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Taylor Swift positioned as Time Person of the Year?

(112 Posts)
Squirrler Wed 06-Dec-17 17:49:55

Moral courage can be found everywhere. There are stories everyday - large and small - of vulnerable people risking their jobs, their reputations, even their lives, to take a stand against abuses of power. If, to reflect the zeitgeist, Time wants to make it about women standing up to sexual abuse, who would argue against that.

But Taylor Swift? One of the most powerful people in modern music, with a personal fortune of millions... that's a choice for the front cover? What did she risk? What was on the line? A man grabbed her bottom and she won a dollar in court. And this is supposed to be inspiration for women to put their own jobs and reputations on the line?

Do me a favour.

I am not questioning the validity of Taylor’s experience or her story. What I have a problem with is what Taylor is being positioned as the face of a movement by being placed on this cover, because she won a lawsuit. She lost nothing when others have lost everything when they break silence, but don’t get visibility. Just look at Ke$ha, whose abuser was her record label boss. She took him to court and lost everything, including her career. She broke silence when there was zero room for it and got shamed into hiding. He even put a gag order on her. Why is she not on the cover?

Why is Tarana Burke not on this cover, when she’s been doing this work for 10 years? Yes, she is on the inside and gets to tell her story but she deserves to be on this cover, because if there is a face for the movement, hers is it.

What about, say, Terry Crews, who is a man who decided to break silence and that shit was major. In this culture of toxic masculinity, men speaking up about their victimhood is revolutionary.

Bobbins43 Wed 06-Dec-17 17:51:20

Terry Crews is one of the people photographed.

Butterymuffin Wed 06-Dec-17 17:52:13

She's not the person, she's one of a group. To focus on her misrepresents that.

Butterymuffin Wed 06-Dec-17 17:53:38

f, to reflect the zeitgeist, Time wants to make it about women standing up to sexual abuse, who would argue against that.

I'm even more puzzled by your post now, because that's what they were doing?

Squirrler Wed 06-Dec-17 18:11:52

The most pertinent question is this: what did she risk? We're talking bravery here, right? What's so brave about a situation in which an extremely rich, famous and powerful person is counter-suing a less wealthy, less famous and less powerful person? What exactly are we applauding? No, not just applauding, but including as one of five faces on the front cover of Time Magazine. 20% of the whole deal.

This is just another extension of power we're talking about: her voice is one of the most prominent, and why? Because the nature of her story is so compelling? Hardly.

cricketqueen Wed 06-Dec-17 18:15:28

Maybe because she has a fan base comprised mainly of teenage girls and she's showing them that it's not right for men to do these things. Also it's not just her she's one of many mentioned. I can't get angry about something that is about trying to empower women.

Squirrler Wed 06-Dec-17 18:24:03

Well... depends on how nuanced your view of 'empowering' is, I guess.

many white women have messaged me to tell me how “disappointed” they are about my stance. Apparently, I should not “shoot arrows internally” and critique Taylor. Internally?? What community do me and Taylor share, besides womanhood? These arrows are external AF. Taylor has never stood for anything I represent, or anyone who looks like me.

Nyx1 Wed 06-Dec-17 19:13:21

OP, you know Taylor Swift didn't sue the guy? He sued her.

She did not ask for this publicity. And I do think it's very helpful that she spoke so bluntly in court.

I'm not clear if you are annoyed with her or Time's decision to put on the cover, but she is one of the people who has had to deal with this and hopefully this might act as a mental support, so to speak, to any young fans who might have to deal with the same thing.

Nyx1 Wed 06-Dec-17 19:14:39

OP "The most pertinent question is this: what did she risk? "

given how these industries work, her entire reputation. (no pun intended). Look at Kesha.

Dippingmytoesin Wed 06-Dec-17 19:21:45

I think it’s that fact she was being sued and countsued the man who groped her for $1 I think she’s being recognised for speaking up in an industry that is known for sexual harassment/assault.

Ereshkigal Wed 06-Dec-17 19:25:57

I don't have a problem with Taylor Swift getting this. At least she's a real fucking woman, that's something!

Dippingmytoesin Wed 06-Dec-17 19:26:45

They’re recognising a lot more than 5 people btw:
Rose McGowan
Terry Crews
Alyssa Milano
Veronica Owusu
Gabrielle Eubank
Crystal Washington
Tarana Burke
Sandra Muller
Celeste Kidd
Jessica Cantlon
Sandra Pezqueda

To name a few, I really like this years choices.

