Vast Majority of Feminists & Trans

[WombTing]

I was reading through Huda Elmi's, one of the JC9's blog today and her accompanying tweets. I can't link to it, as a new user.

She says in a tweet that the vast majority of feminists don't wish to exclude trans or erode their rights. Her implication is, I think that that the vast majority of feminists are cool with the impending GRA,

I'm going to be honest and say, I don't know the difference between a radical feminist and a common, all garden feminist. As far as I know, I am in the latter camp and don't see myself as being especially radical but I am not happy about the GRA.

Anyway the question I really want to ask is, is it true that the vast majority of feminists don't have concerns about the GRA? I am assuming, from her tweet that she means that if you aren't happy about the GRA, it then you must desire the erosion of trans rights? I was just wondering if there is any evidence that as a feminist, I am in the minority with my beliefs.

[VickyEadie]

Just read the threads on here. You'll find your answer.

[WombTing]

Ha! But how do I know this isn't just a hub for TERF's as Adrian Harrop reckons and I'm just an oddity? Is there any real evidence?

I am reading lots of twitter at the moment and see feminists and local female political types that I respect and agree with on many issues, accept the trans women are women mantra. It makes me feel like an oddity.

[WombTing]

I was just joking about the hub for TERFs thing, in case it didn't come across. I just wondered if there is any kind of evidence to back up bold statements about what apparently the vast majority of feminists believe.

[PeakPants]

It’s because it’s not worth the shit you would be subjected to if you even hinted at being gender critical. You would get death threats and your employer would be lobbied to sack you. I really cannot be doing with that shit so I shut up. Even people who just follow a GC account get hounded by that dick Harrop. He is out of control.

[VickyEadie]

You're very new, aren't you? And this is the first thing you've ever posted here...

[SlightAggrandising]

It's "common or garden". Welcome to MN.

Adrian Harrop is a dangerous, bullying misogynist.

Feminists aren't dangerous. We don't do victim blaming, we do facts and science. Not feels and bullshit.

[MoggyP]

I don't think MN is remotely representative of all feminists, and that is one reason why posts such as this will get howled at.

Yes, I think you can easily find other viewpoints, both online and in RL, and then decide which you find most reasonable and most widespread.

[WombTing]

@vickieadie I am not new to Mumsnet. I deleted my account recently after getting a savaging on aibu, over something not related to this topic. I wasn't intending to return to Mumsnet after that, as I hadn't predicted that a load of strangers on the internet could make me feel so shit.

However, I have been reading this part of the board for a while one and off see it as very different to the rest of Mumsnet or at least the aibu part of Mumsnet.

[BarrackerBarmer]

The 'radical' in radical feminism doesn't mean 'extreme'
It means 'root'

[VickyEadie]

You said earlier you were a 'new user'.

This forum is filled with threads within which you can find your answer.

[UpstartCrow]

I think most women have a live and let live attitude and expect the same treatment from other people, which they aren't going to get.
They don't expect their niceness to cost them single sex hospital wards, or domestic violence shelters.
And they don't think that women from conservative cultures should stay at home if they can't share a public bathroom with biological men.

But the question is never framed from the point of view of women, and what we want and need.

[AndreaPorkin81]

I'd say that radical feminism is definitely more extreme from my observations.

[WombTing]

@VickyEadie I said I can't link the twitter account as a new user. I know how to do it, as I am an old user l, but with a new account/registration. If you sign up to a new account it seems the technology within the app won't let you add attachments straight away. I assume I have to be a user for a while before I can add attachments. I wanted to put on a screenshot of Huda's twitter, to illustrate my question. Just to be completely clear, I used the expression 'new user' because that is what the app message used when it refused my attachment.

[Datun]

OP, you can't expect the feminists on here to take much time to explain the issue to you. Largely because by the time they have pressed post, the issue will have moved on, yet again.

But also because the issue is quite complex and people have different viewpoints.

The answer to your question is that most feminists will be against self ID. One can get into a protracted discussion about someone who says they are a feminist but is pro self ID. But preferably, not here, as it's pointless.

If you want to know where the women here are coming from, the link below is a good place to start. There really is no substitute for reading.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3246322-A-Beginners-Guide-to-the-Transgender-Debate-A-Signpost-to-Useful-Mumsnet-Threads

[CholloDeNombre]

Radical feminism is about returning to the roots of feminism, centring on women. It's not about "radicalisation". Just to clarify.

There's no club to join, or anything. Pick what you agree with and leave the rest. It's good to ask questions and participate in debating and defending your views; it's how a person discovers their values.

[littlbrowndog]

Actually most ppl against self id

Men women

Am just a women but like the rad fems whoever they ar3 cos they just know the nonsense stuff that the tra are up to

but Yeps I think I am a rad fem and love it

[WombTing]

@Datun thanks for the link. I will have a read through. I have lurked this board a while and read twitter lots, but have lots of gaps to fill.

Over and over I am reading feminists and female politicians cite as fact that most woman and feminists are pro trans rights and pro the GRA, but I never see any firm evidence to back it up.

Coincidentally I have read another thread just started on here that 72% of women are cool with shared spaces, so maybe this is where it is coming from. I would have been too until understood exactly what/who I might be sharing it with.

[littlbrowndog]

I dunno why u getting tied up with what feminist are thinking

U need to use ur brain and think how this works out in real life

[Datun]

Coincidentally I have read another thread just started on here that 72% of women are cool with shared spaces, so maybe this is where it is coming from. I would have been too until understood exactly what/who I might be sharing it with.

Almost the biggest issue here is what people do and don't know.

Most people's tolerance comes to a grinding halt when they realise that 80% of transwomen keep their penises and many, if not most, are attracted to women.

It's no good asking a whole bunch of people a question, if they are ignorant of 80% of the issue.

Asking someone if they believe in transgender rights will generally elicit a yes. Why wouldn't it?

Asking them if they are happy to have a fully intact male who is attracted to women get naked in front of their 12-year-old, most will say no.

Given that the latter question is part of the 'transgender rights', from the first question, you can see the problem.

[littlbrowndog]

Yeps datun exactly

[Rebecca36]

What is a GRA???

[CholloDeNombre]

I think you'll find that most of these surveys and questionnaires are extremely biased and slanted in order to illicit a preferred response.

Which makes me wonder what the questions were on the Punk News survey that gave an 18% in favour rate? I'd like to see that actually.

[WombTing]

@littlbrowndog to be honest if I was told that 95% of feminists don't share my views, I wouldn't change them to fit in but I would feel odd to be in the minority.

What concerns me is when influential people throw out statements like 'vast majority of feminists' think XYZ, it appears to lend a legitimacy to their argument and I worry what that means for the GRA.