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Scotland's last single sex state school to admit boys

(77 Posts)
scotsheather Sun 01-Dec-19 17:32:17

Not seen a thread on this. Its been rumbling on for years but personally I think it was inevitable. I don't buy the arguments girls are making to keep it single sex but admire them for standing up for what they believe in against the majority. It is an outstanding school but there many equally good or better mixed schools in Glasgow and beyond. Is single sex schooling really needed? Is it really "unfair" on boys in the catchment area?

www.glasgowlive.co.uk/news/glasgow-news/notre-dame-high-school-boys-17329912

scotsheather Sun 01-Dec-19 20:32:11

There is currently no provision in law for a child to be anything other than their birth sex (biological sex) at least until 18. I'm not sure what argument is making schools cave in to that, its crystal clear. No parliament is proposing to bring such provisions for children, but lowering to 16 was suggested here which would affect upper years.

lionheart Sun 01-Dec-19 20:51:17

I did some dire Allsorts training recently Bird and the person running it said in very precise terms you cannot exclude a transgender child from using the bathroom or changing room they choose. 'It is illegal'.

Stonewall Law indeed.

MitziK Sun 01-Dec-19 22:42:13

@SeasonalVag, it's not girls' responsibility to suffer whilst the boys are consistently unfixable, seeing as sexual assault and harassment has been going on for time immemorial - at least single sex schools were an option for some, more so with the grammar system.

SarahTancredi Sun 01-Dec-19 22:50:47

I think it's awful. Everyone knows girls fo better in single sex schools.

I used to be one of those who felt that " girls needed to learn to.live and learn along side boys" now I know the reality is that really what that means is girls need to learn to put up with sexual harassment misogyny and biases. That their sole worth is merely behaviour control and buffer zones. The ease at which people will assign girls to a lifetime of being stereotyped out of subjects and being used for classroom management is disturbing.

Why do girls get thrown under a bus at every opportunity. Why should they suffer and not get good grades just because a boys school likes away is shit.

Fuck off

PuertoVallarta Mon 02-Dec-19 05:52:53

Girls schools seem great, but to be honest they were never accessible to all girls who wanted to attend one, anyway.

MakeMineALargeProsecco Mon 02-Dec-19 07:13:49

I think a lot of posters commenting here don't fully understand the Scottish education system.

Girl's only schooling is only accessible in the private system. State pupils have the option of non-denominational or Catholic school. Schools work by catchment area.

Notre Dame is the only single-sex school left in the country; so it excludes not just boys but takes in non-catchment children who wish a Catholic education.

SarahTancredi Mon 02-Dec-19 07:28:43

Catholic schools dont usually have a catchment area though do they?

You go to your nearest one?

Which is why it surprised me when they built a new secondary school and made it a catholic one cos all the kids are bussed in to the grammas or get in from outside the local.area while the locals struggle for spaces.

Not an idea set up however given school spaces are a problem.that is on going and set to get worse , it seems pretty petty to ruin things for those that get in just because no one else has a chance.

Someone may as well get the benefit.

Birdsfoottrefoil Mon 02-Dec-19 07:31:38

Catchments for catholic schools are different to non-denominational schools; children would be in a (larger) catchment zone for a catholic school and a (smaller) catchment zone for a non-denominational school. Boys and non-catholic girls living in the ND catchment would be in a catchment for a non-denominational school as well. Catholic girls from elsewhere in the city are still ‘in catchment’.

RoyalCorgi Mon 02-Dec-19 07:34:35

Single-sex schools are valuable because girls are at risk of sexual assault in mixed schools.

From a BBC piece:

"In September 2015, a BBC investigation revealed there were 5,500 sexual offences recorded in UK schools between 2011 and 2014."

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-41836303

Aside from that, girls tend to perform better educationally in single-sex schools because they are not being intimidated by boys who tend to take up more of the teachers' attention, talk more in class, shout over girls etc.

stucknoue Mon 02-Dec-19 07:54:18

I had to send my kids out of area because the local school was single sex, no way would I send my girls to such a place, they like "boys" stuff and the extra curricular at the girls school was inappropriate,plus my autistic dd would have struggled immensely - at her mixed school she captained the chess team, there was no chess at the girls school!

FamilyOfAliens Mon 02-Dec-19 08:00:24

I had to send my kids out of area because the local school was single sex, no way would I send my girls to such a place, they like "boys" stuff

What’s “boys’ stuff”?

