To ask for positive stories of ASD children struggling in primary but thriving in secondary?

[DillyDallyDollie]

I am utterly exhausted having to fight for support for my DS10. He has a diagnosis of ASD, anxiety, sensory and speech issues. He is ‘fine in school’ say his teachers.

Support currently offered is based around adjustments for him rather than any practical support. Adjustments made since reception but things are worse in year 6.

His behaviour at home has us at our limits; angry outbursts every day. He is under CAMHS and other therapists for his extreme behaviour.
He hates school.

I’ve spoken to the SENCO in his new secondary and it’s the same offer he currently has; minor adjustments that are going to make little difference to how he copes with school.

Such as offering him a seat at the back of the class, allowing him to leave class earlier, not asking him to read aloud. He has these adjustments now and they just do not work!

The new SENCO believes DS will be fine in school as his attendance in primary has been excellent . (School don’t see the issues I have each morning trying to get him out of the door on time. We have to set our alarms 2.5 hours early before school starts!).

He does not have an EHCP (that’s a whole other thread). I’ve given up and I will just have to hope for the best come September.

Does anyone have experience of a child struggling in primary flourishing in secondary?

[BellaPoldark]

What @Titsywoo said, could have written this word for word about my son

[BellaPoldark]

My ds struggled socially and behavioural in primary and was like a different child in secondary, the school actually said that they didn't recognise the description from the Senco at the primary school in the handover between schools. I think he thrived with the more interesting lessons/timetable structure etc. It's tough in primary if you don't have a class teacher that gets you and your additional needs...the primary never handled him well though , so it might be different if they are experiencing a really difficult time in primary despite the school having made all the necessary adjustments etc?

[Omgnamechange]

Ok thanks, thats the difficulty- I cannot see over the other side and so far nothing but grief.

[Titsywoo]

Yes DS hated primary school and it was a struggle for him (and me) in many ways. He had no friends and was bullied for the first 5 years until he found another boy with ASD and they are still friends now. He has had a really good time at secondary. A good group of friends, hasn't needed much help from the SEND team, enjoys some of the subjects and loves chatting to the teachers. I've been so surprised at how confident and social he has become even in such a large school with a lot of loud kids!

[MySunshineMyOnlySunshine]

I also would not keep to-ing and fro-ing. Get the final and appeal

[10brokengreenbottles]

It the long run it is worth it. Keep going. Cut your losses, appeal and ensure section F is specific and quantified. Then if the provision isn't provided you can enforce it.

[Omgnamechange]

@10brokengreenbottles yes we aren’t getting far. What Ive seen so far, how they operate makes me question whether its worth it really, our views have not been listened too.

[10brokengreenbottles]

Omgnamechange if the LA are pissing about and you aren't getting anywhere, push them to finalise ASAP and go to tribunal rather than going back and forth with an EHCP not worth the paper it is written on. Sometimes the LA only take note when you submit to SENDIST and they realise parents are serious.

[HelplessProcrastinator]

My DD is now in year 8. She doesn't do the coke bottle thing and explodes straight away if demands get too much. I've had years of 'that's unusual for a girl with ASD'. She got an EHCP in year 5 as she was very challenging, largely due to the school doing what they decided worked for an child for ASD and not what as parents knew worked for her. She was permanently excluded in the same year and had to got to a SEMH school as there is no 'high functioning' (awful term) ASD school. We fought to get her back into mainstream for year 7 as that was what she wanted.

Secondary has been amazing. She has an ECHP that includes TA time and does lots of her homework at school. The SENCO is amazing. She actually listens to us and has read up on PDA and shared with all of DD's teachers even though DD doesn't have a PDA diagnosis, all on our suggestion. DD doesn't do French as she needed to drop something and does her homework when everyone else is in French lessons. She has found her little tribe of anime nerds and actually thrives with the very strict regime at her school because she sees it as totally fair and applied the same to everyone. Moving every hour means if things are going badly it's not long until the bell goes and she can start afresh. I never thought she could do so well at school after the total disaster that was primary. It's taken a lot of fighting from us as parents and good luck at finding a SENCO who gets it. I suppose she was 'lucky' that she was so challenging in primary and hit rock bottom so her needs were well documented by the time she started in year 7.

[Omgnamechange]

Oh and you HAVE to be that parent - no other way Im afraid.

[Omgnamechange]

@DillyDallyDollie, definitely apply asap! I started April last year- still in draft! Primary school didn’t support/ couldn’t see a need. Just did it anyway. LA refused to assess twice and refused mediation, only threat of tribunal and MP involvement got things going. Even then still not close to what is needed. Please check out not fine in school website and PDA society website. If you wait till secondary you will easily lose another year and if they know you are applying they can still look at accommodations. Good luck.

[ipredictariot5]

My year 9 son with adhd and ASD was excluded from mainstream primary and spent it in an inclusion unit. He is now in an academically selective school and thriving emotionally and academically. The SENCO, an EHCP where every aspect of our sons routine needs and dislikes were planned for by the minute and being persistent and patient and positive as a parent to get the right support in place made the difference. The biggest bit of advice I could give you is you know your child best so don’t give up until he has the best.
And being academically on target or not is irrelevant - my son is v v bright but emotionally and behaviourally was a couple of years behind his peers in primary
Good luck it’s not easy

[Phineyj]

I am aghast that the secondary is saying they won't adjust homework before they've even met your son. We have an 8 year old with ASD and ADHD and after seeing what she was like in lockdown, we have started to treat homework as optional rather than fight and scream over it. Although the school is heavily academic (probably a poor choice on our part, but that's another story), they've been fine, because they understand her difficulties.