Nyx1 Wed 06-Dec-17 19:32:49

OP I don't know whose words these are in italics
"What community do me and Taylor share, besides womanhood? "

but actually, that community is very important and increasingly under attack.

also, generally, don't get the TS hate.

The Time video has far more people on it, it's embedded here

shhhfastasleep Wed 06-Dec-17 20:20:46

If she made young fans think - "I don't have to put up with this ", she did a good thing and , given how many people pay attention to her, that's a particularly good thing.

Squirrler Wed 06-Dec-17 20:56:54

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Nyx1 Wed 06-Dec-17 21:00:56

OP "No wonder the actual point gets lost. "

sorry to be thick

what is the actual point? I got from your post that you object to TS in particular and not the other famous people on the cover or in the magazine - but I don't understand why?

QuentinSummers Wed 06-Dec-17 21:02:33

I'd rather it was Taylor Swift than Donald Trump or Caitlyn Jenner
I think Taylor did an amazing thing suing that guy and it's nice to see a woman getting this kind of recognition.
I get fed up with the "I don't mind a woman but just not this woman" shit that comes put every time a woman achieves something

Nyx1 Wed 06-Dec-17 21:08:56

oh sorry OP, I was on the mobile when I saw your first post and didn't see the article link.

I'm not white but I can't relate at all to what she says. Also, does she know who might have been asked to be on the cover and might have said no?!

and if it draws more attention to the problem to have TS on the cover, great.

Quentin "I get fed up with the "I don't mind a woman but just not this woman" shit that comes put every time a woman achieves something"

yes. is she barred from the cover because she's most famous and therefore not allowed to be part of #metoo or something?

Dippingmytoesin Wed 06-Dec-17 21:10:54

Apparently Kesha said it was too soon, I don’t know if that’s true but I seen it on a tweet a couple of hours ago.

thatstoast Wed 06-Dec-17 21:17:54

Can't agree with you I'm afraid. Let's all stop and have a think about the reasons why people might dislike Taylor Swift. And dislike lots of other successful women for reasons they can't quite put our finger on.


TheOnlyLivingBoyInNewCross Wed 06-Dec-17 21:18:39

Some of the things she said during the court case were important to say. She was groped, she spoke up, she went through the court case, as another poster says, she has a massive fanbase of young girls and teenagers who have watched their idol say: you know what, you shouldn’t have to endure this just because you’re female and live in a patriarchal world.

InvisibleKittenAttack Wed 06-Dec-17 21:22:14

what did she risk? - she's a young woman who's working in a male dominated industry who rather than quietly settling with the DJ who was suing her, decided to counter sue for $1, forcing herself into having to give evidence in court and have to justify her position and why it's not ok to grab a young woman's arse when she's posed for a photo stood next to you. This will have been against all advice she was given.

The 'risk' was to her reputation. The 'risk' was pissing off the very important men in the industry that do think woman should just accept this as part of the 'cost' of fame and fortune. The 'risk' was that she could lose, be humiliated, be branded a liar, more of a 'snake' than she's already seen by some, and if she won, she wasn't even going to win anything other than a moral victory.

It was a fight she didn't need to have. Most woman in her position would just have quietly had the whole sorry mess go away, and settle for what to her would only be a small sum. The DJ who sued her clearly thought that's the route she would take.

I'm glad a woman who otherwise hasn't been very politically visible and has a very young fan base decided to stand up and take on a fight she didn't need to do.

She had nothing to win here. Pretending she had nothing to lose is rather assuming everyone would just shrug and ignore it if she'd lost.

SweetGrapes Wed 06-Dec-17 21:28:50

I like TS - she speaks up when so many don't.

On another note - just watching Outside Source - Ross Atkins. He said it was all about the strong men and women. The text behind him said "women and men"... but he seems so used to putting men first that he couldn't say it!!

qumquat Wed 06-Dec-17 21:58:46

As others have said Taylor Swift risked her reputation and career, and put herself through a court case she didn't need to to prove an important point. Yes she's successful and powerful. It's funny how so many people dislike successful women.

Ereshkigal Wed 06-Dec-17 22:04:51

And, good grief, can there be one thread without whatever we're calling TERFs these days?

Is that directed at me? DFOD.

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