Former LibDem MP Lynne Featherstone

[Xanthangum]

I won't link to PN, but Lynne Featherstone has been waving her woke carpet around, including this:

The fear raised by a small but vocal minority of cis women that somehow trans women who self-identify in future under an amended Gender Recognition Act will enable men pretending to be women to get into single-sex spaces to do cis women harm is dangerous, unkind, unreasonable and wrong. Any man pretending to be a woman to do that is a male criminal not a trans woman.

In other words, increased risk for women is a price worth paying.

[highame]

That's why she's a former MP

[JellySlice]

Any man pretending to be a woman to do that is a male criminal not a trans woman

Yes, we know he'd be a male criminal. Unfortunately we wouldn't find that out until after he had committed his crimes.

And until then we're being told we have to welcome males into female spaces and not safeguard them. It's the equivalent of not being allowed to lock your front door until you've been burgled. And even then only against your specific burglar.

[JemimaShore]

She can fuck off with her "cis" - that's misgendering me which is worse than violence.

[Wimbund]

She has form. There are previous threads on her so called "uber feminism".

[JemimaShore]

From memory she's the one who decreed that anyone not in favour of gender neutral toilets was not welcome in the Lib Dems, and certainly not a feminst.

Again, jog on, Lynne. Feminism is for the emancipation of females - and is nothing to do with males who want to identify as women (as in he role that society has constructed that a woman should be).

[IloveJKRowling]

The fear raised by a small but vocal minority of cis women that somehow trans women who self-identify in future under an amended Gender Recognition Act will enable men pretending to be women to get into single-sex spaces to do cis women harm is dangerous, unkind, unreasonable and wrong. Any man pretending to be a woman to do that is a male criminal not a trans woman.

How do we tell the difference between men who are male criminals pretending to be a woman and transwomen before they've committed their crimes, physically and mentally hurting a woman or girl? Are we just accepting that these crimes will happen and women and girls are collateral damage?

Also, who decides what harm is? My pubescent daughter would feel shaken to her core if she saw a male in a space she was changing in believing it to be single sex. I'd say that was harm to her sense of safety, dignity and fairness. It would also harm her ability to participate in public life as - knowing my daughter as I do - she probably would then steer clear of any activity requiring she use facilities that could be unisex (probably especially if they were lying about that unisex status and labelled as single sex).

[nauticant]

Those women who do get assaulted will not doubt feel reassured that the person who assaulted them was not a transwoman but was in fact a male criminal.

Those women who are worried about the possibiilty of assault can likewise be reassured that they're facing assault by the "right" kind of abusers.

[Xanthangum]

Where do they want this to end up? Telling a young girl who is being assaulted in a supermarket toilet that her fear of this enormous hairy man is unkind, unreasonable and wrong?

I get that there are many many genuine, non-predatory trans people out there. There are also many genuine, non-predatory teachers. But it isn't unkind or unreasonable for teachers to be vetted.

How is this so hard?

[IloveJKRowling]

t's the equivalent of not being allowed to lock your front door until you've been burgled. And even then only against your specific burglar.

Yes, this.

The libdems (or former libdems) are simply DESPERATE to throw women and girls under the bus aren't they?

[OliveKitteridgeAgain]

1. Surely it is transphobic to nullify somebody's gender identity. Trans ideology says there is no debate, if you say you are trans, everyone, inlcuding Lynne Feathersone, must accept that without question. That's the point of self ID. Under this ideology, she cannot decide that a man is pretending to be a woman, if he says he is a woman.
   

1. Surely it is transphobic to nullify somebody's gender identity just because they do something you don't agree with; otherwise, all GC feminists should be able to nullify Pip Bunce's identity without debate.
   

1. What if a transwoman who has "lived as a woman", has a GRC certificate etc attacks a woman? The implication is LF's words is that transwomen don't commit violent acts against women. Is she claiming they have an automatic presumption of innocence (quite apart from the usual innocent until proven guilty assumption) that means they will not even be under suspicion and investigated?
   

1. What other criminal acts nullify your trans status, or is it just attacking women? What is a transwoman attacks a man challenging their presence in his daughter's changing room? What about possessing child abuse images?
   

1. Did child abusing priests suddenly stop being priests when they were caught, or did we have to accept that they were in fact priests, just not very nice ones?

[GrimDamnFanjo]

And this is why I left.

[ShinyFootball]

Hold on a minute.

How does Lynn know all the people who object are 'cis' women?

The whole point is you can't assume anyone's gender.

The people concern concerned about this include both sexes and a myriad of gender IDs.

In addition, according to stonewall GNC people come under the 'trans' umbrella.

By definition, anyone questioning this is stepping outside gender role and is therefore trans.

So women who are saying hold on a minute to this, are trans.

Yet strangely. Old fashioned cunty women who don't toe the line have assumption made and are labelled.

Yet another massive logic fail.

[PumbaasCucumbas]

Twaw but they don’t have to go through any physical changes - physically their body can be exactly the same as a man’s?

