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GIDS granted permission to appeal

(93 Posts)
TheFleegleHasLanded Mon 18-Jan-21 15:25:17

twitter.com/BenInLDN/status/1351184741828067330?s=20

OP’s posts: |
ArabellaScott Mon 18-Jan-21 15:28:01

sad

Marley20 Mon 18-Jan-21 15:34:39

We'll this is good news really. If they're prevented from appealing the TRAs will just claim a conspiracy to deny vulnerable kids life saving medicine. Letting them once again publicly show this treatment is experimental with no real basis in science is no bad thing.

eurochick Mon 18-Jan-21 15:35:41

This is not surprising - it's an issue of public importance. I wouldn't read too much into it.

highame Mon 18-Jan-21 15:37:44

I wonder what the grounds were? Anyone know?

Manderleyagain Mon 18-Jan-21 16:22:20

Yes agree - in an ideal world it would be left as it is, but in this less than ideal world it's good that they are being allowed to appeal (on balance), even though it means more work and fundraising. I really hope there is some good quality research into outcomes for these children coming through the pipe line - so that decisions aren't made based on unknowns.
I hope something is published about the grounds for appeal.
Has good law project managed to muscle in on this?

TiredAndGrumpy85 Mon 18-Jan-21 16:23:07

This refers to the grounds of appeal that were submitted to the High Court:

onedrive.live.com/?authkey=%21ALFXLLZwM6geKgo&cid=D54BC006B96DEE00&id=D54BC006B96DEE00%2113142&parId=D54BC006B96DEE00%215967&o=OneUp

MichelleofzeResistance Mon 18-Jan-21 16:23:16

Good. This is too important to do anything but go through it with a toothcomb and take the whole way.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine Mon 18-Jan-21 16:23:25

I tend to think this is a good thing - more sunlight?

bellinisurge Mon 18-Jan-21 16:26:51

Get their limp arguments out in public for the world to see.
It would be interesting to see if it gets noticed in Biden's USA. He and Kamala Harris have made such a big deal about following the science. Let's see how that stands up against some of the troubling woo nonsense that's in their camp.

TiredAndGrumpy85 Mon 18-Jan-21 16:27:13

Also the Court of Appeal can be a bit variable but the Supreme Court have been quite sensible of trans issues so far (see C v SSWP) if it eventually makes it that far.

Al1langdownthecleghole Mon 18-Jan-21 16:28:50

Oh, is more digging needed?

I’m sure the sunshine will help grow things nicely.

OvaHere Mon 18-Jan-21 16:35:29

Not unexpected really. Anything this serious will usually go up as far as it can go.

The onus is on GIDs to prove it's a safe pathway, does no harm and produce sound data to back that up.

highame Mon 18-Jan-21 16:40:08

They have since produced their long overdue report, and that really helped the case hmm

GivesNoFox Mon 18-Jan-21 16:41:45

A trans acquaintance on my social media was reporting this decision with a sad slant in regards to the date of the appeal (March 2022) and how horrible it was to leave 'trans youth' without medication (read: sterilization drugs) for over a year. hmm

yourhairiswinterfire Mon 18-Jan-21 16:43:25

What happens if they lose this one? Can they appeal again, or is it over for them?

If they win, can Keira appeal? (or will she not be involved in this one?)

Imnobody4 Mon 18-Jan-21 16:45:22

It's not till Mar 2022! I'm not sure I can stand this, it must be hard for Keira to have this hanging over her.
Maybe the Hilary Cass review will be finished before this comes to court.

ArabellaScott Mon 18-Jan-21 16:46:23

People on Twitter are saying that the NHS didn't have to suspend all medication/treatment, they had the option to keep going as was current until the result of the appeal was known, but have chosen to stop using puberty blockers - does anyone know if that's true?

OvaHere Mon 18-Jan-21 16:46:33

It says by 2022 so could be sooner. Depends what the backlog is I guess.

yourhairiswinterfire Mon 18-Jan-21 16:49:06

GivesNoFox

A trans acquaintance on my social media was reporting this decision with a sad slant in regards to the date of the appeal (March 2022) and how horrible it was to leave 'trans youth' without medication (read: sterilization drugs) for over a year. hmm

There's already a few under the tweet in the OP, saying they're doing it deliberately to kill kids, that so many kids will have killed themselves by then, the court obviously hate trans people etc.

They're allowed to continue using PBs until the appeal, but apparently GIDS have chosen not to? I think that tells us everything we need to know about the validity of the suicide claims...

Revolting people.

WootMoggie Mon 18-Jan-21 17:01:35

It’s worth noting that it is not stating that a date has been set FOR March 2022 - it’s that the hearing will take place BY March 2022.

Which I read as meaning it could happen before then.

Imnobody4 Mon 18-Jan-21 17:02:06

According to Alison Bailey, the High Court judgement stands until overturned by the Supreme Court.

'It’s worth remembering that the grant of leave to appeal does not change the judgement of the court.

The rule of law will and should run its course. In the meantime, all any of us can do is to follow the law as it stands.

Don’t trust anyone that suggests otherwise.'

Soontobe60 Mon 18-Jan-21 17:09:11

ArabellaScott

People on Twitter are saying that the NHS didn't have to suspend all medication/treatment, they had the option to keep going as was current until the result of the appeal was known, but have chosen to stop using puberty blockers - does anyone know if that's true?

I don’t know about the legality of it, but imagine if they continued to prescribe and lose the appeal? Surely that would open them up to all sorts of allegations and lawsuits!

Datun Mon 18-Jan-21 17:24:36

Personally, I don't see how a child of 13 can understand permanent sterility and a lack of a sex life anymore by March 2022, than they do now.

And the Cass inquiry and the Sonia Appleby safeguarding questions all need to take place. Which will both, presumably, shed even more light on the entire issue.

I'll be very interested to see what kind of criteria is going to be used to justify circumventing safeguarding, and explaining how minors can understand adult sterility and and future sex life curtailment.

And by very interested, I mean can't wait. Their track record leads me to believe it's going to be a masterclass in self sabotage.

Let's have it.

CharlieParley Mon 18-Jan-21 17:45:03

ArabellaScott

People on Twitter are saying that the NHS didn't have to suspend all medication/treatment, they had the option to keep going as was current until the result of the appeal was known, but have chosen to stop using puberty blockers - does anyone know if that's true?

No they did not have to suspend all medication. They had the option of asking the court for permission for every single patient under 16 and for every patient under 18 if they weren't 100% certain the kids could give informed consent. What the ruling means is that the child cannot give informed consent. Where this is the case, and where there is an issue with the parents giving consent, you can always appeal to the court to decide on behalf of the child.

However, as it is highly unlikely, after this ruling by the Court of Protection, that this same Court of Protection would then allow children to be sterilised/experimented upon, this is of course a pointless, costly, embarrassing and time consuming exercise the Tavistock has rightly refused to embark upon.

So, the Court ruling applies and the NHS has to suspend all medication for under 16s unless the Court of Appeal rules against the Court of Protection judges.

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