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Murdered women...

(16 Posts)
Imherefornow Tue 10-Oct-17 18:43:44

Just saw this thread on twitter

I am so gobsmacked. Honestly, I just don't know what to say...

But, I would like all you wonderful women to know that though I am generally a lurker (though quite active about the issues on twitter), it was your patience, knowledge and logic really helped me get to grips with the trans issue. Before this you would definitely have classed me a handmaiden blush

Am rambling...can you tell why I stick to 140 charactersgrin

Imherefornow Tue 10-Oct-17 18:46:19

I swear there were paragraphs before posting! Sorry

QuentinSummers Tue 10-Oct-17 19:14:16

After following Karen Ingala Smith I think it's likely to be because women's murders are euphemistically described as "body found"
Only trans women deserve actually having their demise correctly named in the headline angry

SweetGrapes Tue 10-Oct-17 21:39:12

I googled murdered women on google and got relevant-ish results.
Missing and murdered indigenous women in canada
Couple of sites on killing of women by men, boyfriends...
Counting dead women - KIS

Can't seem to go on the .com site. Redirects to.

Imherefornow Tue 10-Oct-17 22:33:02

Huh! That's interesting sweetgrapes. It doesn't really impact the results when I change domain.

I tried females same results.

Did you have your search terms in quotations? Because I think that would do exact terms match so trans would not be included in results.

I tried women murdered in uk and that brought up examples of actual women murdered. When I typed in US results were all trans women again.

Imherefornow Tue 10-Oct-17 22:35:29

Murdered Women/females/girls will truly be just "bodies found" how tragic sad

Datun Tue 10-Oct-17 22:39:10

It's really no surprise that transwomen are massively over represented in tech.

Facebook is the same, you can't say dyke, unless it's preceded by the word trans. Transdyke. Aka heterosexual man.

Big Brother is watching you.

SevenSheep Tue 10-Oct-17 22:50:12

Isn't this just because violence against trans people is more of a topical issue at the moment?

It's like when you search 'men killed in 2017' on, the top ten results include:
- 7 stories about fatal shootings by police, mostly focusing on black American victims
- 1 story about US police officers shot and killed in the line of duty
- 1 story about the Las Vegas shooting
- 1 story about trans people killed in 2017

Which doesn't apply to 99.9% of male murder victims in the UK.

I'm not trying to start an argument, I just don't think that first tweet proves very much.

DJBaggySmalls Tue 10-Oct-17 23:20:40

I googled 'women killed in 2017' and the top 3 results were list of the deaths of trans people.
There hasnt been a trans person murdered in the UK for a couple of years, but there are 3 or more women murdered every week. Women arent 'topical news', we just die and no one is outraged.

Imherefornow Tue 10-Oct-17 23:36:49

Perhaps you're right seven. I certainly hope this is the case though my inner cynic says no.

I do know how to find out as I have a very 'techie' friend who works in IT data analytics.
I'll get back to you smile

NoLoveofMine Tue 10-Oct-17 23:41:13

Women arent 'topical news', we just die and no one is outraged.

Very much so. Violence against women and girls is so commonplace it's not deemed notable in the media, barely mentioned and the continual attacks on women and girls not named as a major issue.

Imherefornow Wed 11-Oct-17 12:00:10

Ok! So I asked friend about this and I'll try to explain best I can!

It is do do with how search terms work individualy. Searching 'women' should only bring results of women on the first couple of pages because trans has not been included in serch terms. The example he gave was the search term 'loans'.

In 2016 google worked against the main results of the search term 'loans' bringing up pay day loans because unless you specifically searched 'pay day loans' the main search result should bring up only regular loans if you get my meaning. He suggested that pay day loan companies had tweaked the algorithms to attach to the term 'loan' despite it not being included in the search terms. The only exeption to this is advertisements.

In short, while google search does work to an extent on popular searches. The conflation of 'trans' with 'women' shouldn't happen without that term being included in the search which suggests that the algorithm has been manipulated.

However, he also agrees that the topical nature of murdered trans women also plays a role...while in theory, searching for women murdered should bring up just those terms. Trans women murdered would also be included in further pages un order of relevance to original search tterms

In order to conflate 'women murdered' with 'trans' you would search original term then search further through the less relevant results to find 'trans' examples. The more these results are clicked the more google conflate the terms as relevant.

Additionaly! (IKR! My brain hurts) google will also search through your browsing history/cookies to personalize the result to you. However, I cleared my history, cookies and went incognito but the terms trans and women were still conflated.

Interestingly, he noted that prior to 2015 these search terms had not been conflated. Make of that what you will...

He also suggested that there are ways to address this conflation of search terms...though it went a bit above my head grin

I hope this all makes going for a lie down to ease my hurting head grin

Imherefornow Wed 11-Oct-17 12:00:58

Where the heck are my paragraphs gone!?confused

Imherefornow Wed 11-Oct-17 12:00:59

Where the heck are my paragraphs gone!?confused

HornyTortoise Wed 11-Oct-17 17:12:49

Jesus christ..thats actually quite scary.

Ereshkigal Wed 11-Oct-17 17:22:11

Thank you! Very interesting. And concerning.

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