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Spoiling my ballot

(100 Posts)
Muststopfaffing Sun 24-Nov-19 16:51:49

I’ve decided to spoil my ballot in December. I cannot vote for the shit shows that are the Lib Dems, Labour or the Greens and even if the Tories had a better stance on women’s rights I can’t in all good conscience vote for them. I’m fuming that there is no one I can vote for as I feel very strongly that as so many fought for us to get the vote, and while so many women across the world don’t have it, all women should vote. I’m hoping the Suffragettes will forgive me- “No self respecting woman...” and all that. Plus, one party has had a 20,000+ majority in every election in my constituency since time began.

I have been wondering what I’m going to write on my ballot paper though. I want to write something that will get the message across to someone who has no idea what’s going on. I thought about the classic sticker woman “women don’t have penises” but I suspect round my rural neck of the woods that might be too subtle- as if anyone could think anything except only men have penises! I’ve also thought about “Google the Cotton Ceiling” but I’m not sure that’s right either.

For anyone who’s planning to spoil their ballot, what are you going to write?

IfIShouldFallFromGraceWithGod Sun 24-Nov-19 16:57:26

I'm in a safe Tory seat. It's almost a relief as I don't know if I could bring myself to vote Labour as usual
I am just waiting for each candidate to reply to my email re women's rights but will likely spoil
I think we should all put the same phrase to draw attention to it

Antibles Sun 24-Nov-19 17:02:45

I'm not going to spoil my ballot but if I were, I would write Woman = Adult Human Female.

FleetsumNJetsum Sun 24-Nov-19 17:07:14

I have been forced to do this too, not sure what I will write though. Trying to come up with a punchy on point one-liner

FleetsumNJetsum Sun 24-Nov-19 17:25:53

Woman = Adult Human Female

The erosion of women's rights is not really an issue to most parties, they have not thought it through (especially the low-level ballot checkers, I suspect) so while Woman = Adult Human Female is a pretty important and loaded expression to us, I worry that someone checking a spoiled ballot might just go "huh?". Most women recounting canvassers at the door describe candidates or representatives who seem to have no idea women's rights are being eroded.

HandsOffMyRights Sun 24-Nov-19 17:37:16

I'm spoiling my paper.

Was going to write 'Woman = Adult Human Female', but somebody else had suggested 'Protect Women's Rights'.

Biancadelrioisback Sun 24-Nov-19 17:58:28

But absolutely no one will take any notice of what you've written. It's like shouting into a pillow for all its heard.
Yes it shows that a certain percentage of people dislike/refuse to vote for any party indicating a volume of people who don't feel represented...but no one will really know why you don't feel represented as no one will take notice of what you write.

Watto1 Sun 24-Nov-19 18:01:24

The candidates just glance at the paper to see if it is a valid vote or not. They won’t give a monkeys what you actually write.

HandsOffMyRights Sun 24-Nov-19 18:03:30

I will know what I've written Bianca

HandsOffMyRights Sun 24-Nov-19 18:06:02

I've also been on enough of these threads (as well as being present at a count) to spot that what you're saying about others not noticing just isn't the case.

BuzzShitbagBobbly Sun 24-Nov-19 18:08:29

I've got my postal vote here now and I am stuck.

I think the Conservative candidate will get re-elected again (supportive and against GRA, but it means Brexit); but there is a serious challenge being mounted by Lib Dems (good work locally and remainers, but anti-women),

Who the fuck do I vote for?
The other candidates are not relevant for me for various reasons.

DogAndCatPerson Sun 24-Nov-19 18:10:14

I’m the same. I’ve got my postal vote but I’m absolutely paralysed with indecision on what to do. What a fucking mess.

HandsOffMyRights Sun 24-Nov-19 18:14:32

I feel for you. My local Tory MP has such an overwhelming majority safe seat that the decision has been somewhat 'easier' sad

Mind you, having read the current Jo Swinson/Angela Rayner on Andrew Marr thread, I couldn't vote for anybody in good conscience.

leckford Sun 24-Nov-19 18:17:13

As said above no one cares about spoiled votes, they are glanced at and put in a pile. As ABBA sang ‘winner takes it all’. Best vote for the least worst like most people

LensGlans Sun 24-Nov-19 18:18:04

If the Brexit Party is standing it may be worth throwing a vote to them to send a message to Lab/Lib/Green, and I say that as a committed remainer.

