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Telegraph: Labour threatens disciplinary action against member who calls transgender woman 'a man'

(27 Posts)
SuffragettesStruggledForThis Tue 13-Nov-18 13:38:09

www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2018/11/10/labour-threatens-disciplinary-action-against-member-calls-transgender/

'Janey Hutton made the comment on a closed Facebook group, writing: “Its (sic) painful to see biological women say trans women (men) are sisters. The desperation to appear PCWOKE is vomit inducing. These are MEN.”

She then received a letter from Sophie Goodyear, head of complaints of Labour’s National Executive Committee, describing the remarks as “offensive”, saying “abuse of any kind, whether direct attacks or pejorative language which may cause offence is not acceptable and will not be tolerated in our party.”

The letter, sent on October 18, added: “I am therefore writing to remind you that describing those who identify as transgender women as men is not what we would expect from a member of the Labour Party and ask that you refrain from making comments of this nature in the future. Please be aware that any repeat of this conduct may lead to formal disciplinary action.”

Ms Hutton has responded by making a complaint to Labour that her human rights have been breached. In a letter to Ms Goodyear, she wrote: “I am not under the delusion that humans can change sex. This is my belief and therefore I have this right not to have my belief invalidated by your dogma. This is also ECHR Article 9 as my FREEDOM NOT TO BELIEVE in your ideology.” She has not yet received a response.

The row erupted on the closed Labour Women’s Network Facebook group, when fellow member Jes Phillips (not Jess, the MP) challenged Ms Hutton’s language, saying: “This is a space for all women regardless of how they identify. If you don’t like it, leave.”

Ms Hutton responded: “I’m not leaving. I’m a woman and a lesbian and if that’s a problem for other women then that says something about what’s going wrong with Labour."

She added: “Only MEN can be ‘trans’. What dont (sic) you understand about this fact Jes? When you ‘welcome’ transvestites - which are what trans women (men) who have not had the GRS (gender realignment surgery) are then why bother have any women at all? The fact you cannot see the insidious and appalling MISOGYNY going on here is disturbing, you are gaslighting yourself and us.”'

[then there's a brief mention of Venice Allan]

sorenipples Tue 13-Nov-18 13:56:18

I guess this is compliance in action.

Sad to have it confirmed that the thought police are indeed a centralised part of labour. What a sorry state for our country if this is the opposition.

Theinconstantgardener Tue 13-Nov-18 13:58:02

How ridiculous. They are not a political party they are a joke. I've voted Labor all my life right up to the last election. Never will again.

Silentlyobserving Tue 13-Nov-18 14:28:59

The comments are very funny

snugglybeans Tue 13-Nov-18 17:14:35

What a disgraceful state of affairs in that party.

I thought they'd try to represent the opinions of working people, but I guess not.

happydappy2 Tue 13-Nov-18 17:22:10

This story just highlights the stupidness of Jeremy Corbyn proclaiming Transwomen are women. (As if he has the authority to do this.) He can chose to treat transwomen as though they are women, but he can't force other people to do the same. (As JC is a man & clearly has no understanding about how women feel about being appropriated like this.)

OrangeSnake Tue 13-Nov-18 17:28:56

Good on labour for standing up to transphobia

FloralBunting Tue 13-Nov-18 17:34:03

This is my belief and therefore I have this right not to have my belief invalidated by your dogma. This is also ECHR Article 9 as my FREEDOM NOT TO BELIEVE in your ideology

I shall be very interested to see if there is a specific response to this. I consider it one of our strongest points all told. Others can believe as they wish. They cannot force others to believe the same things and that is an actual legal matter.

Floisme Tue 13-Nov-18 17:34:39

To quote one of my favourite tweets:
‘For the men, not the many’.

userblablabla Tue 13-Nov-18 17:35:47

Good

OrangeSnake Tue 13-Nov-18 17:39:33

FloralBunting It isn't even remotely a strong point, you have the right to believe what you want, but the Article 9 right does not extend to being allowed to hold a view and retain membership of a private organisation like the labour party. The labour party is entirely entitled to remove/expel/discipline members whos views are contradictory to the parties fundamental values and ideology.

