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Jenn Smith is a transgender male (born male, expressing fem)

(69 Posts)

MNHQ have commented on this thread.

loveyouradvice Sat 23-Jun-18 16:58:42

... I have just discovered them... wonderfully outspoken and clear about needing to protect the rights of women and children in Canada.... and this is how they describe themselves

But this does so expose the challenge of finding a suitable name for transpeople that all can agree on. Let alone which personal pronouns!

At the moment confusion reins - with people new to the debate (like I was just a few months ago) not clear about which sex/gender transmen and transwomen represent as names - what is appropriate to say (or not say) e.g. TIM, MtF, etc.

It is likely that a name will emerge that all can agree on - a compromise I hope without women giving up the name women, for example.

Does anyone have any idea what it might be?

Personally I am in favour of the clarity of Jenn's approach - calling themselves a transgender male, recognising that what they are doing is expanding the bandwidth of what being male is - and believe that if this was consistently used, in time he would no longer need to use the brackets with fuller explanation.

Snappity Sat 23-Jun-18 17:11:39

This appears goady to me.

TransplantsArePlants Sat 23-Jun-18 17:12:41

That would enrage many

Seems sensible to me, mind you

And people who haven't much thought about it, IMO tend to be very confused by terminology and assume a trans gender woman is a woman who identifies as a man, and vice versa

Noqont Sat 23-Jun-18 17:13:19

This appears goady to me.

Its debate.

TellsEveryoneRealFacts Sat 23-Jun-18 17:13:23

Why is it goady?

I agree with you OP - Jenn Smith is fair and decent and seems to be able to discuss matters without hyperbole.

Kettlepotblackagain Sat 23-Jun-18 17:17:43

Sounds goady to me

So childish - it's not a oneup, payback game you know.

UpstartCrow Sat 23-Jun-18 17:18:06

I don't agree with everything Jenn says, but she has some interesting ideas, and we are able to talk to each other online without any nastiness.
Jenn also has a blog, hopefully someone will come along with the link.

Terfulike Sat 23-Jun-18 17:20:10

Expect an email loveyour

dianebrewster Sat 23-Jun-18 17:21:21

I follow Jenn on twitter. How they describe themselves is their choice, I don't think this post is goody, it's just showing that there are many ways of being trans, and not just one.

The current orthodoxy, being followed by MN, is a bit like any religion telling us that only their way of being Christian / Jewish / Muslim / Hindu / etc is the legit way.

loveyouradvice Sat 23-Jun-18 17:22:21

Transplants I agree that is a key part of the problem....

Certainly not intended to be goady - Jenn Smith is very thoughtful and clear thinking and I am impressed by how he centres children's rights, as well as standing up for women. He seems ready to engage with discussion and is appropriately reflective about other viewpoints, especially when there is a clear rational argument.

Kettlepotblackagain Sat 23-Jun-18 17:25:32

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

RiverTam Sat 23-Jun-18 17:25:34

Miranda Yardley calls himself a transsexual male, which seems pretty accurate to me. And doesn’t appear fussed about pronouns, so I trust I won’t get deleted for misgendering.

GardenGeek Sat 23-Jun-18 17:27:33

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

stillathing Sat 23-Jun-18 17:28:21

Yes this highlights the point that so many of the people offline I have spoken to think, for example, a transman is a man who is now presenting as a woman and vice versa.

Restricting the language we use here is so unhelpful for that reason and because most of the discussion around the rights of women and girls hinge upon sex rather than gender.

PermissionToSpeakSir Sat 23-Jun-18 17:30:35

I like Jenn Smith

Terfulike Sat 23-Jun-18 17:30:59

I agree Jenn Smith is brilliant and does their best to present coherant arguments against the Morganer Oger brigade

TellsEveryoneRealFacts Sat 23-Jun-18 17:35:54

Obviously Jenn Smith is another of the 'wrong type of Trans' for the likes of Snappity. Only the 'right type of Trans' is acceptable.

titchy Sat 23-Jun-18 17:36:01

* This appears goady to me.*

gringringrin Unlike Wakame's thread of course which was oh so up for discussion.

Snappity Sat 23-Jun-18 17:43:57

*"Obviously Jenn Smith is another of the 'wrong type of Trans' for the likes of Snappity. Only the 'right type of Trans' is acceptable." "

No. It is the use of banned terms and trying to use this one example to come up with terminology for all trans people. And the thread has already attracted one poster to say that trans women are really trans men.

spontaneousgiventime Sat 23-Jun-18 17:53:34

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Kettlepotblackagain Sat 23-Jun-18 17:55:00

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

womanformallyknownaswoman Sat 23-Jun-18 18:00:01

I like Jenn Smith - they talk sense and completely understand the undue influence young people are subjected to via social media being weaponised. And why do we have to reject the terms that Jenn describes themselves as - a transgender identified male. I have zero problem with their writing and thinking - particularly their insights into the vulnerability of pre-trans youth:

and in this sense pre-trans youths are already blank slates awaiting a new identity, because there can be no greater a rejection of self than to reject one’s own body and biological self.

They get that body distress is at the root of the confusion of many young people - but that there are multiple causes -as the post Taking it out on your body illustrates. This is a complex area and doesn't warrant black and white, simplistic approaches.

I would go along with this trans person, based on what I have read of theirs - they are remarkedly well researched around cults and coercion and catching people when they are vulnerable and then subjecting them to undue influence, for the gain of vested interests.

I'd like to @MNHQ have them on for a Q&A

BlackeyedSusan Sat 23-Jun-18 18:00:34

transwomen/transman are confusing though if you are new to the debate.

it takes a while to work out which way they are going.

just get the hang of one set of words and they are banned and another set are introduced. It is hard to keep up.

womanformallyknownaswoman Sat 23-Jun-18 18:01:54

Thank You OP for bringing to our attention a transgender person who meets us in our critical thinking

Imnobody4 Sat 23-Jun-18 18:03:54

I have a lot of respect for Jenn Smith. Has both guts and integrity.

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