Ringdonna Sun 24-Nov-19 18:18:22

Ihave been doing election counts for over 20 years and noone cares what is written on the ballot paper it is just counted as a spoilt vote

MockersFactCheckMN Sun 24-Nov-19 18:22:53

...been doing election counts for over 20 years and no one cares what is written on the ballot paper.

A prize surely for the best willy?

MsPotterPepper Sun 24-Nov-19 18:25:32

I feel the same, there's no one I can vote for in good conscience.

I won't vote for the removal of women's rights.

MissMarpletheMurderer Sun 24-Nov-19 18:28:35

Please please please vote. For the best of the worst. If you spoil your vote you are doing a disservice to everyone. No one gives a fuck what you write on the ballot paper.

HandsOffMyRights Sun 24-Nov-19 18:31:30

Miss have you returned to the Caitlyn Jenner thread you started on here yet?

MoggyP Sun 24-Nov-19 18:31:52

no one will take notice of what you write

This is completely correct.

If you think you will send a message, you are mistaken. Potentially spoiled papers are scrutinised only to see if the marks on then could be construed as a valid vote (so, yes there is a sort of prize for the 'best willy' because if it is drawn within one box only, it could be claimed).

Tellers make no note of what words are written, and candidates/agents pay not attention, nor are they ever reported.

If you decide to write, it is for your own satisfaction only.

Thismonkeysgonetodevon Sun 24-Nov-19 18:33:24

I’m a lurker on this board but have learnt so much (thank you!) and I’m trying to do what I can in terms of discussing with friends, signing petitions, writing to MP etc.

I have no idea what do to as I am in a Conservative marginal seat. They won by just a few votes last time with Labour a very close second. I hate what the Tories have done since they have been in power and can’t in all conscience vote for them, but I really don’t feel I can vote for labour either at the moment (or the Greens or Lib Dem’s). There are no independents so I feel that spoiling my ballot is the only logical action. I’m reading mixed opinions on whether it’s worth it or not! Argh!! Help!!!

Biancadelrioisback Sun 24-Nov-19 18:34:14

@Handoffmyrights but with all due respect, how does that help anyone?

OhHolyJesus Sun 24-Nov-19 18:35:20

I'm going to write AFH but underneath "none of the above".

HandsOffMyRights Sun 24-Nov-19 18:35:42

Leckford as you wrote this on the ' Only consenting to receiving medical treatment from a female is not acceptable' thread, you'll forgive me for not taking your 'advice' again.

'If you have ‘religious’ issues or anything else you have the option to go private and choose which doctor/specialist you see. If not shut up'

WrongKindOfFace Sun 24-Nov-19 18:36:46

In your position, Thismonkey, I’d hold my nose and vote labour. Corbyn won’t be around for much longer.

Elieza Sun 24-Nov-19 18:41:36

Respectfully, there is no point in spoiling your paper. It achieves nothing as nobody will ever read it or care. It’s just an excuse for you not to do your homework and vote for the least bad party. Read the manifestos the week before and use the vote that women suffered and even died for that you may have it. A vote for the least worst party or tactical voting to get the least worst party into power is surely the best thing to do? Rather than achieve nothing.

PS there was a similar post on here last week about three act same thing.

HandsOffMyRights Sun 24-Nov-19 18:42:11

Bianca

Because Miss started a gushing thread about Caitlyn Jenner on FWR and didn't return when many of us talked about what makes us a woman.

The issue of self ID is the reason I'm spoiling my ballot.

Biancadelrioisback Sun 24-Nov-19 18:46:23

But that doesn't answer my question. You spoiling your ballot will not achieve anything. No one will know, or care what you've written. You could make the most important and insightful point ever but it will benefit absolutely no-one. It won't invoke change, or make people think, or prove any point. I'll end up in a disregard pile.

HandsOffMyRights Sun 24-Nov-19 18:49:59

As I said, I will know.

Biancadelrioisback Sun 24-Nov-19 18:55:04

But that doesn't make any sense. What good does it do? Literally no one benefits

HandsOffMyRights Sun 24-Nov-19 18:55:23

Elieza There have been a number of these threads now. I was going to link to last week's one to save going round in circles, but couldn't find it.

HandsOffMyRights Sun 24-Nov-19 19:03:48

And tell me what good it does to vote for the party that abuses women the least?

As for The Suffragettes? I like to think they would be appalled that it's come to voting for the 'least worse' or that anybody is doing this lightly, without extensive research or without conscience.

It is a lose lose for women.