FloralBunting Tue 13-Nov-18 17:45:27

OrangeSnake, couldn't give a monkey's what your opinion is, tbh. Your zealotry about clearing out the ideologically impure from politics is what will keep progressive policies away from a sniff of actual power because hardly anyone in the real world who votes thinks that some women have penises and that it's a good thing to expel people who disagree with that nonsense.

I think that is a very sad thing while the current government craps all over everything, but hey, at least you'll find yourself in an exclusive (tiny) club, which will feel special.

happydappy2 Tue 13-Nov-18 17:46:06

cor the reek of aftershave is quite strong suddenly!

Threewheeler1 Tue 13-Nov-18 17:47:34

But it's ok for male Labour members to call gc women 'cunts' online.

Floisme Tue 13-Nov-18 17:48:59

They may well be able to expel whomever they like but they would be wise to bear in mind that we can still vote as we like.

ErrolTheDragon Tue 13-Nov-18 17:58:23

* we can still vote as we like*

Except for the small problem that many of us don't like any of the political parties at the moment. 100 years after women started to get the vote, none of them seem clear on what a woman is - and isn't. hmm

OrangeSnake Tue 13-Nov-18 18:00:39

ErrolTheDragon Democracy doesn't mean that political parties have to offer you what you want, if you don't like the fact that the main political parties aren't transphobic enough then join UKIP or set up your own party.

FloralBunting Tue 13-Nov-18 18:03:29

You weren't here a few months ago, were you, pushing this incredibly insightful political line about running all the women who disagreed with you out of politics? I thought at the time that was an absurdly amusing way to do politics, and also profoundly sad.

OrangeSnake Tue 13-Nov-18 18:05:17

FloralBunting Idk what you are talking about so I assume it wasn't me lol

newtlover Tue 13-Nov-18 18:07:48

are you hoping that the labour party will get elected, Orangesnake, and have you spoken to any regular voters lately?

OrangeSnake Tue 13-Nov-18 18:10:04

newtlover Well i'm a libdem not labour so...

And yes, i talk to voters multiple times a week with the local campaigning I do.

Avegemitesandwich Tue 13-Nov-18 18:14:24

Labour are an absolute joke.

Avegemitesandwich Tue 13-Nov-18 18:16:10

If Labour don't want any members who actually believe in biology and only want people who believe that TWAW to vote for them, they will disappear from British politics pretty quickly.

KayM2 Tue 13-Nov-18 18:18:28

For me, calling a TS woman ( or even a trans woman) a man is certainly biologically correct, at least in terms of their birth, (not necessarily in terms of their physical appearance after hormones and surgery). It seems a tad discourteous, though. After all, it is not as if everyone did not know they were born male, and after years of hormones, surgery, voice coaching, etc it doesn't seem too much to expect a little bit of " suspension of disbelief" out of decency. If they transitioned last week, or havn't done that, and are making no effort, it would be different, I think. But should we get stroppy about it, and feel insulted? I'd say no, and I am a TS woman. Life is full of things we don't like. Someone on Mumsnet addressed me as " sir" today, which made me smile, as no-one has done that for a quarter of a century. It's only words, as the Bee Gees sang.

indieshuffle Tue 13-Nov-18 18:21:41

Good on her. Ms Hutton not the rest.

I guess it has taken 100 years Errol but the misogynists have finally found the way to take away the power of a woman's vote - they will render them null by giving us centre to left leaning women no one we want to vote for and no parties we want to join. Anyone voting Tory is quite welcome to continue of course, regardless of sex or clothes.

It's almost like someone in the Tories or on the right thought up this amazing strategy of how to keep getting elected despite being deeply unpopular and satisfying no one, and being about to deliver a probably disastrous Brexit. If not a design, it is a dream come true.

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