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Am I 'crazy' to defend women I do not know and don't particularly like?

(24 Posts)
macncheesewithbacon Fri 22-Sep-17 15:29:58

I have been told I am a 'crazy feminist' and am interested in opinions.

Is it crazy to defend female celebrities that I hear being slagged in what I consider to be a sexist/misogynistic way?

Today it was Nigella Lawson. I don't own any books and never watched her on TV but I did tell a college that saying he found her gross, like a 'factory farmed breeding sow' was out of order. And why.

A few months ago Britney Spears - a trailer park slag who doesn't know how to behave and should lose custody of her kids. gain, I shut it down.

Others in last year - Ulrika Jonson, Clarissa Flockheart, Mary Beard, the female cast of GOT, Mel and Sue (I do sort of love M&S a bit but having watched bake off maybe 3 times don't have a paid up fan club membership)

I am very interested in what you do when in this position. Am I crazy? Maybe all theses women are dreadful, I don't know them but I can't seem to help myself wading in and shutting down the criticism.

Opinions please smile

glenthebattleostrich Fri 22-Sep-17 15:32:56

No, I'm with you.

You can dislike someone's work without resorting to mysogynistic slurs.

For example, I dislike watching nigella, but can manage to say that without insults.

As an aside I think anyone who uses the term crazy feminist has rolled out of the 1950s and generally just has a problem with women in general.

macncheesewithbacon Fri 22-Sep-17 15:47:15

The man who was slagging off Nigella is 22 and was talking to a 24 year old woman.

SpaghettiAndMeatballs Fri 22-Sep-17 15:55:35

I don't think so - especially if it's a common thing, and it's only women, as it's a rather hostile environment to hear them say that kind of thing - means you can only imagine what they might be saying about you when you're not there.

Just like I wouldn't want to hear people spouting vile opinions on people from any other group. It's unpleasant, unnecessary and unprofessional.

InigoTaran Fri 22-Sep-17 15:59:02

I think by defending those women, you're defending ALL women, as we're all subject to views like that. So thank you!

deydododatdodontdeydo Fri 22-Sep-17 16:01:58

Your colleague sounds horrible, and it sounds like sexism/misogyny is behind it.
I assume he doesn't slag male celebrities in this way. Actually, I bet he does if they are gay.

wtffgs Fri 22-Sep-17 16:03:17

As an aside I think anyone who uses the term crazy feminist has rolled out of the 1950s and generally just has a problem with women in general.

This smile

<currently educating DD about misogyny thanks to misogynistic behaviour in the part of teen boys in her year>

TheCountessofFitzdotterel Fri 22-Sep-17 16:03:46

You're not intervening because Nigella in particular got called a sow, you're doing it because a woman got called a sow. It makes no difference to your point who it was so it doesn't matter if you like her or not.

(BTW, for the record, Mary Beard is lovely. wink)

ILoveDolly Fri 22-Sep-17 16:07:22

I don't think its ever ok to speak about a celebrity or anyone, in these terms. As others have said, defending them is basically defending all women. And YABVVVR to defend Mary Beard she is great (speaking from personal experience) grin

DeleteOrDecay Fri 22-Sep-17 16:19:51

I think by defending those women, you're defending ALL women, as we're all subject to views like that. So thank you!

This, definitely not crazy op.

There was an article about how the England Women's football team manager got the sack recently, one of the players filed a complaint against him for racism (there was an investigation and no evidence found), the comments about her online were awful, essentially blaming her for getting him sacked, misogynistic terms galore. Even though he got sacked for something else entirely. I couldn't help myself, although I usually refrain from arguing with people on Facebook. (I save that for mngrin).

I can't stand seeing people being horrible about others like that. But with women it's always so much more derogatory in my experience and usually involves comments about her sexual behaviour in one way or another.

DJBaggySmalls Fri 22-Sep-17 16:32:58

Good for you. Interesting that he turned on you and called you crazy, isn't it. I bet he's one of those men that knows a lot of crazy women.

Ohyesiam Fri 22-Sep-17 16:36:27

You are standing to for all women. And you are denting the nasty ingrained mindset that allows people to think in that way.