PaleBlueMoonlight Sun 24-Nov-19 19:12:59

I am wobbling. Having heard Angela Rayner and Jo Swinson and having seen the Tory manifesto I am, for the first time in my life thinking of voting conservative. Entirely on the issue of women’s rights. I could not have done this if it was a hard right manifesto, but it is not. I will then need to hope that Lib Dems or labour sort themselves out so that next time I can go back to voting on economic policies. If we lose on women’s rights, it will be one hell of a long road to get then back.

dippydeedoo Sun 24-Nov-19 19:16:39

Can I just say without any offence.
This really makes no odds, having been at several vote counts, nobody really cares and all that will happen is that the candidates for the opposing parties will chuckle, some will shake their head and say what a waste of time, others may empathise secretly but really it has very little consequence especially as it’s anonymous.

HandsOffMyRights Sun 24-Nov-19 19:16:41

Here are a couple of previous threads (there was another one too...with some excellent responses'

Justa post on the first page of the first thread captures my thoughts.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3749890-Can-we-talk-spoiling-ballots-again-sorry

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3743237-advice-on-spoiling-ballot

Dangerfloof Sun 24-Nov-19 19:18:36

I'm spoiling my vote too. Dont care who says it doesn't matter/no one will see it/no one cares.
I care.

VondaVomin Sun 24-Nov-19 19:42:36

Yes I will be spoiling my vote too. If enough of us do it then the candidates will see the level of anger amongst women. I'm in a solidly Labour ward so what I vote is irrelevant even if I wanted to support any of the candidates, which I don't.

There are a number of women I know who plan to do the same so at least the message will be seen a few times.

VikingVolva Sun 24-Nov-19 19:49:34

I think there have been a lot of threads, because there is a desire for one where all the answers are 'great idea, it'll send a hard-hitting message that will make a difference'

Unfortunately, there are sufficient posters who say they have direct experience of what happens at a count, who are patiently and politely pointing out it will make no difference whatsoever. And they are right.

No-one is paying attention to what is written on a spoiled ballot. It is not recorded, won't be seen by candidates, won't be referred to after the vote, and won't be reported on by the press.

Up to you.

Thismonkeysgonetodevon Sun 24-Nov-19 20:03:17

WrongKindOfFace - This is DH’s thinking; it’s more about stopping a Tory landslide than a Labour win. I’m just so disgusted at Labour’s utter contempt for women. Labour candidate hasn’t even bothered to reply to my email.

Muststopfaffing Sun 24-Nov-19 20:46:03

Interesting viewpoints, thanks. I’ve been on and off FWR for a few years now and how much I’m here depends on what’s going on IRL (as I’m sure it does for many of us) so I missed the previous threads about spoiling ballots. I hadn’t intended to duplicate, and certainly wasn’t expecting a pat on the back or to be told it’s a great idea.

For those who said vote for the least worst party, if this is what you have decided to do how did you decide who was least worst? Issues other than women’s rights? Brexit?? Or based on who is likely to have most chance beating the opposition? As I said, I’m in a safe seat (Cons) that has always had a majority of over 20,000 and historically Labour or Libdems have come in 2nd depending on the manifesto etc.

Meercatsarecats Sun 24-Nov-19 20:46:51

In a lot of places one vote doesn't make a difference anyway.
I also live in a constituency with a 20,000+ Tory majority that they've held for years.
So even if I wanted to vote for the other parties, which I don't, and can't in good conscience as things stand, the conservatives will still win.
I will know that I turned up to vote.
My morals and values won't allow me to vote for any of the candidates on offer.
My conscience will know that I did what i thought was right in shit circumstances and that's good enough for me at this time.

RNBrie Sun 24-Nov-19 20:53:20

I've been to a count and spoiled ballots were viewed by the election agents for the candidates or the candidate themselves and everyone has to agree they were spoiled. They did get read out, but more in jest than taken seriously.

I don't think I can bring myself to spoil my ballot. But I also don't think I can bring myself to vote for any of the candidate I have to choose from. No idea what I'll do yet.

Thismonkeysgonetodevon Sun 24-Nov-19 21:00:04

For those who said vote for the least worst party, if this is what you have decided to do how did you decide who was least worst? Issues other than women’s rights? Brexit??...

God knows sad So many of us struggling with this exact same dilemma.

JellySlice Sun 24-Nov-19 21:04:03

To my mind spoiling your ballot, whether or not you write a message, still sends a message: None Of The Above.

