To think that my contributions to our family home count for anything?

[Greenlife1]

I know that I have few rights as per current legislation but am I being unreasonable to think I have earned a segment of our next family home (I'm talking in terms of ethical principles not legality)

Living with partner of 15 years and our 4 children. He is buying a house outright which will be paid for by selling the house we have lived in for 10 years and is also owned by him. I have worked and contributed to running the household for 15 years and have, of course, sacrificed career progression to support my family and his career, not to mention, I have also grafted on the current house, helping to increase its value and spent small amounts of money on it when I have been able to.

Partner thinks I'm ludicrous to even have these thoughts as I've not put in any big amounts of money. I had hoped I might be able to aim for a small mortgage on our next home that I could pay off myself to give me some security and to just feel like I have a place in the world that I have earned but he wants to own it outright.

Marriage not on cards right now for various reasons.

[Elreychalino]

You don't have to be married tbf just much harder to get enforce cohabiting property rights if you're not

[rwalker]

The title was very misleading
should be my partner got given a house nether of us saved or paid for it
I’ve lived rent and mortgage free for 15 years
I think he should give my half of the house he was gifted

[NewMoney1000000]

I don’t think you are being U but I do think you’ve messed up.

[AcrossthePond55]

I chortled at 'she just needs to marry him'. As if it's that easy, assuming he's the one with the 'no marriage' stance.

Right or wrong, I can see why he may not feel marriage is in his best interests. If his family 'bought him a house' (as OP indicated earlier) that sounds to me as if there is a possibility of other 'family money things' (inheritance, money gifts) down the line. This man can protect & provide for his children's financial future without jeopardizing his own, and hopefully he has done so. If OP has been repeatedly suggesting that her name go on the deeds (rightly or wrongly), perhaps he worries that she is more interested in the house than in him.

And TBH there are probably just as many good reasons for a woman NOT to marry. OP sounds as if she is well-paid. And perhaps there's 'family money' in the future for her, too, or the ability to create her own 'family money' for her DC that she'll want to keep as separate. She already feels that her Partner doesn't pull his weight in 'family duties' and apparently also feels he is unfair financially. She may feel the relationship is already on shaky ground. Why would she want to entangle herself legally with him even more than she's already entangled.

I know it all sounds a bit mercenary. But I think people are wise to look out for their own financial security. My DC are grown and gone, DH and I are retired and have joint finances and a 30+year marriage. But IF I should ever become single again I would NEVER remarry and never cohabit. What is mine will remain mine, for my DC. I don't care if this imaginary man is Bill Gates or Bill the Rag Picker.

[RoseAndRose]

@Imthedamnfoolwhoshothim

In the UK both parties need to consent to marriage...so she can want it all she likes. If he says no it's not going to happen

I was wondering if marriage is a definite ‘no’ because OP is already planning a split

[BubbleDoubleTrouble3]

What good qualities does your partner have ?

Why stay ?

[Imthedamnfoolwhoshothim]

@ilyx

No she isn’t. She needs to marry him. And if divorcing the courts would take into account how long they cohabitated, not just how long they’ve been married for.

In the UK both parties need to consent to marriage...so she can want it all she likes. If he says no it's not going to happen

[Fenella123]

I take it you are not in Scotland, OP? (As cohabitants do have limited rights there).

[ilyx]

@Summerhasbeenandgone

Legally you are fucked op.

No she isn’t. She needs to marry him. And if divorcing the courts would take into account how long they cohabitated, not just how long they’ve been married for.

[Lb482]

@Greenlife1 So a week on what’s the update?

have you written down or calculated all the pros/cons for both of you from this situation so you can have an objective conversation

e.g. saved on costs of living but lost the opportunity to gain equity in a property (as house prices have doubled). You have had valuable time being a mother and enjoying that but saved the family probably £100k on childcare. His career has progressed (?) but yours has not (find an old colleague at same level and show where they are now).

can you negotiate a % ownership of a new house eg if he puts all his equity as deposit then you buy a bigger house with your mortgage?

the advantage of not being married is you can buy a B2L house in your name without paying second home stamp duty, would he perhaps contribute towards a deposit for that, based on above?

have you both got wills and life insurance to support the other and your children in the event of anything happening?

will he now let you prioritise your career instead?

how has your career being on hold impacted your pension too? Is his pension registered with you as the beneficiary as if you are not married it won’t go to you if something happens to him.

[Ric36puddin]

At any point in the past, now or in the future

You had or have the opportunity to walk away, earn money & buy your own property

You don't need a man

He has quite clearly told you
No marriage
No joint property

[Elreychalino]

Haven't read the thread (16 pages) and def not in anyway a lawyer but I had heard of something along the lines of some cases where you might be entitled to something. Could be completely wrong of course but I vaguely recall this being the general direction. www.lawteacher.net/free-law-essays/property-trusts/difference-between-common-intention-constructive-trusts-and-proprietary-estoppels-property-law-essay.php#:~:text=Proprietary%20estoppels%20usually%20can%20be,a%20resident%20in%20the%20property.

[Imthedamnfoolwhoshothim]

If you separate with you having a claim then it's drama. If you separate without the claim then there's a bit less red tape .

With divorce rates what they are I'd be wanting to future proof my families money.

