To think that DD's teacher was a bit harsh this morning?

[sunflowervalley]

Just got back from taking DD to school.
She is in reception and has just started back on Monday where she is now doing full days until 3pm.

She is still having issues with using the school's toilets so for the time being she is taking pull ups into school with her but is reluctant for anyone to change her at lunchtime.

This morning her teacher had a word with me in front of DD and said she would'nt let anyone take her to the toilet yesterday and was she ok when she got home.
I said yes she was fine.

She then proceeded to say we need to get her to use the toilet so will take her today and show her around the cloakroom but admited most of the children don't like the cloakrooms so she would take her to another toilet.
DD got very anxious at that point and was looking worried and the teacher said
"come on E.... ,we will try it today"
to which DD replied "no" quite firmly.

Then suddenly the teacher grabbed DD's hand and started pulling her into class saying you can come in on your own today without mummy as you have just been very rude.
DD was really upset and tried to pull away and she was pulling her the other way.

I insisted on taking her in to vcalm her down and the teacher followed us telling another TA on the way
"E.... has just been very rude"

I managed to get her into class but she was very teary.

I am so annoyed that the teacher dealt with this this way as DD has been happy to go back to school the last couple of days after the holidays which can be difficult but has been full of herself after school and really enjoying it.
I just hope this teacher has'nt worried her now and she will be reluctant to go to school tomorrow.

After I took her in I saw the teacher again on the way out and she said
"Oh she's gone in has she,what a little madam"

Am I being unreasonable?

DD is 4 and still finding her feet at school and feel that this could have been handled better.
I did'nt appreiciate the madam comment or her dragging her into class ethier.

Maybe it's just me feeling hormonal but thought I would see what others thought.

[Kimi]

I remember our primary school toilets were outside, so were cold, damp and had massive spiders in, also the boys and girls were next to each other and kids used to climb up and look over the wall at you.

Shudder just thinking about it

[ladylush]

I'm not surprised tbh as some primary school toilets look a bit like dungeons. I used to be scared by the toilets - they looked so sinister with their vast bowls and chains looming overhead. I think kids often find toilets a scary place.

[sunflowervalley]

I think it is an anxiety issue as she will use the toilet at home and can stay dry but also her brother has SN and has toileting issues so we think it could be something to do with the fact that she sees her brother has issues with toilets at school.

I am planning to go into school and take her into the toilets and make it more familar and not a frightning place to be also looking to work with the school to impliment a sticker reward chart.

The lady from family solutions said that she deals with a lot of anxiety around toilet phobia in schools and is not uncommon.

[tulip27]

I would never let anyone treat my child in that way, no wonder your child is not ahppy there. I would be looking for another school and making a formal complaint. Is up to you as her advocate to protect her from people like that. What view will she have of you if you do nothing.

[Quattrocento]

Lots of good advice on here - just mildly worrying that a 4 yo struggling to stay dry during the day. Is it worth seeing a doctor?

[sunflowervalley]

Well the family solutions lady that has been helping my DS brought up the incident with DD yesterday and I explained to the head what had happened.

The headmistress said in reply about DD's teacher,
"I don't know what she was thinking or if she was thinking at all"

Which pretty well sums it up.

She said she would have a word.
The family solutions lady suggested an approach that did'nt cause DD any anxiety over the issue.

The headmistress said that DD is very strong willed,which she can be.
But when I mentioned the fact that the teacher had called DD "a madam" I explained that I was not happy and that she may be strong willed and a madam as they put it but it is up to us as parents to say something like that not the teacher!!!!

[StripeyKnickersSpottySocks]

She should have understood the reason why your dd said no. Fair enough if she wanted to say something lie "now x, you really shouldn't say no to me".

But she should not have called her rude, or dragged her, or called her a madam. Is there another reception that you can as for your dd to be moved to? I would certainly want to complain about this teacher, but also worried that she would then take things out on your dd. She shouldn't, but she sounds a right witch.

This needs nipping in the bud before your dd starts hating school because of the teacher. The first year is so important.

[clam]

What happened at the meeting with the Head Teacher?

[Reallytired]

The toileting issue is really hard. Prehaps you need to make an appointment with the school's special needs coordinator to set up an individual education plan. They could also look at ways of helping your little girl overcome seperation anxiety.

Your daughter needs professional help if she is not toilet trained, for her sake. You and the school need to plan how best to help her.
It might be worth discussing it with your GP.

My son had professional help to help him learn how to walk. Having problems using the toilet deserves equal sympathy.

[sunflowervalley]

Kimi,can't believe that,you would think they would be encouraging him.

[Kimi]

Some teachers just should not teach some age groups.
Hope your DD will be ok tomorrow, and you get to air this with the head.