However much tw like to claim some kind of rebirth and their old self is ‘dead’ (see deadnaming) studies have shown that male pattern violence and offending rates are retained post ‘transition’. So tw are potentially as dangerous as men (who for the most part are also not dangerous to women)

She mentions criminals, but no one needs to have a crb check to use a swimming changing room and the majority of rapists go unpunished, so there is no way of differentiating or keeping criminals out anyway?

Therefore, apart from in the person’s inner self and identity, as far as women are concerned the person is no different in risk to them as a man. There are lots of nice men in the world but I still don’t want to get undressed in front of any of them (except dh at a push).

Why does that make me a bigot?

[Wimbund]

This is part of her previous speech in a House of Lords debate:

'I came to speak in this debate today because I am an uber-feminist. There are some feminists who have brought shame, I think, to the name of feminist by the level of hatred and vitriol that they have levelled at trans women. That is why I am standing here today. How little they understand this community. They should be welcoming and understanding to these new women. ​They should have humanity, kindness and inclusiveness in their souls. This fanatical assault is not feminism, it is false protectionism—mistaken protectionism. So to the faux feminists I say: regain your humanity and understanding. To be trans is challenging enough—with the sort of challenges that you have to go through to work in a world that has traditionally been totally binary and is now coming to grips with the fact that perhaps it is not the way we all thought it was. The attempted suicide rate should be indication enough that this is a community that needs our love and support. I am glad that we are going to try to do better.'

[ThinEndoftheWedge]

Any man pretending to be a woman to do that is a male criminal not a trans woman.

Convenient catch 22. TW by definition can never commit a crime and is not a threat to women and girls.

Hey Lynne - my DDs have never seen any of their uncles naked and they haven’t seen my DDs naked (once past toddlerhood) despite the fact that they pose no threat to my DDs safety.

But some strange bloke who wants access to their changing rooms because they feel like a woman is absolutely OK.

Keep is coming Lynne. You were are one of the key individuals who guided me on my ‘WTAF’ journey from being a Lib Dem member to never voting for you again and finding my home at MN.

[ThinEndoftheWedge]

In my resignation email from the Lib Dem’s - the word ‘penis’ kept coming up (excuse the pun) a few too many times.

Plus they keep emailing and I keep emailing back my penis letter.

[ThinEndoftheWedge]

They should be welcoming and understanding to these new women.

‘New women’ with all that male anatomy and experience.

Ahhhrrrrhgghhh.

You can’t become a women if the ingredients are not there at conception.

[BaronessSlighterThanThou]

She can fuck off with her "cis" - that's misgendering me which is worse than violence..

This, with knobs on.

[Xanthangum]

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that until last year this wasn't a deal breaker for the majority of LibDem (and, equally, Labour and Green Party) voters, or even members.

But high profile people and media coverage since December will have raised this issue to the forefront of many voters' minds, especially women.

How the parties deal with the issue over the next six months - given that we are also bracing for Brexit and reeling from covid-chaos - will signal quite loudly where they are on the capture-ometer.

Conferences will be fascinating.

It shouldn't be too hard to craft a 'care for everyone, respect biology, protect children and vulnerable people, encourage safe spaces' statement. But the activists are so deeply ingrained that the accusations of terf, bigot and transphobe will come rolling out.

The first test will be the position of the leader. The second, whether the party is strong enough to reject the cult. Here's hoping at least one of them acknowledges their mistakes and gives the vast numbers of politically homeless a voice.

*Can't vote Tory, obvs.

But then again, a few years ago I'd never have bought the Times over the Guardian

[WellThankyouAJPTaylor]

somehow trans women who self-identify in future under an amended Gender Recognition Act will enable men pretending to be women to get into single-sex spaces to do cis women harm is dangerous, unkind, unreasonable and wrong. Any man pretending to be a woman to do that is a male criminal not a trans woman.

So first she implies with her sneery "somehow" that this will never happen (implication - hysterical women), and then she immediately says if it does happen, it'll be No True Trans.

So. So. Stupid.

[PumbaasCucumbas]

Maybe the Lib Dem’s have exclusive access to Layla moran’s gendered-soul spirit scanner to tell the difference between a “new woman” and a male criminal, which is why she has no concerns about single sex spaces?

[SunsetBeetch]

From memory she's the one who decreed that anyone not in favour of gender neutral toilets was not welcome in the Lib Dems, and certainly not a feminst.

Yes, that was here. And that was the day I unsubbed from Lib Dem emails and vowed to have nothing further to do with them.

[NewNewt]

A quick flick through twitter shows that lots of people who object to self id are also men (gay men, heterosexual men, trans men, trans women and drag artists among them) - why is it always plain old bog standard women who get the attacks?

Is she actually saying that any male who commits a crime whilst identifying as a woman is actually still a man even though they see themselves as a transwoman? If so, who's the TERF bigot Lynne??

[Xanthangum]

Enter a women's changing room because that is where you are truly at peace with your real self = brave and stunning woman.

Enter a women's changing room to rub your palms down your thighs and drool = disgusting pervy man.

What if it's the same person Lynn?

[SunsetBeetch]

*her. Crap, my typing is shite at the moment