Voting for the 'least worst' is a vote in support of the erasure of women, or in support of austerity/Brexit.

exLtEveDallas Sun 24-Nov-19 21:11:11

Spoiled votes need to be read, if only to confirm they are spoilt. So I figure I might be helping to peak one more person...and that’s enough for me.

FixItUpChappie Sun 24-Nov-19 21:12:00

Spoiling your vote is irresponsible. You have no right to complain if you don't show up and make an educated choice. Best of the worst is still something.

It childish to think anyone will care or take note of anything you write on your ballot - it will be binned straight away.

GeneticTest Sun 24-Nov-19 21:14:19

It WONT be binned.

I’ve been to several election counts. DH has been a (successful) candidate at several. All spoilt ballots are read out/shown to the candidates or their chosen agent. If lots say the same thing then the candidates/agents will notice.
Most are just offensive to one side or the other.

Saying no one reads them is rubbish.

slipperywhensparticus Sun 24-Nov-19 21:20:23

There is no point spoiling your ballot vote to decrease the majority in parliament let them hang themselves they will be unable to make it worse maybe next election we will get someone worth while

SunsetBeetch Sun 24-Nov-19 21:20:47

I'm spoiling my ballot and writing to each ofnthe candidates to tell them why I won't vote for them. There is no "least worst" as far as I am concerned. I'm not going to be a turkey voting for Christmas!

TrixieFranklin Sun 24-Nov-19 21:26:03

My MP is fucking Chris Chope angry it's a very safe seat and he's a sexist cunt. 'Sir' wanker.
He has repeatedly attempted to block bills relating to legislation on female genital mutilation and upskirting.

Even high up members of the party locally have quit this week because they can't campaign for such a massive bellend (my words, not their official reason but I have read between the lines).
There's no point in voting for anyone else, and I can't stomach a vote for him.

I will be adorning my paper with many cocks.

Dangerfloof Mon 25-Nov-19 12:25:12

Spoiling your vote is irresponsible. You have no right to complain if you don't show up and make an educated choice. Best of the worst is still something

I either turn up and spoil it or dont bother at all.
I reckon of the two choices, actually bothering is the better option. The best of the worst isnt good enough. The best of the worst makes women (adult human females) disappear. I wont be able to complain, when men make all the choices for me. They wont let me, because to them I'm a non man. I dont count, I dont matter.

Thefatfeminist Mon 25-Nov-19 18:40:06

Having had a frustrating call where the woman on the other end simply didn't seem to understand that saying you identify as a woman doesn't make it so I'm going to vote conservative. They are abhorrent in many ways but that's our best chance of fighting back. Any other party will support reform of the GRA and at that point it's largely too late.

FuckeryOmbudsman Mon 25-Nov-19 19:40:09

"He has repeatedly attempted to block bills relating to legislation on female genital mutilation and upskirting."

My opinion of this MP matches yours.

He did not however block these because of their content. But because he thinks it wrong that new criminal offences be created without full scrutiny (of the kind a government Bill would go through).

OhHolyJesus Mon 25-Nov-19 19:55:53

Spoiling ballots has been coming up so much lately and if posts here are a temperature check it's possible that really large numbers, maybe never been seen before numbers, of spoilt ballots will be recorded this election.

I'm really hoping that if it does happen like that we will hear about it in the papers.

MockersFactCheckMN Mon 25-Nov-19 20:00:54

He did not however block these because of their content.

Correct.

...but because he thinks it wrong that new criminal offences be created without full scrutiny

My arse. Chope, McVey's fancy man and one or two chums like to frustrate opposition backbench bills for sport. They prevent the scrutiny they say is lacking by asking a gazillion questions about the entirely non-controversial bill preceding on the order paper.

When Chope was leader of Wandsworth council, he chucked my nan out of her flat so they could sell it to developers. Hate the smug shit, I do.

Antibles Mon 25-Nov-19 20:15:06

The obvious point to spoiling your ballot rather than not turning up is that you are counted in the turnout and are therefore part of the democratic process. Quite different to not bothering to turn out at all.

While you're at it, you might as well add a slogan if you are so inclined. Candidates or agents DO see them, because they go through the spoiled ballots to check none can be interpreted as a vote for them.

SciFiRules Mon 25-Nov-19 20:31:21

Spoke ballot peppers don't send a message. No one analyses the homogeneity of spoilt ballot papers and develops policy to attract protest voters. I understand the frustration of feeling that you have no voice but writing to all the candidates to explain why you couldn't vote for them would have much more impact, particularly if you publish the letters.