[Banana2079]

Maybe stop trying to grab his house
you don’t own it nor have you paid toward mortgage for the first house
you paying a small amount toward new one then expecting your name on it Is ridiculous
it doesn’t matter how long you lived there rent free looking after kids you chose to do that and u could Have negotiated 50-50 but you didn’t
When my partner moved in with me I charged him rent
Ridiculous to expect your name on the house just because you have brought children up there for 15 years
You don’t even want to marry each other for various reasons you say . My guess is you are worried or one of you is worried Yeah there is going to leave hence why you want portion of his house and why he doesn’t want to put your name on the house. And I know you don’t like the word his but yes it is HIS

[Greenlife1]

@Banana2079 yes, have been working. That's been mentioned once or twice 🙄

[Octomore]

What's the reason for you having no savings/deposit? You've been working, and you don't pay any rent. Even as low earners you should be able to accrue some savings, which you could put towards your own investments.

[Legoisaws8om]

I would refuse to pay anything then towards the monthly mortgage if he is claiming you have no rights. All other bills in theory shared. I've heard stories (albeit not sure if right) that people can claim part of house if they have paid towards the mortgage for a long time. Tbh you'd be better marrying then divorcing to take 50% back and then get your own place.

[Octomore]

@neverbeenskiing

YANBU I think but also, and I don't mean this is a nasty way at all, OP..I'm not sure it matters? Morally, ethically you might be spot on but if you have no legal rights to your home then it's irrelevant isn't it? The moral high ground won't help you in the event that you separate.

This.

Yes, morally your partner should acknowledge your contribution, and is an arsehole for not doing so.

But he isn't, is he? That's your problem - your partner is an arsehole. And he has the law on his side.

Tbh, i dont understand why this conversation hasn't happened before. Why did you give up your career and put all your energies into him without a conversation about where that would leave you financially?

[Turnthatoff]

I think it’s fucking outrageous OP and am on your side. But legally, you’re in a bind.

[ReneBumsWombats]

at the moment I am not interested in being anyone's wife for financial reasons. No thanks!

Strange, given the question you're asking us, but if that's how you feel, then there's your answer. If you don't want a legal financial tie, you'll have to rely on his goodwill.

Wouldn't want your relationship.

[Olsi109]

@Greenlife1

@Banana2079 Ignorant much?
I'm a front line worker.
I have financially contributed.
I was asking people's opinions on whether they think this situation in this day and age is unreasonable. You obviously think that it is unreasonable, fair enough.
I, however, do not need or want 'his' house. What I do want is the opportunity to be added to the house for a percentage reflective of what I will be paying.
Sheesh...Get a grip ladies!

If there will be a mortgage on the new house and you will be contributing to that then yes fair enough you should be entitled to a % back should it be sold and you can get a contract drawn up for this but it sounds like it could be messy with how petulant your OH is. If he doesn't agree then the simplest way is to just remove any mortgage from the "joint bills" and he pays that solely by himself on top of his equal share of the rest of the bills and childcare. Tbh I would personally go for that (well I'd actually leave someone like him tbh if he expected me to pay with no legal right to any recompense) but each to their own - this would be the next most sensible thing and just invest in property yourself.

[SexTrainGlue]

“What I do want is the opportunity to be added to the house for a percentage reflective of what I will be paying”

well, you do have that opportunity, and the person who is denying you it is your DP

[AcrossthePond55]

He owns the property outright via family money

"Family money" as in HIS family bought the house and gifted it to him or he purchased it with an inheritance? In which case neither of you has personally contributed to the purchase of the house as there was never a mortgage.

Or by 'family money' do you mean your combined household income was used to qualify for a mortgage but your name wasn't put on the paperwork and deeds? I don't even know how that could happen.

If the first, then you have never contributed to the 'ownership' of house itself, only the normal running costs and upkeep. As has he. The fact that you did more childcare, etc etc means nothing. That was a decision you made. You could have demanded 50/50 for household responsibilities, but you didn't.

If the second, and your income was included in getting the mortgage, then you should have insisted your name go on all the papers and deeds. If you didn't, that's on you, too.

The above is on the 'current' house. So no, I don't think you deserve an ownership interest in that house.

As far as going forward and the 'new' house, you will be living in the house and you should pay for your share of the monthly household running costs. But if there is going to be a mortgage on the new house, no I don't think you should pay towards that since you will derive no benefit from that house if it should be sold. If he wants you to pay a certain amount that he will then use towards HIS mortgage, then I'd insist on some percentage of ownership. It shouldn't be 50/50 since he'll presumably have the money from the 'old' house to put towards the 'new' house, but based on what your actual contribution would amount to.

If you will not be on the 'new' house papers and you want to stop paying for repairs, home insurance, or improvements that only benefit HIS home ownership, I'd say that's fair since you don't stand to benefit from repairs or improvements when/if the house is sold, either. And perhaps its time to insist on a fairer split of household duties to allow you to earn more so you can start saving for your own place or at least have a 'safety net' fund in case your relationship goes tits up.

Of course, if you tell him you aren't going to pay towards the mortgage, he could decide to start charging you rent.

[Banana2079]

Also if your relationship is stable then why are you worrying about your name on the house ? and again if your relationship is stable why would you want your name on his house or either of you planning on leaving?

[Banana2079]

What are you being a frontline worker got to do with anything? As much as you don’t like it it is his house. If you are going to be paying toward the mortgage On the next House Then you should discuss with him whether you should be living there or not as what that payment is -is rent , Unless he wants to add you to the house. If he does not want To add you to the house even though you’ll be paying towards the mortgage then I wouldn’t be living there as what you are doing his pain in rent and as the mother of his four children you shouldn’t be paying rent

If you are not going to be paying anything towards the new house then you really can’t expect for your name to be put on it if you have not contributed to it financially . You could have gotten a job And he could’ve stayed at home however your arrangement was that he went to work whilst you raise the children that doesn’t mean he has to give you share of the house unfortunately. However as I said if you are going to be paying towards a new mortgage and of course your name should be on that. If you want to split a Court would not give you half anyway as u would have only contributed a small amount