I would keep speaking positively about homework clubs though - those work for us a bit (we also had some success with an after school nanny, but I guess yours is a bit old for that sort of approach).

In year 2, before DD was diagnosed, I did a survey of the other parents and found around a third were having major battles over homework.

The UK is crazed over homework especially at primary and I say that as a teacher. It probably has more value from say year 8 up.

[DillyDallyDollie]

@10brokengreenbottles

I’ve PM’d you. If you don’t mind sharing what kind of things you’ve requested in an EHCP. My DS is socially and emotionally delayed.

[10brokengreenbottles]

Sink your second paragraph isn't quite true. Despite the SENCOP and CAFA stating what they do case law shows "Achieving the best possible educational and other outcomes" is not a statutory duty. See top of pg6 here and this IPSEA page.

[10brokengreenbottles]

Don't delay, if you have to appeal, as so many parents, sometimes more than once, the process could easily be 18months/2years.

If you apply now, and don't have to appeal at least once, the 20 weeks takes you to the end of September.

I have 2 DC with EHCPs who are academically able but socially and emotionally delayed. One with ASD and the other with complex MH problems. So many LAs and schools perpetuate the myth that you have to be behind academically.

[SinkGirl]

Having made progress is not a lawful reason to refuse an assessment. The legal tests are whether the child may have SEN and may need provision in accordance with an EHCP.

A child who is capable of achieving highly may only be achieving moderately because of their disability - one of the underpinning principles of the SEN Code of Practice is helping each child to achieve “the best possible educational outcomes”.

[DillyDallyDollie]

@10brokengreenbottles very helpful

DS is behind socially and emotionally; it’s the only target he is not expected to meet. He was exceeding in infants but is now meeting targets in juniors.

[DillyDallyDollie]

@Soontobe60 Thank you for your input I’m not sure I would like to wait any longer as I know how long the process takes. By the time DS would be assessed, it should be clear in secondary if he is coping or not. I’ve used the model letter on the IPSEA website to apply.

[10brokengreenbottles]

Sometimes you have to be that parent. Children are whose parents know what the LA should be doing, can navigate the system and hold the LA to account get better support. It shouldn't be that way, but it is.

Case law shows when deciding whether to undertake a needs assessment the LA should take in to account the upcoming transition to secondary and what DS' needs there will be. Delaying applying for an EHCNA delays DS getting the provision he needs.

Academic progress is not the only kind of progress considered. You do not need to be behind academically to get an EHCP. Social and emotional development are just as important. The fact home life is so difficult shows DS has unmet needs at school. The school just aren't seeing them or recognising them for what they are.

[MySunshineMyOnlySunshine]

@Soontobe60 there is no need to send a form. The ipsea model letter will do. I also wouldn't wait until secondary. The bar for assessment is MAY have sen and MAY need provision via a plan. It is a really low bar.

For a senco your advice is miles off.

[Soontobe60]

Senco here.
In order to request a needs assessment as a parent, just contact the SEN team at the LA and they will send out the relevant paperwork - don’t just send in lots of evidence unless you’ve already got the correct form off them. Once they receive your paperwork, they will contact the school and ask for this evidence to support a needs assessment. Initially, this will include his academic progress - if he has made expected progress from Y2 to Y6 this will hinder the process as it could be argued that he has made progress with the support the school have been able to put in place so far.
My advice to you, bearing in mind that your son only has a further 10 or so weeks at primary school, is to wait until he has completed a term at secondary school. Work with their Senco to ensure they put a robust APDR plan in place and record his progress against targets - these need to be based around his attendance, homework, wearing of uniform, ability to communicate in class etc - ie the issues that you are anxious will be challenging to him. You, and the school, will then have clear evidence of the actions they have put in place and how he has progressed against the actions, which will support a needs assessment more than currently where his primary school are stating that there isn’t an issue in school.
As others have suggested, contact external agencies for their advice. It would also be beneficial to contact the agency who diagnosed him in the first place.

[stillplayswithtoys]

Ignore the school advice. You are the expert on your child and you see what happens at home. It's very common for children to mask at school and let it out at home so school never see the full picture.

My daughter's school says she didn't need an EHCP and refused to support one. It was tougher without their support but I got her an EHCP and she's now got a place in a special school

[DillyDallyDollie]

The responses here have been very helpful. DH took the baby, the pre schooler and the dogs out for a very long walk this morning to allow me to gather all of my evidence.

I’ve got all of the paperwork bundled up and ready to post first thing tomorrow to apply for an assessment for him.

I think his school will think I’m being rather dramatic in applying against their advice but reading how strong some of posters have fought on here, I don’t care if I’m that parent anymore.

Although I did speak to DS earlier and he said he doesn’t want me to tell his secondary about his issues and he says he will be fine .

This is one of those moments where I need to override my child for his best interests isn’t it?

[Omgnamechange]

@DillyDallyDollie so end of year 6 unable to attend school at all. Health went down. Tried preparing for year 7 with online tools. Plans for phased transition. Despite more than 20 attempts to go to school he never spent more than hour the 3 times he made it into the building.