James O'Brien 'How not to be Wrong'

(89 Posts)
notassigned Fri 25-Dec-20 09:23:16

Includes a chapter on trans. The very first page includes the assumption that women like us don't want trans-identifying people to have the same rights as every other human.

I certainly believe that trans people should have all the same rights that I do. I don't believe I have rights to enter sports, prisons, toilets etc designated for the opposite sex.

OP’s posts: |
midgebabe Fri 25-Dec-20 09:29:01

Women want trans people to have all human rights

And extra trans specific rights because they need them

Happy also for transmen to retain their sex based women's rights ( they don't have to avail themselves of them)

Not happy if transwomen who are biologically male want to claim female sex based rights

ARoombaOfOnesOwn Fri 25-Dec-20 09:32:27

Also surely it’s transgender and woke people who have a very binary view of gender, otherwise why would people need to transition?

ErrolTheDragon Fri 25-Dec-20 09:33:44

Well put, midge.

testing987654321 Fri 25-Dec-20 10:12:52

It's frustratingly having to constantly defend ourselves against things we never said. Of course trans humans should have all human rights, being human and all.

And what midgebabe said.

EdgeOfACoin Fri 25-Dec-20 10:13:38

He doesn't have a clue.

He thinks he's really clever on the subject of Brexit as well. He isn't. (And I say that as someone who voted Remain.)

It's a shame - for some reason I thought he would take the time to look at the issues. I was wrong...

CrossPurposes Fri 25-Dec-20 10:33:53

We have a binary view of sex but that's also biology. The conflation of sex and gender isn't helping any of us, is it?


NonnyMouse1337 Fri 25-Dec-20 10:43:44

There's nothing progressive or clever about evolutionary denialism, which is what denial of the two sexes actually is.

Trans people deserve human rights like anyone else, and fortunately in the UK, they do have them.

Floisme Fri 25-Dec-20 10:47:13

What midge said. Not that O'Brien will be listening - he doesn't seem to know the difference between a conversation and a competition.

MealyPotatoes Fri 25-Dec-20 10:47:59

Oh great... I just bought this for my partner for Christmas and we already disagree on this subject. He’s totally a woke bloke. This is only going to solidify his views.

Hollybutnoivy Fri 25-Dec-20 10:49:42

I certainly believe that trans people should have all the same rights that I do.
Me too. In fact I think most of us could comfortably put ourselves into his first group - but he doesn't want to see that.

BeepBoopBop Fri 25-Dec-20 10:54:53

He is an ex-show biz journo who thinks his lucky break is to do with talent. Breathtakingly arrogant, listening to his his constant over-speaking, point-scoring and belittling is like being in an abusive relationship. He is just a hectoring, smart arse bully, probably sporting a micro-penis.

nothereoften Fri 25-Dec-20 11:01:52

@midgebabe has put it across very well

ChristmasBubble Fri 25-Dec-20 11:22:43

He's an arrogant arse and none of what he's written represents my view.

Mollyollydolly Fri 25-Dec-20 11:27:25

Cannot stand him. Arrogant, privileged, snide arsehole, not half as clever as he thinks he is. Won't listen to him, so patronising. He epitomises for me the type of person who caused Brexit - and I was a remainer. Listening to him would make me vote leave (if that makes sense).

Kaliorphic Fri 25-Dec-20 11:33:11

He hasn't got a clue. All he likes is the sound of his own motor mouth. Critical thinking skills? Not O'Brian's strongest point. I cannot stand him.

Cuntysnark Fri 25-Dec-20 11:34:10

We have a very special and astonishingly rude name for him. The only bit we leave in is the O’. He’s utterly vile.

ClaireP20 Fri 25-Dec-20 11:34:47

Oh what a surprise!! A middle class, white, left leaning man is telling women what is acceptable and what isn't. I am so glad we have people like him to show us the error of our ways and to help police our thoughts.

Does he mention men with functioning penises being allowed access to women's prisons at all, just stating they are women?

ErrolTheDragon Fri 25-Dec-20 11:37:19

Does 'how not to be wrong' include 'don't be that man who tries to tell women how they should think and behave without any real understanding of their issues'?

wonderstuff Fri 25-Dec-20 11:51:00

I quite like JOB, bought the book for DH last year, not read it myself.

I think that white MC men need to understand the limitations to their understanding of marginalised groups, a few male comics are advocating for trans rights against evil feminists too. I think there's deep irony that they feel they are standing up for an oppressed group when actually they are just more closely connected to the experience of trans women than biological women, they've failed to grasp an understanding of women's lived experiences and dismissed them in favour of men in women face and actually feel they are feminists.

I wonder why he and others don't stop to consider why women would have an issue with accepting that men are women? Especially when left wing philanthropists like JKR are being so vocal.

Such arrogance.

I do think outside the media bubble more people get it. I don't know anyone in real life who thinks self-ID should happen.

AnyOldPrion Fri 25-Dec-20 13:41:39

It continues to amaze me that everyone who argues against the gender critical position invariably misunderstands it. Guess it must feel the same on the other side of the equation because it all revolves around whether you consider men are women or not. If you believe they are, you’re on one side. So JOB here thinks we want to deny men the same rights women have, and sees that as unfair as he thinks they are women.

An honest appraisal of our position is that we believe men cannot change sex and therefore think that giving mens rights to women is fundamentally wrong.

It follows that we don’t believe that men who claim they are women should have the same rights as women, but that doesn’t mean in any way that we don’t want them to have equal rights.

ErrolTheDragon Fri 25-Dec-20 13:48:28

'Having the same rights' doesn't mean everyone can park in a blue badge space. 'Having the same rights' doesn't mean males can compete in female competitions.

Lampzade Fri 25-Dec-20 13:51:39

James O Brien lacks critical thinking skills.
He’s not as clever as he thinks he is

dyslek Fri 25-Dec-20 13:57:59

Is this the guy who's a DJ?

Im not sure that the opinions of DJs are generally held to carry that much weight.

Lottapianos Fri 25-Dec-20 14:02:12

'He is just a hectoring, smart arse bully, probably sporting a micro-penis.'

Perfect description!

Hes a total plum and as others have said, nowhere near as smart as he thinks he is. He is so wrong on the trans issue. He was VILE to Posie Parker when she phoned his show about the issue of feeling uncomfortable with men in women's changing rooms - actually asked her 'what is it you think I'm going to do to you?'. Let all of his misogyny hang out for everyone to see. Oops hmm

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