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Equal Civil Partnerships Campaign

(43 Posts)
YetAnotherSpartacus Wed 11-Jan-17 08:31:32

I was wondering if people had seen this?

equalcivilpartnerships.org.uk/

Basically, it is a campaign to extend 'civil partnerships' provisions to heterosexual couples (those who do not wish to enter into marriage, for whatever reason).

I'm a supporter because I'm not a fan of traditional marriage and think that all couples should have the choice between a legal partnership and a formal marriage.

As they say on their website,

"Many people would like to have their partnerships legally recognised, but want to avoid the social expectations, pressures and traditions surrounding marriage and have the choice to enter into a more modern form of legal union.

A recent government consultation found that 20% of different-sex, unmarried people would prefer to form a civil partnership than marry or live together – current laws that prohibit this are outdated, unjust and discriminatory".

There is a petition to sign and people are also being asked to send emails of support to MP's, as per this link:

fast-plains-92257.herokuapp.com/campaigns/support-civil-partnerships-bill

I thought women here might be interested in the campaign and consider supporting it.

lokisglowstickofdestiny1 Wed 11-Jan-17 08:34:38

But you put the social expectations on yourself. We married at a registery office, two witnesses, no fuss, no photos or reception - cost about £300. Why do we need this?

Penfold007 Wed 11-Jan-17 08:35:32

I'd also like to see another option being considered - end civil partnerships for same sex couples. Either have civil partnership and marriage available for all equally irrespective of gender or just have one form of legal partnership available to all.

YetAnotherSpartacus Wed 11-Jan-17 08:50:28

But you put the social expectations on yourself. We married at a registery office, two witnesses, no fuss, no photos or reception - cost about £300. Why do we need this?

Marriage as an institution and weddings as events are different things.

I'd also like to see another option being considered - end civil partnerships for same sex couples. Either have civil partnership and marriage available for all equally irrespective of gender or just have one form of legal partnership available to all.

Eh? I don't quite understand why.

lokisglowstickofdestiny1 Wed 11-Jan-17 08:53:23

What's the difference between a civil partnership and a marriage carried out at a registry office? As far as I was concerned my marriage was simply a legal contract between myself and my husband - it wasn't an event as such.

YetAnotherSpartacus Wed 11-Jan-17 08:56:12

What's the difference between a civil partnership and a marriage carried out at a registry office?

It isn't just a day in a frilly dress (weeding) ... it is a legal contract with associated rights and responsibilities (marriage).

lokisglowstickofdestiny1 Wed 11-Jan-17 08:59:26

So what's a civil partnership? We got married for financial reasons - tax planning - with marriage you get better rights with regards inheritance tax for example. Do you not get any rights with a civil partnership?

YetAnotherSpartacus Wed 11-Jan-17 09:07:50

So what's a civil partnership? We got married for financial reasons - tax planning - with marriage you get better rights with regards inheritance tax for example. Do you not get any rights with a civil partnership?

The point is that mixed sex couples cannot enter into Civil Partnerships. The campaign aims toward changing this so that they can.

Reading their page is instructive in terms of understanding their perspective and reasons for wanting this change.

tribpot Wed 11-Jan-17 09:09:23

What is the difference between a civil partnership and a marriage?

Lottapianos Wed 11-Jan-17 09:10:19

Yes I've been aware of this campaign since the beginning and am a big fan. Thanks for sharing OP. I believe a judgement on the appeal is due soon and I very much hope they are successful

MorrisZapp Wed 11-Jan-17 09:13:28

I think it's a brilliant campaign. I remember when civil partnerships were first brought in, I was like 'yay! DP and can do that!'. I was totally gobsmacked to learn that because we are opposite sex we are not allowed to.

Exactly the same options should be available to all couples.

lokisglowstickofdestiny1 Wed 11-Jan-17 09:14:50

No they can't have a civil partnership as they can get married - sorry but I think there are more important things to be campaigning about. Mixed sex couples can get married, your post says it's about social expectations, pressure and traditions. You don't need to have that angst with a marriage if you don't want to - no one forces anyone into a big white wedding - there is nothing in a marriage contract that says you have to dress up, spend 30k and have a fight with your relatives at the reception grin

HelenDenver Wed 11-Jan-17 09:15:02

Thanks op, I will sign

HelenDenver Wed 11-Jan-17 09:15:59

"- sorry but I think there are more important things to be campaigning about."

Awesome - start a thread about them and hopefully you'll get support!

FinallyHere Wed 11-Jan-17 09:21:19

Another big fan here, thank you for pointing it out. After many, many years, we got married for tax planning reasons but would have much, much preferred a civil partnership. Why?

trivial example, no matter what i say, my mother addresses letters to me as "Mrs" <his initials> <his name>. I remember the days when a women with a good salary, still needed a man, even if he was unwaged, to sign a mortgage application for her and when rape inside marriage was not recognised. I am aware of the rule that allowed a husband to beat his wife, so long as he used a stick no thicker than his thumb. I refused to get married when it meant that my tax return would automatically be sent to my husband.

