Page 20 | Lesbian Visibility Week

(1000 Posts)
Shizuku Tue 27-Apr-21 11:40:50

Shout out to my fellow lesbians on this important week!

I will be wearing my lesbian pride badge right next to my trans pride badge for the whole week in all public spaces.

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Erkrie Thu 29-Apr-21 20:16:49

Actually I said that it was inappropriate because calling yourself a widow when someone hasn't died sounds incredibly insensitive. I know there are other's who do the same thing which I still think is gross. Imagine if anyone else did that to others?

Stop appropriating widowhood for your own gains. That is incredibly offensive.

Ereshkigalangcleg Thu 29-Apr-21 20:17:14

given that I don't exclude trans women or cis women who have been at some point attracted to a trans woman

Looks like that's quite a small group, so "many more" is probably a bit of an exaggeration.

https://www.them.us/story/cis-trans-dating

Virtually all heterosexuals excluded trans folks from their dating pool: *only 1.8% of straight women and 3.3% of straight men chose a trans person of either binary gender*^. But most non-heterosexuals weren’t down for dating a trans person either, with^ *only 11.5% of gay men and 29% of lesbians being trans-inclusive in their dating preferences.*

29% of lesbians? Ok, that's not "most lesbians" as claimed, but a decent show I guess? But then...

Surprisingly, among the 127 participants open to dating a trans person, *almost half selected a trans person of a gender incongruent with their stated sexual orientation*^. For example, 50% of the trans-inclusive straight women and 28% of the trans-inclusive gay men were willing to date a trans woman, even though one wouldn’t expect either straight women or gay men to be attracted to women.^ *Similarly, 50% of trans-inclusive straight men and 69% of trans-inclusive lesbians said they’d date a trans man, even though both groups are presumably only attracted to women*^. And^ *33% of the trans-inclusive bisexual/queer participants said they would only date a trans person of one gender but not the other*^, even though one may expect this group to be attracted to multiple genders.^

shock

Shizuku Thu 29-Apr-21 20:17:24

Whythesadface

A lesbian just wants to be allowed to own the fact that same sex relationships are their thing. Which does not include a body that has been male at any point in time.
It doesn't matter how upset a Transwoman feels about being excluded, it is just physical impossible .
There is no way to ever change this fact.

You know that there are loads of cis lesbians who include trans women in their dating pool, right? Or are you erasing those ones?

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GreyhoundG1rl Thu 29-Apr-21 20:17:57

What exactly is a trans lesbian? Is it a male bodied person who's attracted to women? Isn't that just a man?

Angelica789 Thu 29-Apr-21 20:17:58

trans lesbians and their cis partners.

Yeah these lesbian transwomen NEVER have a transwoman partner do they? They don’t themselves recognise transwomen as women when they’re looking for a sexual partner. It’s only the other type of lesbian that should do that.

yourhairiswinterfire Thu 29-Apr-21 20:18:03

Oh yes, when, on a previous thread, I said that I didn't like the phrase 'deadname' I was pretty much told my opinion was irrelevant

''Rules for thee, but not for me'', innit.

Erkrie Thu 29-Apr-21 20:18:14

Of course - because a trans women who disagrees with you must be a bad person. That sounds like transphobia to me

Seems to me everything sounds transpohobic to you unless you're in agreement with it. Must be hard living like that.

Shizuku Thu 29-Apr-21 20:18:55

Angelica789

*trans lesbians and their cis partners.*

Yeah these lesbian transwomen NEVER have a transwoman partner do they? They don’t themselves recognise transwomen as women when they’re looking for a sexual partner. It’s only the other type of lesbian that should do that.

What on earth are you talking about - loads of trans women date other trans women.

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TheWeeDonkey Thu 29-Apr-21 20:19:32

bitheby

I'm amazed that this thread is still here. It's incredibly offensive.

Oh its been reported on numerous occasions, unfortunately MN agrees with some of the posters here that female sexuality is debatable and the only thing lesbians are missing is some cock. Apparently this is "progress"

Erkrie Thu 29-Apr-21 20:19:52

You know that there are loads of cis lesbians who include trans women in their dating pool, right? Or are you erasing those ones?

I would say that technically they are not lesbians either. Doesn't meet the definition. Lesbian: same sex attracted. Not same gender attracted.

GreyhoundG1rl Thu 29-Apr-21 20:19:54

loads of trans women date other trans women
Do you mean gay men?

