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Young trans suicide statistics - v interesting analysis

(20 Posts)
CaroleService Mon 20-Feb-17 08:18:40

www.transgendertrend.com/a-scientist-reviews-transgender-suicide-stats/

WinnieTheW0rm Mon 20-Feb-17 08:22:38

It's been known for decades that suicide rates are much higher in the trains community. This just reinforces that it has, sadly, not changed.

It is a minority community and this reinforces the need additional support, sympathy and tolerance.

Recent levels of transphobia must make it so much harder.

Aliasnumberone Mon 20-Feb-17 08:32:58

Winnie did you read the article? I have it states that the 48% suicide rate that mermaids has repeatedly quoted and in parliament as we'll is based on a sample size of 27

There is also mounting evidence that the high suicide rate in the trans community cannot be attributed to dysphoria alone and that there are a myriad of contributing factors, most notably an extremely high comirbidity of mental health issues.

I totally agree with you that as a minority group transfolk should be treated with additional support and sympathy, but as I see it just advocating for transing minors and dishing out puberty blockers with out offering proper counselling and psychological support is counter productive.

Parents are being emotionally blackmailed into fast tracking their children down the trans route to save them from suicide when actually in many cases I just see it as a temporary fix to a long term underlying issue

CaroleService Mon 20-Feb-17 08:33:00

Did you actually read the analysis, Winnie?

TabascoToastie Mon 20-Feb-17 08:43:07

Yes, and trans people have the highest rate of murder and abuse too.

Literally every single trans person I know (I used to volunteer for a GLBT charity) has been forced into street prostitution to pay for their gender reassignment. Truly tragic.

Datun Mon 20-Feb-17 08:58:23

If this attempted suicide rate was converted into successful attempts, according to The Samaritans' figures, you would be seeing a trans teen killing themselves at the rate of one per week in the U.K. More in the US.

This is clearly not happening.

I'm not saying that trans people don't suffer abuse. I'm sure they do. However if anyone can point me to a list of transpeople being killed here in the UK, I'd be very interested. I haven't been able to find any. Not one.

Abuse against anyone, trans or otherwise, needs to be addressed. But figures need to reflect reality. Otherwise you can't tackle the problem.

CaroleService Mon 20-Feb-17 08:59:00

Have all the trans people you know had grs, Tabasco? I thought the rate was 25-30%

Aliasnumberone Mon 20-Feb-17 08:59:39

tabasco I'm genuinely interested in the answer to this so please don't write this off as goady. I've often wondered about the prostitution side of it. I know that a lot of transfolk struggle to pay for surgeries and end up doing things that they wouldn't otherwise have chosen to fund their transition. How much of the abuse of transwomen is at the hands of johns rather than the general jo blogs walking down the street? It's seems to me that prostituation and especially the type of prostituation that trans women find themselves puts them in the way of violent men, again especially as trans women who may have johns who are looking for transwomen because of internalised homophobia.

To me the fact that privatised medicine especially in the states has contributed to the stats of abuse specifically be being such a profit driven institution. I'd love to see unbiased stats for violence against transfolk to compare between the uk and the us.

ChocChocPorridge Mon 20-Feb-17 09:47:42

I've not worked supporting trans people. I work in IT. I've known two transwomen, both worked in IT, only one had surgery and paid for it from their wages.

White, male trans are not at high risk of violence. Poor, black transwomen are, and, if you look at the murder and violence rates of prostituted women, it would suggest to me that the significant attribute that is causing the murder violence isn't trans status, but being a prostitute (ie. It's male violence again).

wigglybeezer Mon 20-Feb-17 16:17:49

A MtT contemporary of my son's committed suicide at university, despite having family, community, and school support to transition (and good friends). Best practice was followed but it was not enough. It came to light that more than one member of the family had mental health issues. I definitely think co-morbid mental health issues are a complicating factor and also second those who have made a link between girls+ autism + fall in anorexia+rise in FtT.

Prawnofthepatriarchy Mon 20-Feb-17 16:43:25

The much quoted suicide rate is nonsense. Here's another analysis from the blog 4th Wave Now.

The reason the American system stopped funding surgery for transwomen was that the patients' MH actually worsened in the years afterwards, presumably when they realised that having been through major mutilating surgery they hadn't become the woman of their dreams.

