care about any consequences and didn't listen to anything I said. NOTHING worked. He was my fourth child and if he'd been the first he'd have been the last.

Turns out he has ADHD.

@MrsTerryPratchett thank you. I do find unfortunately that sometimes - not always, I am not permanently bellowing my head off at the kids (although you’d be forgiven for thinking that on the basis of this thread) but this evening I did lose my temper and shout. And sometimes I do. It does work, where positive parenting and consequences and so on do not. I suspect largely because there are two of them and they bounce off and feed one another looking to one another for approval rather than me.

I really think it’s best we don’t respond to one another @Losttreasure . I’ll just leave this here that I’m an excellent parent to one child. Most people are.

Or the HV or get referred to Early Help - if any services near you offers VIPP-SD as an intervention, it's a really robust evidence based tool for positive parenting.

I also agree with a PP that some of the things you described seem extreme - a 5 year old should understand that you don't just "tear into" any old things you find like parcels etc.

Op sorry you’ve had a tough phase. It is really challenging when different ages and phases collide in young children.

only immediate advice is to try and buy yourself space and time to decompress (partner/family support/hobby). And find mantras that work. Mine was ‘it is not soft play in here’ eleven zillion times on sofas that I didn’t want them to jump on.

Thanks. I’m not seeking early help or anything like that at the moment but thank you.

Thanks @Thinkingfrog . I know different people have different tolerance levels but I hate leaping and climbing on furniture; just do, and it isn’t safe.

All I'd say op is - stick at it but don't give up on the goal of obedience.

I know what you want. You don't want to get down and negotiate cheerfully about his feelings. You want your instruction obeyed.

It does get better but its a long game & requires relentless consistency until they realise (at an older age) that what you've instructed will happen regardless of their feelings about it/dislike of it/boredom of it and that its quicker to get on and do it

Takes til they are about 8 but it pays off. My eldest (9) does as he's told now. Youngest is better than she was but still pushes it

I get that.

Dinner in our house has become a game of “what can I pick up and threaten to throw that you’ll tell me to put down.” Over, and over, and over. If we don’t react the first time, he picks up something bigger, or breakable.

I can’t speak for your kids, but in our house it’s plain old attention seeking, he’s looking for a rise and then if/when he gets one, it just makes him do it more. Last week I stood guard at the dining room door for an hour repeatedly saying “put it down” and walking him back to his seat. Repeatedly.

It’s wearing, and the constant “drip drip” of behaviour that escalates/doesn’t seem to have an end, gets really difficult to not lose your shit with.

Thanks. I have one that’s pretty compliant tbf. Sometimes will push her luck a bit ‘don’t want to go to bed’ but if I do the ‘firm voice’ will cede 9/10 times. And one who is rather more challenging shall we say. It’s a bad combo as compliant child will copy non compliant child.

Eg - say "get off the table please".

If he doesn't do it, go physically lift him off and repeat "no climbing on the table".

Short phrases. Don't negotiate. Just stop him, over and over until it sinks in. If you are on sticker charts etc hes presumably quite young. It takes til they are older for the instructions to completely prevent the behaviour.

It’s wearing, and the constant “drip drip” of behaviour that escalates/doesn’t seem to have an end, gets really difficult to not lose your shit with. Thank you. This is largely what I’m struggling with. It’s not an unreasonable thing to ask - that you don’t climb on furniture - it’s just become a battleground and I hate it.

Oh of course it works in the short term. Very effectively. That's the problem!

I hope things look up.

How old? If under 4, honestly, get a high chair or booster seat with secure straps.

Say loudly "I told you not to climb on the table and you did it anyway so you have to be strapped in."

It's hard. It's just hard. Especially with 2. When I had one child I was patience personified. Managed to get dc1 doing everything by talking or turning it into a game as suggested in how to talk so little kids listen. When dc2 came along I neither had the time nor the patience nor the energy. Some times I still can't believe I have become a shouty parent. I wish I knew how some parents get their child to behave with just a particular tone or a look.

I know you are not asking for advice but genuinely for me the only thing that works consistently is using consequences. For the younger one it is taking away cartoons for a day and for the older one it's books. They prefer that to shouting. Dc1 told me. I think it's a rubbish strategy. I genuinely dread the day when there is nothing anymore I can hold over them or they just defy me. What do you then?

Another thing that helps op and (yes I know you haven't asked for help) is to just make life easier. Try to reduce things or events that stress you. Try to give yourself and your kids more time to do the basics (and to have fun together) Sometimes making my life easier means not saying no unless I have a very good reason. Why does your ds need to get off the table? Mine climbs on the table at all the time. I only ask him not to when there is food on the table. At home. Not outside.

Funnily enough I don't remember a single time my parents shouted at me. They also didn't say no often. I still didn't misbehave massively I think and I've turned out all right.

@ToffeeCrabApple I am reluctant to go down the physically lifting him off as I know ds and that would turn it into a great game. It is a brief and somewhat curt instruction ‘off the table.’ When repeated three times with varying levels of annoyance he usually does get down. Then climbs up again thirty seconds later.

It does wear you down and it is making me quite depressed. Not the climbing but the constant constant ignoring of what I’ve asked.

Is it being tolerated somewhere else? Grandma's house, nursery, childminder? Everytime they do it remove them from the furniture.

It sounds like they need more time outdoors/at the park. Can you get age appropriate climbing frame for the garden if you have one. This helped with my climber. Channel the behaviour to an appropriate setting.