HotPenguin Mon 25-Nov-19 20:35:53

I dont think you should spoil your ballot paper because there are other issues at stake which affect women just as much or more than the GRA. Universal credit, abortion rights, workers rights to name a few. Personally I think you should vote for whoever is most likely to get the Tories out. The Lib Dems have zero chance of winning a majority so they won't be implementing all their policies, however they could provide some balance if the conservatives are the largest party but don't have a majority.

That said, I can see why the conservatives look appealling to anyone who cares about women's rights.

Ok I am nearly talking myself into voting Tory now.

JellySlice Mon 25-Nov-19 21:53:45

*Spoiling ballots has been coming up so much lately and if posts here are a temperature check it's possible that really large numbers, maybe never been seen before numbers, of spoilt ballots will be recorded this election.

I'm really hoping that if it does happen like that we will hear about it in the papers.*

The reason many of us are considering spoiling our ballots is, unfortunately, almost unheard of outside Mumsnet. How many people in RL understand the concept of trans ideology, and the consequences self-ID will have? And how many people in RL know that nearly all the parties intend to implement it and thereby remove women's human rights and totally dismantle safeguarding?

ShesDressedInBlackAgain Mon 25-Nov-19 23:12:27

I can't spend time working against this shit, talking to people about it, writing to people about it, contributing to campaigns, going to meetings, stickering bloody changing rooms and toilets and then walk into a voting booth and tick a box for it. I can't.

MoggyP Mon 25-Nov-19 23:40:36

I doubt there will be a significant increase in spoiled votes.

But even if there were, there wouid be no discussion about why, because there is no information kept on how the papers were spoiled.

So no-one will know how many were through ignorance, how many through error, how many as a protest, let alone what the protest might be about. It's not going to send a message about any particular issue, though an increase might give succour to the those campaigning for a NOTA option for all elections.

HandsOffMyRights Tue 26-Nov-19 04:31:35

If we can no longer define what a woman is then self ID becomes EVERY issue for women.

If we cannot say the sex, we cannot say the sexism.

This will cover every facet of life and law. We can no longer claim sexual discrimination, maternity rights at work, for example. TRAs already claim that men can have abortions.

How can we say that UC discriminates against women when men are claiming to be women?

The very rules that are supposed to protect women based on sex are being dismantled in front of our eyes and I won't play a part in that.

Woman is becoming a 'dirty' word and this slippery slope won't stop until we can no longer use that defining word.

It's already moved to presenters saying "cis woman" or sometimes "cis man". This will just become "cis" eventually if gender ideologists have their way.

midcenturylegs Tue 26-Nov-19 08:21:24

Hi - pretty sure I've posted this elsewhere but it's my understanding that a protest vote is only counted by doing this @Muststopfaffing

midcenturylegs Tue 26-Nov-19 08:23:00

But I might be wrong!

AuntieStella Tue 26-Nov-19 08:31:42

That's not correct midcenturylegs

A ballot can be spoiled in many ways, even by leaving it blank.

What you are linking (two other threads about it) is actually a campaign leaflet (for electoral reform, not a specific party) which seems to be playing on voter ignorance. Presumably to get them to read the fuller version.

Dangerfloof Tue 26-Nov-19 17:22:41

While you're at it, you might as well add a slogan if you are so *
inclined
Yeah on other threads we have discussed what to write. Still no consensus but I've been busy recently, so possibly by now there is a swing to what to write.

particularly if you publish the letters
Yeah with my full name and occupation and where I live. No chance. Have you seen the women losing jobs over this stuff.

I dont think you should spoil your ballot paper because there are other issues at stake which affect women just as much or more than the GRA
Yet I see it as if women no longer exist as a class, nothing will help us with any other issue. Men will identify as women, then solve all the womens problems that relate to them as women. Not us cunty type women. We will again be at the back of the queue whilst the "real" women solve issues and get the job done. Cos you know they can woman better than us, so I bet they can problem solve better than us. It's been said a while ago now. A MP was asked if parliament was made up of 50% men and 50% transwomen would that be equality. The answer, yes. Of course.

OhHolyJesus Tue 26-Nov-19 17:34:15

That's it for me too, in a nutshell SheDressed it's really counter intuitive and I continue to go round in circles but I can't tick a box that agrees to what I'm fighting against. That would be really daft.

