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"Schools told all lessons for five-year-olds should include gay and trans themes"

(123 Posts)
Igneococcus Sun 01-Dec-19 07:43:53

"Voluntary" guidance from Stonewall:

JustTurtlesAllTheWayDown Sun 01-Dec-19 09:28:40

I'm quite happy to have children learning that same sex relationships exist and are normal (and having both L&G family members mine already knows that)but absolutely object to five year olds being taught that what makes you a boy or girl is the sexual stereotype you most align to.

Babdoc Sun 01-Dec-19 09:29:58

It smacks to me of indoctrination worthy of the Jesuits: “Give me the child til he is seven, and I will give you the man”.
This ideology is so dangerous and potentially damaging to gay or autistic children, who will be pushed onto a trans pathway, sterilised and surgically mutilated, instead of being supported to be themselves.

HorseWithNoFucksToGive Sun 01-Dec-19 09:31:36

I agree with telling children that being gay is perfectly fine but like others here would object to children being told that a person can change sex which is impossible.

HandsOffMyRights Sun 01-Dec-19 09:38:12

Once again, why is a lobby group issuing 'guidance' to schools, when this contravenes the Education Act?

Also, I'd be looking to this. Belief in 'gender' is just that, a belief system and I choose not to subscribe to magical thinking.

minminminnie Sun 01-Dec-19 09:43:38

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

HandsOffMyRights Sun 01-Dec-19 09:45:24

I've seen some real bitter and hateful old women on here in previous threads about trans issues and it's disturbing.

And there we have it.
Long live the penis round two.

minminminnie Sun 01-Dec-19 09:46:06

Teaching about trans issues is not telling all children that what makes them a boy or a girl is whether they play with dolls or not.

It just means that if they come across someone like this is their lives it's not to be judged or hated upon...

PHOBIA means fear, it's removing the fear and stigma around trans people existing and allowing them to live relatively safely and without judgement.

minminminnie Sun 01-Dec-19 09:47:14

@HandsOffMyRights I'm a 22 year old woman.

HandsOffMyRights Sun 01-Dec-19 09:47:47


fascinated Sun 01-Dec-19 09:48:46

Re the Jesuits - indeed. And yet the Catholic Church actually has issued quite a balanced and thoughtful statement on this issue. Which is good. Am keeping it ready to use with my child’s RC school, and the body in charge of RC education higher up, in case I hear about any of this creeping into the DC’s school.

minminminnie Sun 01-Dec-19 09:48:48

@HandsOffMyRights And so what's your point?

HandsOffMyRights Sun 01-Dec-19 09:49:23

My point is you say you're a 22 year old woman. So what?

OneEpisode Sun 01-Dec-19 09:49:37

minmin this is a UK site so religion is a protected aspect of society. So you can believe that your god placed people’s souls in their earthly bodies, and for some reason placed some souls in the body of the wrong sex. But I don’t need to believe that.
In the UK age and sex and also protected. So “hateful old women” hits two protected characteristics in one..

minminminnie Sun 01-Dec-19 09:50:37

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

fascinated Sun 01-Dec-19 09:50:45

@min... no. Phobia means an unreasonable or exaggerated fear. Not a rational assessment of risk.

HandsOffMyRights Sun 01-Dec-19 09:51:12

How so?

Pityparty4one Sun 01-Dec-19 09:52:16

what happens when they kill themselves because they're not allowed to be who they feel they are meant to be?

Please be very careful saying this sort of stuff. We know the suicide rate of trans people is no higher than any other group in fact I think it is lower than most.
When this sentence is thrown about it becomes a form of control/threat.

I've seen some real bitter and hateful old women on here in previous threads about trans issues and it's disturbing.

Very mysogonistic of you there.
Transphobia is bad but being mysogonistic is ok in your view?
You have just pissed all over any chance of anyone reading your posts with an open mind. Well done.

fascinated Sun 01-Dec-19 09:54:59

What is the policy - are we to just ignore such posters? I see people trying to engage but it just seems always to derail good discussion....

TeaAndStrumpets Sun 01-Dec-19 09:54:59

Lots of young women on here, amazingly! And they know a dick when they read one grin

OneEpisode Sun 01-Dec-19 09:55:14

no regular poster on this site knows my age and no one knows my gender identity on account of that being personal, unknowable & etc. My sex someone could probably work out from other posts..
So why would a randommer assume a poster was an “old woman”? Unless they believe someone old enough to be a parent, and care about children, is “old”?

ArnoldWhatshisknickers Sun 01-Dec-19 09:56:16

Lying to five year olds is really not on.

The differernce between gay and trans is huge. Homosexual people do exist. They do have same sex relationships. They are a reality that children need to know about at some point.

Trans ideology by contrast is complete and utter nonsense on stilts. Human beings can't change sex at all. There is no evidence whatsoever that 'gender identities' exist outside of faith based beliefs.

Children do not need to be lied to about trans. They need the truth. You are the sex you are and nothing will ever change that. It doesn't matter what your likes and dislikes are. It doesn't matter how you dress. Your sex always stays the same. Throughout your life and even your death.

Those children who are distressed by this reality need support to come to terms with it, not false promises. Other children need to be free from ideologists who seek to undermine their development.

I give thanks daily that my children are grown and I didn't have to protect them from schools foisting this dangerous claptrap on them.

birdsdestiny Sun 01-Dec-19 09:57:29

Is there something wrong with being old minmin? That's not very tolerant of you is it. Are you a bigot?

Birdsfoottrefoil Sun 01-Dec-19 10:00:18

* you can, nowadays, change sex to varying degrees*

Sex is denoted by your body’s reproductive role. It is impossible for males to produce large immobile games or gestate babies, and it is impossible for females to produce spermatozoa, and it is impossible to change the dna in every single cell of your body that dictates which of the reproductive roles your body is designed to carry out. ALL you can do cosmetic surgery and take drugs to make your body artificially mimic some of the features of the opposite sex. Body modification this way comes no closer to changing sex that a few piercings and tanning pills do.

WendyMoiraAngelaDarling Sun 01-Dec-19 10:01:35

@minminminnie I've reported your nasty post. Hopefully it will be removed soon. All these claims of nastiness and bitterness and you're the only one making personal attacks 🤷‍♀️

minminminnie Sun 01-Dec-19 10:05:38


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