Wings of Scotland court case

[ItsAllGoingToBeFine]

Brief context:

Ex Scottish labour Kezia Dugdale said (in print) that Wings was a homophobe because of a tweet he made.

The reason I think this case may be of interest is because so far:

Chelsea Manning is mentioned. @WingsScotland says Manning is ‘brave’ & a ‘hero’ but has repeatedly been accused of transphobia for his language towards the whistleblower. ‘An empirical biological fact that he is still a man,’ Campbell tells the court.

.@WingsScotland adds that he doesn’t know Manning’s sexuality & says it has no bearing on accusations of homophobia. Various comments by Wings referring to Manning as ‘he’. Being a transphobe does not make you a homophobe, Wings adds.

[ItsAllGoingToBeFine]

Twitter thread here: twitter.com/GrayInGlasgow/status/1110166929866739713?s=19

[BernardBlacksWineIcelolly]

so Wings Of Scotland has taken Kezia Dugdale to court for defamation because she accused him of being a homophobe?

[BettyDuMonde]

Oh come on, Kezia, you are a lesbian! Stand up for same sex attracted people, especially women loving women.

Manning has tons of support, regardless of how Manning presents or who Manning has relationships with.

[ItsAllGoingToBeFine]

so Wings Of Scotland has taken Kezia Dugdale to court for defamation because she accused him of being a homophobe?

Yes.

More twittage:

Just in case things weren’t contentious enough, the court is now getting into whether Mr Campbell thinks Chelsea Manning is a woman or not. Mr Dunlop says if Mr Campbell is entitled to the view that Chelsea Manning is a man, aren’t others entitled to the view that CM is a woman?

Mr Campbell says “if I proclaim I’m Napoleon, am I? If I proclaim I’m black, am I?” He says people “should be allowed to live their lives however they want”, but he objects to “people ordering me” to say something he doesn’t believe is true - that Chelsea Manning is a woman.

Mr Dunlop and Mr Campbell are having quite a lengthy exchange about the difference between “transgender” and “transsexual” and the use of various pronouns; Sheriff Ross asks if this line of questioning is really worth pursuing

Next witness in the Wings-Dugdale case is Colin McFarlane, director of Stonewall Scotland.

Mr Macfarlane (apologies for spelling in previous tweet) says he wasn’t previously (before the March 2017 Mundell tweet) aware that Wings Over Scotland had any views on gay rights. Court now examining Stonewall’s definition of homophobia.

Mr Sandison - QC for Mr Campbell - is so far mostly asking Mr Macfarlane about gender self-identification, which has become a rather large subplot in this case. There is a “diversity of viewpoints” on the matter, they agree

[BernardBlacksWineIcelolly]

I am reading with interest - thank you

[ItsAllGoingToBeFine]

It's interesting Dugdales team seem to be making the argument that if he is transphobic he must be homophobic.

So will see if court decides if that is true, and if court decides that stating biologocal fact is transphobic.

This case could have some interesting outcomes - I had no idea transphobia was going to be brought up in it.

[R0wantrees]

Court now examining Stonewall’s definition of homophobia.


It will be interesting if they also examine Stonewall's deninition of transphobia.

[nauticant]

Interesting tweets. Especially so to see the line taken against Campbell that he has been a meanie in a number of contexts.

It would be useful for this court case to reinforce the message that being a bit of a meanie does not necessarily mean that someone is guilty of whatever offence they're accused of.

[LassOfFyvie]

Wings Over Scotland has taken Kezia Dugdale to court for defamation because she accused him of being a homophobe?

The allegedly homophobic remarks relate to comments he made about the father of Conservative MSP Oliver Mundell.

[RepealTheGRA]

Interesting! Thank you for the thread.

[ItsAllGoingToBeFine]

The tweet in question:

[nauticant]

Some background:

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-47693895

I really don't see that tweet is being homophobia. There may be a surrounding context I'm unaware of, of course. (I'm not a WoS fan.)

[BernardBlacksWineIcelolly]

Yes, I don’t read that tweet as homophobic either...?

[ItsAllGoingToBeFine]

I suspect this may be the surrounding context:

wingsoverscotland.com/?s=Kezia+Dugdale

[ItsAllGoingToBeFine]

I really don't see that tweet is being homophobia

I wonder if that's why transphobia is being brought into it? It's all under the LGBT umbrella after all, and he is undoubtedly transphobic by today's rather loose definition.

[PencilsInSpace]

Counsel starts running through Wings tweets, including calling someone a ‘sanctimonious wank hole’.
Counsel: What is a wank hole?
Wings: A hole into which one might wank, he explains.
Scottish politics 2019 here.

[happydappy2]

I wouldn't read that as homophobic....but I do worry that we are wandering into a situation where stating biological truth IS transphobic & therefore hate speech-which is ridiculous.

[BernardBlacksWineIcelolly]

Actually loling

Wank hole

[nauticant]

From your context link ItsAllGoingToBeFine:

Kezia Dugdale Fact Check, Part 683

That fits in neatly with the Communication Act 2003, section 127:

(2) A person is guilty of an offence if, for the purpose of causing annoyance, inconvenience ... to another, he—
...
(c) persistently makes use of a public electronic communications network.

[RepealTheGRA]

That tweets funny not homophobic!?!

And I’m stealing ‘sanctimonious wank hole’.

I wonder if he posts here? Are there any tweets about cockwombles, wankbadgers or fucknuggets?

[RepealTheGRA]

(2) A person is guilty of an offence if, for the purpose of causing annoyance, inconvenience ... to another, he—
...
(c) persistently makes use of a public electronic communications network.

When is Piers Morgan’s court case?

[ItsAllGoingToBeFine]

That fits in neatly with the Communication Act 2003, section 127:

Bit worrying if political fact checking comes under that...

[BickerinBrattle]

Let it not be forgotten that Manning punched a female commanding officer in the face and gloated about what they’d done to “the dyke.”

[BlackForestCake]

Wings has been very steadfast in opposing the TWAW nonsense. Of course, this makes the, er, sanctimonious wankholes in both pro- and anti-independence groups hate him even more.

[Ereshkigal]

Good on him. I know nothing about Scottish independence politics so I do understand that some Scottish posters may not like him for other reasons, but he's great on the gender stuff.