Thismonkeysgonetodevon Thu 28-Nov-19 12:15:57

@HotPenguin Ok I am nearly talking myself into voting Tory now.
Haha! Nooo..don’t do it!!

I have just read Johnson’s comments (albeit 20 years ago but I doubt his opinion has changed) about single mothers and his opinion that children of single mothers are “ill-raised, ignorant, aggressive and illegitimate". What with the inevitable sell off of the NHS to private US pharma companies under his leadership, I have decided to hold my nose and vote Labour.

How bad can it be... 🤦‍♀️

BillytheMountain Thu 28-Nov-19 12:58:14

Do what you will with your vote, but I think this is a waste to waste it when our country is at such a crossroads

The election is not even about Brexit, we are facing being left without an NHS and the additional delight of all our data being gifted to big pharma in the USA.

I totally agree all this bollocks is wrong, but it will be better challenged in more imaginative ways, directly with retailers and politicians etc, than spoiling your ballot paper, your point will simply be lost

Dangerfloof Thu 28-Nov-19 13:21:57

Then you go right ahead and vote Billy, some of us cannot vote for the erasing of our very self.

MrsCollinssettled Thu 28-Nov-19 13:49:18

The number of spoilt ballot papers is officially recorded. In the last election some people posted pictures of their spoilt papers on SM (although it's legal to spoil your paper I have a feeling that taking pictures is prohibited).

Socrates11 Thu 28-Nov-19 13:50:28

Spoiling mine. Not going to vote for least worst and the only time I voted tactically was 2010 and look where that got us.

Whole system is a shower of shite so my ballot represents a lack of faith in the tawdry, lying load of plop. Current political system is not legitimate to me.

None of the above.

Ineedacupofteadesperately Thu 28-Nov-19 14:42:20

Well I'm almost at the point of deciding to vote Tory. The single issue I agree with the Tories on is that child safeguarding is important and that my 9 yr old daughter has a right to safety, privacy and dignity. That she has a right to spaces away from men who have a sexual fetish about dressing in so-called women's clothing and bog standard sexual predators too who can easily access mixed sex spaces without any challenge.

I'm totally anti Brexit and austerity (plus anti tax breaks for the rich) but frankly the safeguarding around my daughter is the single most important issue to me. We've been trying to raise the fact that the way the TRA agenda is going it is ERASING the rights of young girls and women and it's done sweet FA. I can see no better way to get across that the rights of women and girls is the biggest issue to me. If I vote Tory I will also adorn my ballot with Woman=adult human female. Hopefully that'll mean they need to decide if the ballot is spoilt so they'll see why I'm voting Tory (I need to look up how to do this effectively). But this is what I'm thinking of. Yes, Brexit will be shit but I think there's a good chance it'll happen under Labour anyway because Corbyn is pro-Brexit.

Anyway, I think this is the only thing I can do in good conscience.

I am dreading the day I have to tell my daughter - so happy that she now has single sex toilets at school and finally going to toilet at school instead of holding it as a result - that in reality there are now no single sex spaces. She will self exclude from public life as a result, no doubt. What a shitty world for her to grow up in.

imoverworkedandunderpaid Thu 28-Nov-19 14:55:31

I spoiled mine, I wrote a scathing analysis of each candidate / party. In my constituency I disagree with the polices of 2 of the parties, and another candidate has had a scandalous year so no way for him. I do like the Green Party for their environmental polices, but I don't think they have a grasp in other areas.

Discussing the Green Party with DH, and he had what I thought was a great idea, that instead of the cabinet being made up of random MPs who happen to be there. It should have directly electable positions for SUITABLE and qualified candidates in that field. I.e. a Green Party MP as the environment minister, or an experienced ex military MP in a Defence etc.

Thismonkeysgonetodevon Thu 28-Nov-19 15:07:32

But it’s all already happening under the Tories sad

josephineisblue Thu 28-Nov-19 15:10:38

I cannot believe the amount of supposedly feminist women who will not be voting.
You really must have a certain level of privilege to be able to abstain from voting because of your gender critical stance.

Fuck all the poor single mothers and children suffering under austerity hmm

bellinisurge Thu 28-Nov-19 15:13:40

Just writing NONE on my paper.
I've been berated in other threads for saying I will be spoiling my paper.

MrsFogi Thu 28-Nov-19 16:07:24

I take it that the postal voting forms are arriving now/soon - if you do spoil your vote please, please take photos so that we can post them all on a thread and then we can make them "count" a bit by putting them all online for any lurking journalists to pick up.

