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Can anyone give me some resources for my husband re porn from a radical feminist standpoint

(15 Posts)
Aliasnumberone Mon 27-Feb-17 23:33:56

Back ground is we were watching broadchurch and when olivia colemans character was called into the school because her teenage son was caught with porn on his phone. My horror at the prospect of having to deal with out 2yr old son in the future watching porn was met with derision by dh.

He's not a feminist and is fairly blind to everyday sexism, he doesn't watch porn though I know he did in his teens and early twenties. He reckons it's normal and fine.... I tried to argue that he has no idea how abusive porn is, especially these days, and has no idea how negative its effects are on both young men and women who are expected to live up to what they see and become desensitised to.

He wasn't receptive at all, and said something along the lines of 'why do you think it's just abusive towards women and not men too...' at that point I was too pissed off to discuss it (and wanted to watch the telly without having a domestic) so told him we'd have to discuss it properly later.

I'd really like to discuss it with him properly. I think we have a duty as parents to help our children navigate their childhood and teenage years. Yes they will be exposed to porn, I think the average age is 11 these days? But I want them to understand what it is, why it's not representative of most sexual relationships, why they shouldn't base their expectations on it and why they shouldn't tolerate anyone else's porn influenced sexpectations.

I love the Gail dines lecture I saw recently on YouTube but I think she's too much of a feminist for her to be accessible to him as a jumping off point. Does anyone have any more mainstream articles about the damages of the current porn industry on young people I can read and discuss with him?

Btw, this isn't a post asking for anyone to come on and tell me I'm a swerf and insult me or try to argue that I should be 'sex positive' I have both a young daughter and a son and I want resources to help us as parents educate them to respect their own bodies and those of their future boyfriends and girls friends.

venusinscorpio Mon 27-Feb-17 23:38:56

I definitely remember one posted quite recently about how young girls were increasingly feeling pressured to do things they weren't comfortable with. Think it might have been Australian, if that helps jog anyone's memory?

Aliasnumberone Mon 27-Feb-17 23:58:33

Don't remember seeing that one Venus, thanks though I'll poke about and try to find it.

AnyFucker Tue 28-Feb-17 00:00:35

Seriously ? I couldn't be arsed. Let him do his own gruntwork research

It's not up to women to educate these intellectually challenged men.

Prawnofthepatriarchy Tue 28-Feb-17 00:05:59

It's extremely important to know about porn and to prepare your DC for it. One of mine came to me while still at primary school - one of his friends had been showing him the most vile stuff. My poor DS was so upset. We had a very long chat. The main thing that frightened him was that he thought he'd have to do the stuff he'd watched, and he hated what he'd seen. If your DH hasn't watched porn recently he may not be aware how degrading so much of it is now. The stuff my DS had been shown definitely was.

I think I'm safe in saying that none of the regulars here would dream of insulting you or argue that you should be sex positive. We're not pro-porn. In fact, if you look back down the Feminist board you'll find a long thread about the effects of porn on boys.

I just Googled "effects of porn on children teenagers" and got a shedload of links including one from Psychology Today. But you'll get more specifically feminist material from the thread I mention.

Aliasnumberone Tue 28-Feb-17 00:51:24

Thanks prawn, I'll read that thread tomorrow. Good to know there's a feminist space that isn't full of choicey choicey liberal bollocks, it's nice to have like minded women for support.

Any fucker hmm thanks confused just as well you're not married to him then isn't it

Fairyflaps Tue 28-Feb-17 06:02:04

This article summarises a few articles about how porn harms teenagers. Mostly Australian, but normal newspapers (albeit more right wing ones)
www.collectiveshout.org/internet_pornography_warping_teens_attitudes_towards_women_and_sex
This one from Alison Pearson in the UK Telegraph is often quite effective for parents of girls
www.telegraph.co.uk/women/mother-tongue/11554595/Pornography-has-changed-the-landscape-of-adolescence-beyond-all-recognition.html
I think the Telegraph has had quite a bit on the subject over the years. Although it is not a paper I usually read, it has been a useful source for trying to persuade my male Tory MP of the need for compulsory SRE to counter what children are otherwise likely to learn from porn about sex and relationships.

sashh Tue 28-Feb-17 06:51:37

See if you can find 'Tyger takes on porn' on you tube - unfortunately not on bbc at the moment. www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0441whb

It's from the perspective of a young man rather than feminist but does explore some of the problems such as teenage girls thinking it's normal to have what one describes as 'forced anal sex', she doesn't say rape.