Sophoclesthefox Thu 29-Apr-21 20:25:56

Denying material reality seems to be some kind of gateway drug, leading to wilder and wilder straying into the realms of incomprehensibility and wilful lack of comprehension.

It’s the weirdest thing.

Ereshkigalangcleg Thu 29-Apr-21 20:26:14

What on earth are you talking about - loads of trans women date other trans women.

Well I think yes the majority of people willing to date trans people in the study I quoted were other trans people. Or people wanting to date a trans person who the study authors felt was "gender incongruent" to the participant's presumed sexuality but in fact totally in line with their actual sexual orientation.

Whythesadface Thu 29-Apr-21 20:26:46

Dress it up how you will. But a lesbian is someone who is having sex with a woman.
A woman having sex with a Transwoman is not having sex with a woman. What they are doing is having sex with some who was a male, may still have a penis and present as a female, or be with a male who transitioned to a body that has been surgically altered to look like a female. However that body is still not a female inside medically, because that is physically impossible.

Ereshkigalangcleg Thu 29-Apr-21 20:27:38

You know that there are loads of cis lesbians who include trans women in their dating pool, right? Or are you erasing those ones?

Study says not even a third and many of them will only include FTM trans people, so, no.

FrankensteinIsTheMonster Thu 29-Apr-21 20:27:56

Inclusivity is destructive as well as creative. When you make a decision about what criteria to apply for membership of a category, that's a creative process — you've created a category of thing. When you change the criteria, you destroy that category and create a new one with the same name. Sometimes that's good, sometimes it's bad, sometimes it's neither. But when you expand inclusion criteria you destroy the original category. Exclusivity is normal and human and often desirable.

Shizuku Thu 29-Apr-21 20:28:00

So, returning to the theme of the thread, this is a shout out to all my fellow lesbians on lesbian visibility week, including the ones who happen to be trans and their partners.

To answer pretty much all the other points - some people consider trans women to be women. If you don't, that's fine - you do you. If you do, and you also happen to be a lesbian, I hope you have a good lesbian visibility week.

If you all think that makes me an evil, goady, narcissistic, homophobic, pernicious (I think someone said pernicious), colonising, appropriator and abuser of women, I think it probably says more about you than it does about me.

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Erkrie Thu 29-Apr-21 20:28:34

Seems that lesbians are waking up to this though. Have you seen the lesbians speak up on this position op on London pride? There's an awful lot of lesbians speaking. And it seems to me that their truth is not in line with what you seem to want.

m.facebook.com/PrideinLondon/photos/a.593863833973207/6390371984322334/?type=3&source=57

Ereshkigalangcleg Thu 29-Apr-21 20:28:52

Similarly, 50% of trans-inclusive straight men and 69% of trans-inclusive lesbians said they’d date a trans man, even though both groups are presumably only attracted to women.

Blibbyblobby Thu 29-Apr-21 20:29:00

They even march with us these days

“They?” But I thought you are trans, lesbian and a woman. Other trans people, lesbians and women are surely just “us” from your POV. Who exactly do you mean by “they?” Who is it you are not the same as?

(Damn those leaky abstractions!)

justawoman Thu 29-Apr-21 20:29:45

Ah, playing the victim and claiming you just want everyone to be nice to one another. A tactic feminists have never seen before, to be sure.

Shizuku Thu 29-Apr-21 20:30:13

Blibbyblobby

*They even march with us these days*

“They?” But I thought you are trans, lesbian and a woman. Other trans people, lesbians and women are surely just “us” from your POV. Who exactly do you mean by “they?” Who is it you are not the same as?

(Damn those leaky abstractions!)

Cis lesbians.

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Ereshkigalangcleg Thu 29-Apr-21 20:30:23

So, returning to the theme of the thread

We're all posting on the theme of the thread. Do keep up! smile

Just keeping things light hearted.

BernardBlackMissesLangCleg Thu 29-Apr-21 20:32:01

I'm amazed that this thread is still here. It's incredibly offensive

to be fair, I suspect MNHQ may be finding the OP on the tiring side. I expected my little limerick to go poof almost instantaneously but it hasn't yet.

it's distasteful watching a male declare themselves to be a lesbian in lesbian visibility week, heaven knows. But I guess free speech cuts both ways

the OP gets the opportunity to come here and make a homophobic show of themselves, and we get to draw attention to it

Shizuku Thu 29-Apr-21 20:32:15

justawoman

Ah, playing the victim and claiming you just want everyone to be nice to one another. A tactic feminists have never seen before, to be sure.

Don't be too hard on all the people here who are victims of my horrendously abusive posts.

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