Dangerfloof Thu 28-Nov-19 16:41:31

Fuck all the poor single mothers and children suffering under austerity

What single mothers? Do you mean non men?
If there is no such thing as woman, and if self id goes ahead there wont be women, there will be no single mothers. Or married mothers.

littleslummygirl Thu 28-Nov-19 17:24:31

I don’t honestly think it will make any wider difference. I reckon there will be a record number of spoilt ballots this time as lots of voters won’t in the end be able to stomach the least worse option. But if you do spoil your ballot, then do also follow up with a letter and a reason to the party that you would have voted for. It might make them think hard about why they didn’t come closer. We are half the electorate and a spoilt ballot puts the voter into the silent minority/majority or the just don’t care in politicians’ eyes

BillytheMountain Thu 28-Nov-19 17:47:17

If they recorded spoilt ballot papers in the UK this would be in a way worth it.

I agree with previous poster that this not the only issue at stake and it comes across as a bit quite entitled.

There are people dying in our country from austerity but it's obviously not you or your friends or family or community

bellinisurge Thu 28-Nov-19 18:08:07

The last French presidential election had such a high number of spoilt ballots, it made the news .

Staffori Thu 28-Nov-19 18:15:56

Thismonkeysgonetodevon

I feel for you as I absolutely hate Labour but the Tories are destroying our NHS and if I were in your position I would vote tactically to try to get them out and then campaign against Labour's selling women out.

As I'm in a safe Labour seat, I'll be spoiling my ballot paper. I'm thinking of putting one of PP's woman stickers on mine.

SnarkyGorgon Thu 28-Nov-19 18:27:35

Cool, so whilst your having to declare bankruptcy because of the crippling medical bills you’ve amassed after the scrapping of the NHS, you can look back on this moment and think ‘well at least I made my opinions known’. No worries about mixed wards, because there won’t be any. Cool, good work everyone. Also, if you think BJ gives one shiny shit about women and our rights, you are delusional. The Tories are hoping for a low turnout, they do much better when fewer people vote. This thread is why GC feminists are so often dismissed as being aligned with the far right, massively undermining the arguments. Slow clap for all of you.

I live in a marginal seat, I have huge problems with Labour, but I’ll hold my nose and do it anyway, we cannot have a Tory landslide

JellySlice Thu 28-Nov-19 18:34:27

As many PPs have pointed out, on this thread and others, spoiled ballots send no clear message other than "None of the above". It's unclear whether candidates pay any attention to messages written on the spoiled ballots.

In order to show our disaffection clearly, these messages need to be_ seen_.

It has been suggested that we post photos of our spoiled ballots on these threads, to assist journalists. I think that's an excellent idea, but please be careful. It is an offence to publicise any identifiable details of a vote.

Make sure you obscure the identification number on your ballot, and make sure that there is nothing identifiable or personal in the photo.

Protect women's rights. Transwomen are men.

josephineisblue Thu 28-Nov-19 21:09:11

Snarkygorgan hit the nail on the head.

This is what people mean when they talk about 'white feminism'. Feminism like this centres only white middle class women.

The idea that not voting is better because of one issue (and it is an important issue) but there is so much more going on.

My circumstances do not give me to the privilege to abstain from voting. Threads like this make me realise how much many feminist don't really care about the women's issues that don't directly effect them.

JellySlice Thu 28-Nov-19 21:26:54

Some of us are in constituencies where our vote makes not a jot of difference.

If I was in a marginal seat, I would have to consider my options with a different perspective. But I'm not. My Tory MP has been our MP for over 20y, with nearly 60% of the vote and an overwhelming majority.

I cannot change his re-election. But I can make a statement of "None of the above", and why I feel that way.

Socrates11 Thu 28-Nov-19 21:29:20

Well see as how I was a single parent who lost my job in 2011 due to austerity and seen my community/NHS ripped apart, voting in the 2010 election, did sweet FA for my privilege.

Greens are what I think is necessary, who I've voted for (and once stood for) since I was 18, (except for a tactical Lib Dem in 2010), as we face catastrophic climate change. But the Tory (I've lobbied in Portcullis House three times now) will get in with a huge majority in my area, as the Eton/Oxford PPE shithead always does. Shit voting system means my vote means fuck all anyway.