I am convinced that therapy is the way forward for people who insist that they really are the opposite sex. It's disordered thinking, just like being transabled or anorexic.

RaisinsAndApple Mon 20-Feb-17 18:35:55

How the hell has a statistic based on a sample of 27 been incorporated into a government review that will likely change laws? Bloody hell. Do these government enquiries have no critical analysis of the stats they use?!?

Datun Mon 20-Feb-17 23:21:11

raisins

I agree. There is absolutely NO due diligence

Ffs - an intern with an iPhone and a spare half hour could find all this stuff out.

user1487544648 Tue 21-Feb-17 00:10:03

If you are interested in the actual report you can find in Figure 3 and Figure 4 that clearly show the suicidality and self harm rates of 27 trans people compared to 458 "cis" people. Bear in mind that the recruitment criteria was very strict in that for P1Q Recruits:

"To be included in this phase of the study, individuals had to be 18
years of age or older, identify as LGB or Trans*, have experience from
one of the three mental health issues under study but have been in
recovery from them at least five years prior to enrolment in the study.
In the case of the suicide group, their first suicide attempt was to have
occurred after they were aged from 12 years up to and including age
24. At least six years must have passed since their last serious attempt.
The study specifically prioritised participants whose attempt had been
life threatening whether or not it had been committed with intention
to die."

For the second group ie P2Q the selection criteria was equally strict:

"For this phase of the research we were interested in interviewing
individuals who had experienced traumatic events while growing
up but who did not develop mental health issues later in life (the
‘resilience’ group); as well as those who did not experienced traumatic
events growing up but did develop mental health issues (the ‘risk’
group). For the second group we were also interested in interviewing
individuals who, meeting those criteria, also developed one of the
three key mental health issues of the study: had attempted suicide
while growing up (identifying as LGB or Trans*); had abused alcohol
(identifying as a lesbian, gay or bisexual woman); and had excessive
body image preoccupations (identifying as a gay or bisexual man). "

Anyone with a modicum of intelligence can readily see how using stats from such a study can be "massaged" for the greatest effect of scaremongering. It is worth noting that the stats used by Mermaids come from the larger survey recruits i.e. 2078. The make up of this group was:

"Between June and November 2013, a total of 2,078 valid surveys were
collected. Of all participants, 700 (36.5%) identified as heterosexual,
and 1,320 (63.5%) as LGB+, of which 29.9% were gay, 16.8% lesbians,
16.7% bisexual and 2.8% identified with having an alternative sexual
orientation (e.g. pansexual, asexual, queer)."

I will leave you to draw your own conclusions but here is the actual report from which the figures were derived: eprints.worc.ac.uk/3743/1/RARE-Report-WEB_version_final_20150319.pdf

Astoria7974 Tue 21-Feb-17 00:15:08

Suicide and MH rates amongst lgbt+ teens is higher in general because society expects them to conform in ways they can't as children, and that shit will haunt you for the rest of your life.

user1487544648 Tue 21-Feb-17 00:36:15

Astoria I do not doubt for one moment that poor mental health is prevalent within the LBGT groups but to use inaccurate statistics for the sole purpose of promoting a specific agenda is highly questionable.

Prawnofthepatriarchy Tue 21-Feb-17 00:54:57

Lying about the risks is highly irresponsible. We saw in the recent BBC documentary how one poor woman had transitioned because her therapist told her that if she didn't she would kill herself. Now she's detransitioned and trying to come to terms with her double mastectomy, facial hair etc.

If she had been given accurate advice she might be very much better off.

user1487544648 Wed 22-Feb-17 12:22:43

Finally a UK petition re Gender Identity Bill : citizengo.org/en-gb/pc/41304-say-not-dangerous-gender-identity-bill?tc=fb&tcid=32808372

Aliasnumberone Wed 22-Feb-17 13:32:09

User, your link's broken, I copied and pasted and couldn't find it. Can you link again please?

SoulSearcher101 Wed 22-Feb-17 13:53:38

Alias did you mean this link: citizengo.org/en-gb/pc/41304-say-not-dangerous-gender-identity-bill?tc=fb&tcid=32808372

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