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The real reason why radical feminists are wary of trans women

(47 Posts)
TimeLady Thu 24-May-18 21:26:29

….according to Mette Leonard in The Spectator

Are we supposed to have heard of her?

blogs.spectator.co.uk/2018/05/the-real-reason-why-radical-feminists-are-wary-of-trans-women/

frogsoup Thu 24-May-18 21:31:20

Bloody hell.
That is the most offensively unpleasant line of 'argument' (for want of a better word) I've had the misfortune of reading in a good while.

ReluctantCamper Thu 24-May-18 21:35:04

hoo boy. professionally goady to the point where it made me chuckle.

Cis women do not so much fear the inclusion of trans women, it seems, as they fear losing their lucrative and comfortable victim position

I haven't turned much of a profit from the structural inequalities that women face, but I guess my cheque's in the post right?

Mette is BarrackerBarmer's 'special girl' from the radical feminist thread writ large.

TimeLady Thu 24-May-18 21:35:10

This extract seems to sum up her view:

Cis women do not so much fear the inclusion of trans women, it seems, as they fear losing their lucrative and comfortable victim position.

H'mmm…..

TimeLady Thu 24-May-18 21:36:05

Ah, you spotted that sentence too. It's a corker.

thebewilderness Thu 24-May-18 21:36:30

They wrote the same "women jealously guard their oppression" regarding the #metoo.
This is what the media still considers feminism. Woman bashing by women.

ReluctantCamper Thu 24-May-18 21:41:34

nah, I don't think even the speccie can regard Mette as a feminist. she's just a professional goady fucker. she's Katie Hopkins with a gamine haircut.

best ignored I think.

Freespeecher Thu 24-May-18 21:57:01

"...creating loopholes for male predators is neither credible not relevant".

I see.

If that's the 'balancing' piece that the Speccie have chosen to go with then it hurts the TRA cause more than the GC one.

Waddlelikeapenguin Thu 24-May-18 22:01:11

My favourite part was when she equated Tara Wolf's unprovoked attack as one side of the same coin as feminists saying true mean things confused

Freespeecher Thu 24-May-18 22:02:24

But that was literal violence!

Waddlelikeapenguin Thu 24-May-18 22:04:18

grin

NoSquirrels Thu 24-May-18 22:06:22

lucrative and comfortable victim position

...relaxes splendidly, nestled amongst my bed of banknotes...

HotRocker Thu 24-May-18 22:06:31

Why is it not relevant? I thought that was the main point. Maybe she should do some research.

ReluctantCamper Thu 24-May-18 22:08:11

relaxes splendidly, nestled amongst my bed of banknotes

yeah, radfems don't burn bras, they burn tenners

booyakasha

Imchlibob Thu 24-May-18 22:17:24

But this bit seems genuinely to be achieving some balance within the article. I can applaud that:

The way trans activists engage in the debate is equally symptomatic of the unproductive culture of victimhood that is predominant in western society today. A hyper-awareness of the singularity of their own predicament makes them blind to the challenges of others. They demand empathy, respect, understanding, and acceptance from the surroundings, but are largely uninterested in the challenges faced by the identity group that they are joining. They demand solidarity from this group, but do not stop to think that they should show solidarity themselves. The fact that what they suffer is highly singular leads them to neglect to consider and respect that cis women – as well as men, the highest placed in the hierarchy of sexual privilege – are having traumatic experiences related to their sex and gender too. They identify as female, but do not show sympathy or solidarity with women. This behaviour is thus also symptomatic of today’s individualistic culture where solidarity has become a foreign word and where you really only join a group to better protect your individual rights and privileges and not out of idealistic reasons or with a view to creating a better society.

LaSqrrl Thu 24-May-18 22:29:41

Cis women do not so much fear the inclusion of trans women, it seems, as they fear losing their lucrative and comfortable victim position

That is the exact position of MRAs against females in general.

With such a word-perfect recital of the MRAism, I have to assume this is a TIM?

AngryAttackKittens Thu 24-May-18 22:32:31

I thought it was going to be "they're jealous because trans women are so pretty", but apparently this is the other kind of anti-feminist goady fucker.

NoSquirrels Thu 24-May-18 22:34:14

Imchlibob this bit's true, and well put.

They identify as female, but do not show sympathy or solidarity with women.

But this sort of smacks of "you women who are only protecting yourselves":
This behaviour is thus also symptomatic of today’s individualistic culture where solidarity has become a foreign word and where you really only join a group to better protect your individual rights and privileges and not out of idealistic reasons or with a view to creating a better society.
Which for me at least is missing the mark. I don't think women have many "privileges" to protect. But I think we have sex-based protections afforded to us as a class precisely because we don't have any privilege. I would love a fairer society.

thebewilderness Thu 24-May-18 23:36:51

I thought it was going to be "they're jealous because trans women are so pretty", but apparently this is the other kind of anti-feminist goady fucker.

There is a bit of that alluded to with this:
Still, feminist cis women are obviously facing a challenge, as they are put under pressure to include into their identity group individuals who perfectly embody an image of femininity conceived by the male gaze.

Mxyzptlk Fri 25-May-18 00:03:16

There are many female people 'who perfectly embody an image of femininity conceived by the male gaze'.
It's not my style but I have no problem with them being in my 'identity group'.

It's actual male biology I have trouble including in my identity group.

IJustHadToNameChange Fri 25-May-18 00:20:56

blogs.spectator.co.uk/2017/11/women-need-to-free-themselves-from-permanent-victimhood/

Not the first time she's written about victimhood.

Lives in London. Literary critic and experimental academic.

The pictures I've found aren't of a transsexual....

DancelikeEmmaGoldman Fri 25-May-18 03:39:18

I'm still waiting for my cheque for protesting; it's exciting to think my woman-victim cheque is in the mail. That'll clear a few bills.

womanformallyknownaswoman Fri 25-May-18 04:37:56

Others have cited women playing the victim card - including other women - blithely ignoring the systemic subjugation and injustices at play that many women have experienced to their economic, educational and health detriment, who have been repeatedly victimised and targeted - this is not imagined but gross structural deficiencies and failures of duty of care whilst ignoring the cause - male violence

StarsAndWater Fri 25-May-18 07:51:59

Just about everyone else has commented on fear losing their lucrative and comfortable victim position comment and for me, this is the crux of it.
This is where I think TRAs and their supporters just don't get it.
They wave away rape rates, sexual harassment, fgm, child marriage and every other way girls and women are actual victims and instead complain of women taking a 'victim position'. They're assuming women have the same kind of power to decide their sexual and life choices that men have. It's shows an utter lack of understanding of what life is like for far too many women and girls.

TimeLady Fri 25-May-18 07:56:40

The Spectator BTL comments are interesting; usually on this subject they're from MRAs, gloating about feminists getting their comeuppance, but they're much more balanced this time. Mumsnet gets a few positive mentions too!

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