MsMcWibble Thu 28-Nov-19 21:29:38

I live in a Tory/Lib Dem marginal. I cannot vote for either of them. Voting Labour would be no use at all, but I hate them anyway, so I won't.
I will spoil my ballot. I don't want an argument, but I won't be lectured at.
My background is just about as disadvantaged as you can get. I've got myself into a decent position where many of the problems we can all forsee may not affect me too much.
I'm taking this position for the women in prison and in shelters, the women who can't afford to go to places where there is adequate supervision of unisex spaces and will not be able to buy their way out of mixed sex wards.
I really do care about issues that will probably not affect me, but I just have a different idea of what those issues are.

MagnificentDelurker Thu 28-Nov-19 21:36:16

I am a lurker here. I learned a lot about gender ideology on this board. However as much as I disagree with labour on self ID, I will still be voting labour. Both austerity and climate change will and have affected women most. So I don’t even have to hold my nose to vote labour.

MsMcWibble Thu 28-Nov-19 21:50:03

Oh, and I forgot to mention women losing their jobs and being arrested for wrongthink.
No, I won't vote for any of the bastards that condone this,

SnarkyGorgon Thu 28-Nov-19 22:45:02

You think that the winner is going to look through your spoilt ballots and take in the message? They’re not going to care, why would they, they won anyway! And the candidates who lose? Even if they do care, guess what, they’re irrelevant, they lost, they have no influence, so even if you magically change their mind it makes no difference to the cause.

Alternatively, you lobby the candidates individually, you write to them, ask questions at meetings etc, whilst they’re campaigning. You raise it as an issue that is important to you. Make your case clearly and concisely and then go and vote- they’re never going to know you voted for them, but they will know that the issue is important to you as their constituent. And keep writing to them, once they take their seat, you keep writing and asking questions and trying to change their mind so that they can use their influence to make things better.

Spoiling your ballot may make you feel good in the moment, but it’ll do fuck all to help anyone else

LangCleg Thu 28-Nov-19 23:11:36

Fuck all the poor single mothers and children suffering under austerity

And yet... Labour can only find the money to replace £9bn of the £30bn cut from welfare benefits (most of which has fallen on mothers and children) while shelling out £11bn on tuition fees for middle class students.

The group that will see least benefit from Labour's spending plans is the working poor (very often mothers and their children).

Some of us actually read the manifestos, you know.

Dangerfloof Fri 29-Nov-19 05:24:53

Alternatively, you lobby the candidates individually, you write to them, ask questions at meetings etc

What is it you think we've been doing the last few years. This actually came to my attention about 10 years ago and I wrote to my MP then. Was brushed off with "looks like homophobia to me" from the MP.
Hes still of the same opinion. How long do we campaign, how many letters will it take?

SadlyMissTaken Fri 29-Nov-19 05:25:58

I don't believe people in poverty now will be better off if a four day week is implemented. I think the working poor and those on day rates will be completely screwed.

exLtEveDallas Fri 29-Nov-19 06:17:17

Months ago I signed up for YouGov polls. Over the last couple of weeks I’ve had constant questions about the election. Every time I have said I will be spoiling my vote and have written a scathing condemnation of all the parties.

It asks pretty much the same questions each time and I have been consistent with my answers. Hopefully there are others out there doing the same thing.

MsMcWibble Fri 29-Nov-19 10:07:07

posterexLtEveDallas Great idea.
posterSnarkyGorgon Bit patronising. What on earth makes you think that I haven't been doing all of this, and more?
As for Labour - I'm never going to forget delegates at the Labour conference condemning WPUK and the audience applause re the intimidation and harassment of women meeting to discuss their rights.
That's right, many many people in the Labour party don't even think we should be allowed to meet to discuss issues that concern us.

winonah Tue 03-Dec-19 09:35:00

If you care about women's rights, vote tactically to get the tories out. Under austerity women have been hit disproportionately hard.

If you don't vote you are betraying all the women and girls in this country.

Ineedacupofteadesperately Tue 03-Dec-19 11:21:57

I'm increasingly thinking I'm going to spoil my ballot by writing - this vote is for any party who doesn't force 9 year old girls against their will to accept male penis in single sex spaces and then X just under the Tory candidate - which will hopefully get it looked at (and if it counts for the Tory then so be it, as they're the best on sex based rights plus my Tory is in the safest Tory seat ever and it would require something like a 25,000 swing for anyone else to get in).

But it could obviously be snappier. I don't just want to write woman=adult human female because I think a lot of people just think 'duh, of course' not realising what is already lost and at stake.

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