Help Stella Creasy make misogyny a hate crime

(58 Posts)
thinkingaboutLangCleg Wed 03-Feb-21 17:32:56

From Stella Creasy MP today:

I am emailing you as someone who has expressed an interest in my campaigning surrounding women's rights. Since the Upskirting Bill in 2018 I have been campaigning to make misogyny a hate crime. After some promising initial recommendations from the Law Commission's report into hate crime our campaign has recently taken another exciting leap forward.

Today in the House of Lords, Peers will be debating our amendment to require all police forces to record when a crime is motivated by misogyny. We need your help to raise awareness of this and encourage members of the House of Lords to support this proposal and this message tells you how to do that.

This amendment to the Domestic Abuse Bill has been tabled by Lord Russell who is a cross bench peer, and it has support from members across the House of Lords. If there is a lot of interest in this proposal at this stage in the legislation, then we will be able to have a vote to include it in the Bill itself and make it become law. And that's where you come in.

Please use your social media to tell the world this debate is happening and encourage members of the House of Lords to take part and listen. Below are some suggested tweets you can send - and you can find a list of Members of the House of Lords who are active on twitter here.
lordsdigitalchamber.co.uk/twitter/?page=2

'Today members of the House of Lords have the power to help victims of Domestic Abuse and empower police investigations by making misogyny a hate crime! #MisogynyHateCrime'

'Today the campaign to make misogyny a hate crime to help tackle domestic abuse comes to the House of Lords - follow Clause 70 of the Domestic Abuse Bill to find out more'

'Member of the House of Lords? Want to tackle domestic abuse? Please join today's debate on Clause 70 of the Domestic Abuse Bill to find out why making misogyny a hate crime can help! '

'Do you think victims of domestic abuse deserve better support? Do you want to see misogyny recognised under hate crime law? Do you want every police force to follow best practice? Watch tonight as the House of Lords has the opportunity to do all of that. #MisogynyHateCrime'

If you know of anyone else that would like to receive these emails, please do direct them to sign up to our mailing list here:
working4walthamstow.co.uk/make-misogyny-history-campaign

OP’s posts: |
OhHolyJesus Wed 03-Feb-21 17:35:54

Stella Creasy? Really?

I'm sure we've been here before...

thinkingaboutLangCleg Wed 03-Feb-21 17:36:40

This is happening right now, but I think it will still be worth tweeting members of the House of Lords to support this after today.

OP’s posts: |
teawamutu Wed 03-Feb-21 17:46:59

Stella doesn't know what a woman is. Or at least pretends she doesn't. So not sure what use it'd be even if she succeeded.

bigkidsdidit Wed 03-Feb-21 17:49:20

Don’t throw the baby out with the bath water. This is still worth supporting - if there should be hate crimes misogyny should be one of them

teawamutu Wed 03-Feb-21 17:50:54

bigkidsdidit

Don’t throw the baby out with the bath water. This is still worth supporting - if there should be hate crimes misogyny should be one of them

Oh, I know really.

Just feeling a bit grumpy and despondent today.

BabyItsAWildWorld Wed 03-Feb-21 17:56:05

I don't want misogyny to be a crime.

I think most of the hate crime legislation is questionable.

I want people's behaviour to be judged as criminal not guessing or presuming what was in their head when they did it - often even subconsciously apparently.

Also I don't wants transphobia to be a crime. I want abuse of transpeople to be a crime.

I don't think it would make any difference to crimes against women and I think it's dangerous for the law to try to read people's souls.

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BabyItsAWildWorld Wed 03-Feb-21 17:57:46

In fact I just want abuse and violence towards people to be a crime.

MaMaLa321 Wed 03-Feb-21 18:03:17

The whole concept of Hate Crime is deeply flawed.
I don't want anything to do with it.

Barracker Wed 03-Feb-21 18:03:51

Who else suspects that misogyny will end up being used as a weapon to prosecute a woman (gynae) for hatred of a man (no gynae, no miso-gyny)?

How does she define misogyny?

VegetableLove Wed 03-Feb-21 18:03:51

I also think if the person pushing the legislation intends that it can be used for 'self identifying women' then that's got unintended consequences that that person clearly can't see. So that's a no from me.

Floisme Wed 03-Feb-21 18:04:08

I'm not a fan of criminalising thoughts. And the argument that it's happening already so we might as well extend it further does not enthuse me either.

PheasantPlucker1 Wed 03-Feb-21 18:08:16

My immediate thought was what Barracker has already said.

Ive spoken to Stella Creasy a few times. Shes the type to piss on your leg and tell you its raining.

OhHolyJesus Wed 03-Feb-21 18:13:24

It wasn't long ago that SC was pushing this on Twitter and deleting anyone who mentioned biology, boundaries, privacy and how this affects their daughters.

It did not go well for SC and if this passes it won't go well for women. We'll all end up in court for not using preferred pronouns.