I can imagine some gruesome mass murderer invoking such hatred, but why TV personalities? Such an odd way of relating to the world.

Ohyesiam Fri 22-Sep-17 16:40:08

And " factory farmed breeding sow" , that is some insult.
Did he mean he doesn' t like the way she looks? He could stick to " she's not my type " if asked directly. Or Just shut the fuck up.

macncheesewithbacon Fri 22-Sep-17 16:41:03

They slag people off all the time. It's banter, apparently. But men are slagged off for doing/saying stupid things (Piers Morgan, Trump) women are slagged off for being physically repulsive, fat, mentally ill, badly dressed etc.

Just googled Mary Beard and she does indeed appear to be awesome and not disgusting. Or repulsive. Love her hair actually. Fuck I'm tired of life!

KarlosKKrinkelbeim Fri 22-Sep-17 16:46:29

Perhaps next time, smile sympathetically and say " it's clear that you're not feeling great about your life right now - such vile, poisonous language can only come from a place of great unhappiness. Perhaps a chat with HR might help - I'll mention it to them. I'm sure you don't mean to give such offence to your co workers."
Then leave the little fucker to stew while he wonders if you'll make a complaint.

WhatToDoAboutThis2017 Fri 22-Sep-17 16:49:21

Defending women just because they are women I think is ridiculous.

You should defend both men and women whenever there is a need to; not just women because they happen to have been born a woman.

Gileswithachainsaw Fri 22-Sep-17 16:52:29

I'm with you op

I think it's possible to not particularly like someome but call people out on't he use of disgusting mysoginistic/sexist/racist comments.

But then I hate all this slut shaming and defining people by how many or who they have slept with or their weight etc

NoLoveofMine Fri 22-Sep-17 16:53:01

I think by defending those women, you're defending ALL women, as we're all subject to views like that.

Very much so. I think it's vital to defend all women against misogynist abuse; I do so regarding women I know little of if necessary. The point is they're being criticised in misogynist terms, not because of anything they've done - it's due to their being female. What they're like is irrelevant in my opinion, the point is they shouldn't be criticised on account of being female or with sexist slurs. Someone who resorts to misogyny to criticise a woman is showing they're happy to hold that view about women in general and further normalising such abuse being used against all women and girls.

The comments your colleague made were awful and that he felt comfortable describing a woman in those terms at work shows how endemic misogyny is. As you say, men are criticised for something they personally have said or done, women are criticised in wider, misogynistic terms, looks derided, sexist language used, which is thereby slurring all women.

macncheesewithbacon Fri 22-Sep-17 16:53:36

Ohyesiam - it was her breasts that caused offence I believe, being too large and too pale. Next time I'll call him a "Ronsealled chicken-legged himbo"

DeleteOrDecay Fri 22-Sep-17 16:53:50

No one here has said they don't defend men when appropriate, have they?

NoLoveofMine Fri 22-Sep-17 16:54:16

As well as this I don't think you're "defending" those women personally, it's more you're challenging misogynist language. The specific woman it's being used about isn't actually the issue, it's the language used which slurs all women.

DeleteOrDecay Fri 22-Sep-17 16:58:18

And it's not 'defending women because they're women'. That implies women can never be at fault, which of course isn't true.

The the use of misogynistic language against women, which affects all women, that people are referring to here.

I'd imagine if a woman was heard using misogynistic language about another woman she would be called out on it by most people here. Internalised misogyny is a big problem.

macncheesewithbacon Fri 22-Sep-17 16:59:49

My defense of Britney is hilariously legendary in my family as well. Love Britney, don't know why. grin - I assume it's because she seems like someone who has been let down by everyone who was supposed to support her.

Blanchefleur Fri 22-Sep-17 19:44:41

The point is they're being criticised in misogynist terms, not because of anything they've done - it's due to their being female.

Exactly this. You are totally correct to call out what is, essentially, hate speech. Just think, if he were making similar comments about the physical appearance of people of colour, you wouldn't be asking yourself if you were crazy to object to this!

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