So, yes, I would like a formal way to acknowledge my relationship with my now husband, and gain the tax benefits, which is not overshadowed with unfairness.

YetAnotherSpartacus Wed 11-Jan-17 09:23:20

What is the difference between a civil partnership and a marriage?

Go and read the links on the website and you will be enlightnened.

No they can't have a civil partnership as they can get married - sorry but I think there are more important things to be campaigning about. Mixed sex couples can get married, your post says it's about social expectations, pressure and traditions. You don't need to have that angst with a marriage if you don't want to - no one forces anyone into a big white wedding - there is nothing in a marriage contract that says you have to dress up, spend 30k and have a fight with your relatives at the reception

biscuit

Awesome - start a thread about them and hopefully you'll get support

Exactly.

Lotta, Morris and Helen - thank you!

As well as signing do consider sending the form email to your MP. There is a link above smile

lokisglowstickofdestiny1 Wed 11-Jan-17 09:25:58

Don't need to Helen others have already done that - have signed a couple of petitions which stem from threads on here in the last week or so.

HelenDenver Wed 11-Jan-17 09:27:41

Here you go, Loki:

"From a personal perspective, the legacy of marriage – that it treated women as property for centuries, excluded same-sex couples until 2014, and still leaves room only for fathers’ names on marriage certificates – means that marriage is not an option for us. We want to raise our child as equal partners and feel that a civil partnership – a modern, symmetrical institution – sets the best example for her."

lokisglowstickofdestiny1 Wed 11-Jan-17 09:27:54

Oh my first biscuit - yum!

BeyondTheStarryNight Wed 11-Jan-17 09:31:58

I support this, I'd rather be partnered civilly than married
(Though would we have to divorce first or could we just amend our contract?)

MorrisZapp Wed 11-Jan-17 09:32:24

Just to point out a small caveat, in Scotland our birth, death and marriage certificates have always included mothers info as well as fathers. Death certificates of women list all surnames a woman has had, and are indexed under all.

The English way of registering BMDs is scandalous, I can't believe there isn't a huge campaign about it.

HelenDenver Wed 11-Jan-17 09:34:50

There is a campaign, Morris, it went quite far but I think ran out of Parliamentary time or something. There's threads about it on here.

YetAnotherSpartacus Wed 11-Jan-17 09:38:24

Just to point out a small caveat, in Scotland our birth, death and marriage certificates have always included mothers info as well as fathers. Death certificates of women list all surnames a woman has had, and are indexed under all

And you make damn fine Whisky too. In my next life I'm either coming back as an Italian or a Scott. I can't decide which.

Seriously, I utterly agree with you.

tribpot Wed 11-Jan-17 09:46:11

Go and read the links on the website and you will be enlightnened.
Thanks - you're really winning me over to your cause.

I had a look at Why Does It Matter and the case seems to be:

- a form of legal union available to same sex couples should be available to opposite sex couples as well

Not totally unreasonable, but weren't civil partnerships brought in as a (temporary) way of appeasing religious groups, and can now be phased out since we have marriage equality?

- Many of those who support equality between women and men view marriage as a sexist institution – typified by traditions such as the father ‘giving the bride away’ to the husband, or the bride playing the role of ‘unspoiled’ virgin though the wearing of white

So this is all about the wedding and not about the marriage itself. I didn't do either of these things at my wedding.

- it 'others' LGBT couples
By having another type of legal institution it implies that there is something different about LGBT couples. Right - except another solution to that is to not have civil partnerships any more, esp given we now have marriage equality.

The government did publish a comparison of the two options in order to help same sex couples make a decision about which to adopt - unfortunately it's a Word document but it is available for download here.

Excluding cosmetic differences like the notice containing the Registration Authority of residence of both parties rather than their addresses for civil partnerships, the key differences appear to be:

- the certificate has both parents listed on it in a civil partnership
I have been following the campaign to list mothers on marriage certificates for some time now and would still want to see this form of equality included in marriage certificates

- you can't annul a civil partnership on the grounds of one party having a communicable venereal disease

- you can't dissolve a civil partnership on grounds of adultery

That's it.

Gay Star News wrote an article before same sex marriage was legalised which I think also highlights some differences:

- pension rights (although these seem to have been equalised)
- reciprocal recognition - countries where same sex marriage is legal don't recognise the validity of civil partnerships

Gini99 Wed 11-Jan-17 09:49:41

What is the difference between a civil partnership and a marriage?

I don't think the campaign is really about practical, financial or legal differences. As the website says: "There is essentially very little difference in legal terms between marriage and civil partnerships, with both conferring the same rights on things like tax, inheritance and pension provision. There are however a number differences between civil partnerships and marriage when it comes to the formation and administration processes."

Essentially it's a question of whether we should have different institutions available to couples that depend on their respective sexes. Actually their case went to the Court of Appeal several months ago but the decision hasn't been made yet.

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