I'm with Barracker, Mama and Floisme.

Terriblewithmoney Wed 03-Feb-21 18:14:04

Ah cross post with Barracker

Fallingirl Wed 03-Feb-21 18:17:44

BabyItsAWildWorld

I don't want misogyny to be a crime.

I think most of the hate crime legislation is questionable.

I want people's behaviour to be judged as criminal not guessing or presuming what was in their head when they did it - often even subconsciously apparently.

Also I don't wants transphobia to be a crime. I want abuse of transpeople to be a crime.

I don't think it would make any difference to crimes against women and I think it's dangerous for the law to try to read people's souls.

This is the issue.

As I understand it, the reasoning for the concept of “hate crimes” to exist in the first place, is to allow the police to keep track of groups harbouring hateful attitudes towards others based on some characteristic.

Misogyny would then include considering women lesser, and misogynist hate crimes should include considering women’s particular woman related concerns less important than issues affecting men.

In that case, if you consider it possible for someone to hatefully see women as less-than, the concept of “c*s privilege” is rendered misogynist.

The entire collective of all police forces are guilty of treating women as less vulnerable if they have vaginas than if they have dicks, and allowing a dick holder to intimately search non-dick holders if they are deemed by the police to have a shared, gendered soul essence, is misogynist.

For misogyny as a hate crime to work in practice, the police would have to start by policing itself. Which they aren’t going to do.

Barracker Wed 03-Feb-21 18:32:49

I have a caveat and shall now argue with myself:

I am opposed to hate crime in its entirety. However, for as long as it exists as a legal concept, women need to be under it for protection. My thoughts are that should misogyny become a hate crime strand, (even if this is a potential weapon that might be used by bad players against women) it ALSO may function as a halter upon the 'hate speech/hate incidents' of men (all varieties) against women. And there are more women to report hate crimes against us than there are men prepared to tell us what bitches and terfs we are.

My ultimate hope is that the flawed system of hate crime is dismantled. But so long as it stands, it is a weapon in the hands of men whilst women are disarmed.

Just thinking out loud.

MichelleofzeResistance Wed 03-Feb-21 18:50:41

I'm afraid I agree, as seems evidenced with the scots group looking into this and their collective bias/conflict of interest - someone somewhere has decided to get onto the concept of misogyny and own it and bury it quick, before female people get to use it as a means to stand up to what is being done to female people's rights under law in the UK.

So yes: it will be a committee that defines very carefully what misogyny is, much in the way that words like 'kindness' and 'woman' are subject to politically forced redefinition:

It will ensure that it is male centric and gynephobic in its bias and remit

and it will mostly serve to silence and punish female people from questioning, protesting or resisting the agendas of males.

I used to think I was cynical, but frankly at this point there's nothing left I could invent that would be more cynical than what's happening in the SNP and everywhere else.

highame Wed 03-Feb-21 18:50:54

Stella was in talks with Stonewall not long ago and the impression was that her definition included TWAW

MichelleofzeResistance Wed 03-Feb-21 19:15:49

her definition included TWAW

Yeah, I'm done with that phrase having any meaning in terms of the problem for female people.

What I want to know is does Creasey admit that biological females are a thing, and equal in her interests and representation with that she gives to biological males.

MichelleofzeResistance Wed 03-Feb-21 19:18:37

Sorry, that sounded ruder than I meant; that wasn't aimed at you highame

Somewhat fed up and tired of everything constantly being termed regarding the real humans. Less bothered what Creasey wants to call male people than whether she's gynephobic.

DragonBlu Wed 03-Feb-21 19:20:50

When I read about this before the specific wording was that it was only if the misogyny came from men, so I assume all the misogyny, hate and violent/sexual threats on Twitter and elsewhere from some transwomen/transwomen activists towards women would not be included.

DragonBlu Wed 03-Feb-21 19:22:09

Or from "non-binaries" and any other "gender"?

UppityPuppity Wed 03-Feb-21 20:03:49

Agree with pps who question the definition of misogyny and how it WILL be abused to attack women and women’s speech.

Don’t trust her or Labour as there is a certain type of ‘woman’ that they prioritise and consider worthy of protection, and it isn’t the adult human female kind.

How vocal has SC about the misogynistic abuse Rosie Duffield had been victim of?...?

Get rid of all hate crime, get rid of the thought police and investigate and prosecute crimes properly.

thinkingaboutLangCleg Wed 03-Feb-21 21:48:23

I agree with those who have mixed feelings about 'hate crime', for a number of reasons. Last year, I hesitated before filling in the Law Commission consultation on hate crime laws. But I did it in the end because, given that hate crime laws exist, it's inexcusable that they don't protect women.

I tend to support Stella Creasey because she's an excellent constituency MP. Too bad about the TWAW nonsense -- I think she is toeing the party line for pragmatic reasons.

OP’s posts: |

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