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"But what's the harm?" (Trans-related thread)

(25 Posts)
WombOfOnesOwn Mon 14-Nov-16 17:54:03

One of the things many transactivists bring up when people argue against the trans idea from a feminist perspective is "who's it hurting, really? Why does it hurt anyone to say that abortion/menstruation could be a man's issue, or that sperm banking is a women's issue?"

Well, I'm in the US. In a few months, when we have a new president, it's very likely abortion will be coming under fire from our lawmakers and there won't be much way for feminists to fight what's coming. Because the language of "proper" feminism has now led to being unable to describe abortion and contraception as a women's rights issue, the right to choose whether to continue or terminate a pregnancy will be much harder to fight for.

Feminism has turned into such a circular firing squad, with everyone hastening to scold themselves over being too white, too "cis," too able-bodied, or whatnot, that it has become difficult to talk about issues that affect wide swaths of the female population.

It has real effects: Instead of discussing the possibility of storing abortion pills and such for the coming years, feminists of my acquaintance on Facebook are talking about stockpiling estradiol for MTFs.

Instead of worrying about the fact that women's programs and shelters are likely to be gutted, there's hand-wringing about the handful of trans murders this year, unsubstantiated mass trans suicide rumors, and dire predictions that 2017 will be much bloodier. This, in spite of the fact that so far, a very small fraction of those murders was even motivated by the victim's trans status (most have been domestic violence, same as suffered by us ordinary "cis" women).

At a time when a serial sexual assaulter is going into the White House (replacing a black man who was elected in a landslide), women are being told that the failure of a white woman to win an election over a white man is proof of racism, and are told to put their energy into efforts to ensure that Muslim refugees (almost exclusively boys and men) are protected, that prisoners (a vast majority of whom are boys and men) are protected, and so on.

Feminism has become the "mommy movement" responsible for putting plasters on the boo-boos of hurting men, and the chickens have come home to roost -- and now, the women's movement has become so fractured I am not even sure it knows how to reunite and present women's issues with a front of solidarity and far-reaching vision.

White women without a college degree in the US are the only demographic in a developed country whose lifespan has declined in recent years, and no one's even looking into why it's happening. Maternal deaths are up across all racial demographics, especially in the southern states. The most common cause of death for pregnant women is murder in some states. West coast cities have experienced major surges of drink-drugging happening in plain sight at generally-reputable bars and clubs.

These aren't issues feminism is allowed to center around, now, and the trans issue was the start of it. Just focusing on female human beings is an affront to all of the male human beings who have an unorthodox gender presentation, or darker skin, or are impoverished, or disabled, or have any other traits that might make them have problems.

The idea of these men having their own movement that doesn't enlist women as the primary footsoldiers? Preposterous. Only good mommy feminism can help. When feminism puts itself first, it's being a bad mommy, a selfish mommy, and the men will throw a tantrum until it stops.

How long will this continue before women see what's happening?

VincentVL Mon 14-Nov-16 18:38:04

I see it, I think lots of us see it. The media dont give us any airspace but thats nothing new.

Good post though.

LumpySpacedPrincess Mon 14-Nov-16 18:45:23

Yep, we can no longer state what a woman in case it upsets a small minority.

StealthPolarBear Mon 14-Nov-16 18:45:35

But we have social media now which plays a negative part imo

StealthPolarBear Mon 14-Nov-16 18:46:12

Do you mean a not-man lumpy?

LumpySpacedPrincess Mon 14-Nov-16 19:02:12

Ah yes, not man, green party we salute you.

LastGirlOnTheLeft Mon 14-Nov-16 19:03:30

A day never goes by now when I don't feel sickened by men. Women get tortured and abused at men's hands, and their response? It is never, 'Where are the men saying NOT IN MY NAME!' No, their response is always, 'Where are the feminists?'. They want feminist women to do more to stop men killing us.

Feminists these same men are desperately trying to silence.

LastGirlOnTheLeft Mon 14-Nov-16 19:06:47

Sorry....that was a little off-topic. I am just so fucked off with men and their many ways of hurting women. I think most women are doing what Dworkin said....believing in men's humanity despite all evidence to the contrary. Something like that anyway. I keep hoping they will SEE as we do the awful injustices they keep meting out to women and DO something as a group. But they never do.

VincentVL Mon 14-Nov-16 19:08:46

Luckily the trans movement has helpfully provided all former-women with a host of new labels to identify ourselves with - non-men, menstruators, breeders, vagina fetishists, terfs..

VincentVL Mon 14-Nov-16 19:09:45

They never do anything because theyre too busy telling us what to do.