Birdsfoottrefoil Mon 02-Dec-19 08:09:42

There was no chess club at my friend’s daughter’s girls school. One of the girls (friend’s daughter) set one up. There is now a popular chess club at our local girls school... ...along with coding, electronics, engineering clubs (and others) and unlike the mixed sex schools where these clubs are wholly populated by boys, in the girls school girls get the chance to do them and not feel an outsider in doing so.

SarahTancredi Mon 02-Dec-19 08:11:56

Surely the whole point of a girls school is that they get to do " boys stuff" whatever the f* that is hmm without being told they cant do it or being one of 2 girls in a level physics

If the school isnt suitable or wouldbt fit your child fine but I doubt its cos of its single sex status.
Girls take up far more stem subjects in single sex schools. And they usually dont get stuck.doing netball and hockey while boys do football and rugby.

Birdsfoottrefoil Mon 02-Dec-19 08:22:52

Exactly! In girls’ school there isn’t any ‘boys stuff’ because it is recognised that there is just ‘stuff’ which girls can do to without being told it belongs to boys!

CareOfPunts Mon 02-Dec-19 09:09:50

*Catholic schools dont usually have a catchment area though do they?

You go to your nearest one?*

They do up here in the same way as non denominational schools, it can either be a geographical catchment area or linked to the feeder primary schools

Separately plenty of non Catholic girls go to ND it has a large proportion of Muslim girls for example

CareOfPunts Mon 02-Dec-19 09:14:57

*It seems pretty petty to ruin things for those that get in just because no one else has a chance.

Someone may as well get the benefit*

I agree. OK sending girls to ND doesn’t do a huge amount given the scale of the problem to close the overall attainment gap between more affluent and poor but it does at least help those girls from poor areas who get to go to ND. Now they’ll be stuck with their catchment school even if it’s failing. I think it’s a real shame.

Birdsfoottrefoil Mon 02-Dec-19 15:05:59

Indeed, SeasonalVag didn’t want her sons to go to the poorly performing school; she wanted them to go to the well performing girls school and other people’s girls to go to the poorly performing school instead. Not blaming her; we all want our kids to go to the best school but once again those who pay the price are girls.

XXMansplainShieldActive Mon 02-Dec-19 21:42:15

Girls lose opportunity again. sad

WeDieAndSeeBeautyReign Tue 03-Dec-19 03:32:23

Girl's only schooling is only accessible in the private system
And even there many (the majority?) are co-ed. The very successful private school my son attended is co-ed.
State pupils have the option of non-denominational or Catholic school. Schools work by catchment area

Some state pupils have this option if you are Catholic or willing to compromise your principles. The provision of state Catholic schools is wholly unjustified.

Notre Dame is the only single-sex school left in the country; so it excludes not just boys but takes in non-catchment children who wish a Catholic education

If you want this sort of choice - pay for it.

Why do girls get thrown under a bus at every opportunity - they are not getting thrown under a bus. One school which is an unjustifiable anomaly is being closed.

SonEtLumiere Tue 03-Dec-19 05:40:06

One school which is an unjustifiable anomaly is being closed.

Single sex schooling, especially secondary is very justifiable. That’s what choice means.

MakeMineALargeProsecco Tue 03-Dec-19 07:05:19

@SonEtLumiere - not in the state system in Scotland.

It is the only girl's Catholic school in the whole bloody country!

There are private girls schools if you want to exercise your choice.

Birdsfoottrefoil Tue 03-Dec-19 07:22:25

The very successful private school my son attended is co-ed.

What has that got to do with the price of eggs?

If you want this sort of choice - pay for it

Not everyone is at privileged as you, why should only a select few like you get this choice?

The provision of state Catholic schools is wholly unjustified

Why? Why should there only be the option of attending Protestant schools?

MakeMineALargeProsecco Tue 03-Dec-19 07:29:32

@Birdsfoottrefoil - Scottish children go to either a non-denominational or Catholic school within catchment. So Catholics & Protestants are educated separately, dating back hundreds of years.

This fuels the Sectarianism we have in the West of Scotland & no longer sits in line with our increasingly secular society, or takes account of a multi faiths.

I'd like to see faith/religion taken out of education completely.

CareOfPunts Tue 03-Dec-19 07:45:54

Catholic schools take non Catholic children.

CareOfPunts Tue 03-Dec-19 07:47:51

And some people can’t afford to pay for it. So only people with money get a choice in the education system while the rest if they are not lucky enough to be able to afford to live in a “naice” area with a good school have to put up with any old rubbish?

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