DS1 in year 7 was told to re-do a piece of school work as he had done it in a too advanced manner WTF

[sunflowervalley]

When I picked DD up she seemed ok and I told her that I would take her to the toilets and make her feel comfortable about it.

I assured her that I will be there tomorrow when she hangs her coat up as she looked worried when I was talking to her about this morning.

The teacher said that she had settled the rest of the day and was fine.

Still going to mention it tomorrow though as not happy with her dragging her in and calling her a madam.

[Wisteria]

She shouldn't be working with this age group by the sounds of it as she clearly does not have the skills necessary.

I would go directly to the head; do not pass go, do not collect £200 etc and make a formal complaint.

Is there a different class which she can join or can she change schools?

Do agree that the toileting issue needs attention but not in the way that her form teacher is handling it.

I would consider talking privately to the TA as well and see what she thinks.

[lucyellensmum]

what a bitch, nasty cow - you are her mother, how DARE she undermine you like that. Blimey, i want to punch her for you!

[NAB3wishesfor2008]

How was your DD?

[sunflowervalley]

Thanks everyone,am feeling a lot more confident reading all your replies and good advice.

Will see how it goes when I pick up DD and how she has been this afternoon.

[onebatmother]

Brilliant sunflower. family support person sounds fab, and it'll all be much easier with her in the meeting I htink.

V well done.

[ladylush]

I think this is an awful approach to take with a 4 yr old who is just settling in to school. You do not sound over protective at all imo. In your shoes, I would speak to the teacher first and be pretty frank in my expression (sounds like she doesn't choose her words carefully so no point in beating around the bush)and depending on her response would also consider talking to the head about it. If she is contrite and can see your point of view along with giving assurances for future interactions with your daughter, I would not go to the head (but monitor situation). Any other reaction and I would go to the head to complain. I also feel that she should apologise to your dd.

[ThreeBluecubs]

No you are not being unreasonable. I'm afraid in the mood I am in this morning, I would have been knocking on the head's door. What a stupid stupid thing to do. Has the woman no brains at all?

So you now have a child that has had her very real fear of using the loo at school (which is very common) belittled publicly at the beginning of the new school term when she was feeling vulnerable anyhow - oh and a stressed and angry mother. Marvelous.

What your daughter said was not in the slightest bit rude - she was purely a little girl trying to express her fear about using the loo without her Mum. Take away her ability to do that and the teacher will have a lot bigger issues to deal with.

I hope you manage to sort something out.

[sunflowervalley]

Well I have just spoken to the lady from family support that is working with my DS and ran this by her and she said she certainly would'nt be happy with the way the teacher approached this with DD.
She said it will do nothing for her confidence and does not believe in punishing a child for saying no when she was obvioulsly upset by telling her her mummy can not come in with her today.

She will be with me at the meeting tomorrow for DS and suggested we bring it up at the meeting for the headmistress's attention and suggest a different approach.

[sunflowervalley]

Thanks everyone,feeling a bit better now.

I have a meeting with the head tomorrow re my DS so may approach the subject with DD's teacher first and see what happens.

I don't know how long ahe has been teaching,She is about 30 I would guess but I have always found her quite abrupt.

The head and teachers used to make me feel so intimated but since my sucess with DS have got a bit more confident in dealing with them.
I just get the feeling they have me down as an over protective over emotional mother.

[wooga]

Ah sorry-read up more.

I know how you feel about being a 'PITA' I am having to be one at my ds's school at the moment as he's asd and they aren't meeting his needs-sometimes we're left with no other option.

[wooga]

YANBU and don't be hard on yourself-the teacher's actions were unbelievable.

After reading the other post about your son and other background it makes teacher's behaviour even harder to comprehend.

Have you got any other mums at the school you can talk to?I bet they were just as shocked as you this morning.

Talk to the headteacher-hopefully they are nicer than your dd's teacher.

Has she been teaching for long?.

She sounds horrible-and her attitude is helpful to nobody-will make your dd more anxious.

Good luck.

[helenhismadwife]

sunflower you are not a useless mother at all you sound brilliant to me doing what a mother does worrying about her dc and fighting for them dont be hard on yourself

[helenhismadwife]

my dd (3.5) started school in September thats normal for France. she was also having accidents at home, we sent her in with a spare set of clothes just in case but strangely she has only had one accident, I agree with wannabe about not sending her into school in pull ups. Would it be possible for you to take her into the toilet when you get to school a few times to get her used to going in there?

The teacher doesnt sound at all pleasant it must be incredibly difficult for you can you arrange a meeting with this teacher and the head to discuss your dd needs