MysticTwat Mon 14-Nov-16 19:18:01

I thought Obama had sorted things so trump can't mess with abortion and contraception?

WombOfOnesOwn Mon 14-Nov-16 19:33:10

There's no way to protect it once the Supreme Court has been taken over by new conservative appointees. I fear the end of safe, legal abortion in the United States will likely come before 2020.

DeviTheGaelet Mon 14-Nov-16 20:55:02

Great post. star star

What is happening with abortion rights is terrifying. Not just in Americu but also Poland, Ireland. It's scary how easy women's rights can be taken from them.

IAmAmy Mon 14-Nov-16 21:42:27

I have so many issues with trans activism/transfeminism/TERF accusations. There is a feminist society at my school and half the meetings are dominated by slating "TERF"s for something one has said online. We're a girls' school. Yet apparently the statement "penis is male" is transphobic, if anyone defines as a woman they should be treated as such, any woman who objects to someone ostensibly a man but who defines as a woman is a TERF. Gosh it irks me.

IAmAmy Mon 14-Nov-16 21:43:49

Sorry I think that was off topic. The threat to abortion rights is one we all have to fight. They're under threat in the UK too, Northern Irish women never had them to be under threat either.

Showmeagain Mon 14-Nov-16 21:50:59

Whilst I agree with you OP I do think the feminist movement spending so much energy on the transfer issue is counter productive

Their oxygen can be taken away. Refusal to discuss could be a start. Concentrating on the real issues at hand. On the real movement with trump et al the publicity just gives them more influence. Do what men do to women. Ignore ignore ignore. Focus on what we need NOT on transport issues

Showmeagain Mon 14-Nov-16 21:51:18

Not transfer trans

IAmAmy Mon 14-Nov-16 22:01:49

Showmeagain I agree with that but it's incredible how much of feminism with girls my age is taken over by discussing trans issues. It's so much of our feminist society at school, seems to have dominated most feminist conversations I've seen online, it's frustrating. In fact I've seen feminist groups online which spend more time attacking "cis women" or "transmisogyny" than...misogyny.

Showmeagain Mon 14-Nov-16 23:01:23

Then they need to be guided towards the actual significant issues of our day. Why us it still acceptable that so many men...and women..believe women are not equal within work..on the street.

Why are we still pigeon holed into roles. How do we help young girls feel empowered. How do we help fight world wide discrimination.

The trans argument whilst valid are a distraction. We are allowing men to distract us...again.

Showmeagain Mon 14-Nov-16 23:06:36

It does feel like they are fiddling whilst Rome burns. Fgs the physical enslavement and trafficking of women is surely more important than arguing about so called trans issues. Let them sort themselves out. We have real women's work to do helping real women facing desperate real situations

OlennasWimple Mon 14-Nov-16 23:12:26

Great post, OP. I'm in the US too, and hadn't quite been able to articulate what I see going on as clearly as you

WitchingHour666 Wed 16-Nov-16 20:35:02

Great post WombOfOnesOwn.

Allowing men into feminism has enabled them to turn it into a mans rights movement, that masquerades as feminism. We have to call this out and raise women's consciousness of this in my opinion. So that feminism once again is a movement by and for females, and only females.

To do this I think we first have to fight the male lefts pomo ideology. And reestablish that women are a stable category of people, who are oppressed because we are born female. It is ridiculous that we have do this, but I believe it's the only way we can move forward. I just hope we learn from this, and never again make the mistake of thinking men belong in feminism.

WitchingHour666 Wed 16-Nov-16 20:35:36

"Fgs the physical enslavement and trafficking of women is surely more important than arguing about so called trans issues. Let them sort themselves out. We have real women's work to do helping real women facing desperate real situations"

Women are not even permitted to state the fact only women can get pregnant. How can women fight our oppression if we cannot even talk about it. Women are now not allowed to call out males misogyny, and name males as men. That is what this men rights movement, dressed in sheep's clothing, was aiming for all along; to stop women being able to talk about our oppression and name the perpetrators; males.

There are women fighting trafficking, usually radical feminists who also fight trans ideology. Why should fighting trafficking mean women should not fight other problems, like males trying to erase our rights, while claiming to be us? Feminists in the 70's managed just fine opposing multiple forms of oppressive male behaviour. Of course they were able to actually call males men then, and state women are oppressed because we are born female.

venusinscorpio Wed 16-Nov-16 21:49:46

We're expected, as women, to centre and prioritise trans rights. Standing up to that and trying to concentrate on women's rights is not a distraction.

venusinscorpio Wed 16-Nov-16 21:53:59

And the type of feminists who centre trans rights are also the same feminists who are quite happy to throw abused and trafficked women under the bus to protect the choices of "sex workers".

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