Actually that's a start - why are there hundreds of 'forced x, y z' on porn sites and not rape?

Interesting perspective from a BDSM 'model' and director Princess Donna, "I grew up in a Silence of the Lambs culture, a culture where rape and killing women are very common themes for movies and TV shows. Society isn't afraid of sex and violence; they are afraid of women owning their own bodies and controlling their own sexuality—which is what happens in BDSM."

abeandhalo Tue 28-Feb-17 06:58:23

Wonder whether the Feminist Porn Awards might have any resources that explain why what they cover is better?

Datun Tue 28-Feb-17 09:22:52

alias

You might do better to get him to understand it in terms of your daughter. In my experience, men who see nothing wrong with porn tend to see it purely through the male gaze (a problem in itself), but don't tend to associate the women and girls they know with the women and girls in the films.

There was an article, (I think Daily Mail) about a new app called Yellow aimed at 13-year-olds, which is along the lines of Tinder. The author of the piece logged on as a 13-14 year-old and was utterly shocked that every time she liked a picture of a boy, the first message back was 'send nudes' or 'show tits'.

She also mentioned that a new, popular porn theme is women who have had an anal prolapse, due to violent anal sex. They are actively sought out online.

I think a lot of men are turned on by fairly tame porn, but don't realise that it is the tip of the iceberg. They become uncomfortable because they don't associate themselves with the more degrading aspects.

In order to get your point across, you might have to play something of a subtle game. Assuring him that you're not accusing him of anything, just to get him to listen.

There was another thread on here a few weeks ago about an Italian study that said 40% of teenage boys couldn't get an erection for 'normal' sex because they had become desensitised by the extreme porn they had been exposed to.

I feel for you with regards to your son, but you can gently point out, when he is older, women who are objectified and why is wrong. And when he gets a phone, you need the Big Talk.

0phelia Tue 28-Feb-17 15:13:25

Psychologies.co.uk had a long running campaign (a few years back) raising awareness about the damaging effects of free online porn especially relating to school children.
Have a hunt around their site!

ChocChocPorridge Tue 28-Feb-17 16:07:49

Send him to the front page of any porn site.

Ask him if he really thinks it's a sign of a healthy mind, a healthy society to refer to women in the way that they are.

Ask him if they refer to men that way.

That worked for my DP who hadn't really thought through the harm being done until I suggested that exercise

BeyondUnderthinking Tue 28-Feb-17 16:21:15

I haven't seen it myself, but I saw "Hot Girls Wanted" (a Netflix documentary on how the porn industry abuses and then spits out young women) was recommended by a few women as their 'lightbulb' moment recently

Prawnofthepatriarchy Tue 28-Feb-17 18:21:06

Talking about the normalization of violent degrading porn often makes me wonder what my long dead DH would have made of it. The porn I remember watching with him was so, so different to the stuff available for free for primary school aged kids. Different, more innocent times.

Actually, no, I know what he would have made of it. He would have been disgusted. Like all good men - or emotionally healthy adults, I guess - his main pleasure in sex was the happiness of his partner. We had a wonderful sex life: generous, uninhibited

When I read that young men are having erectile dysfunction from watching porn I am filled with sorrow. I expect I'm not alone in remembering the entire weekends spent in bed, the being unable to keep your hands off each other. And the young are being deprived of that. It's really sad. Teachers should be telling boys that porn can wreck their sex lives.

As for anal sex, I appreciate that some women genuinely like it, but it seems like a way to avoid the woman having any real enjoyment. Gay men enjoy being penetrated anally because it provides stimulation of the prostate. But women don't have a prostate. I gave it a go once. Never again. But girls these days are being pressured into this and other acts because it's now become a porn staple. It's painful, it's physically risky and it doesn't go anywhere near the clitoris. What's not to love?

zsazsagaboredom Wed 01-Mar-17 21:04:54

I think this is the Australian schoolgirls initiative mentioned upthread
fightthenewdrug.org/sex-before-kissing-15-year-old-girls-dealing-with-boys/

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