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To think that women should not be referred to as menstruators and pregnant people?

(381 Posts)
FRETGNIKCUF Sun 04-Sep-16 07:34:32

*This is a thread about the impact trans activism is having on women. This is the beginning.

Don't read on if you're going to whine about another trans thread.*

Julian Vigo (@lubelleludotcom on Twitter) wrote the following.

There is a war on women, folks. The transgender lobby has gone down the rabbit hole by refusing to acknowledge that women's lives and bodies not only matter, but that they are real. Instead women's bodies have become the simulacra in an extended theatre of male entitlement (to be women while telling women to STFU) or they are rendered an extension of male subjectivity such that we now see hairy transmen's female bodies breastfeeding, the only form of female body hair that would ever be allowed in Time magazine.

And now for the latest: we are being called "menstruators" by the same right-wing discourse which seeks to remove the mention of woman from women's healthcare across the USA (ie. now many providers have been pressured to remove the term woman and write instead "pregnant person.") It is as if the last 100 years of women's rights had never occured.

The ironies are multiple. Here you have a group which claims its own marginalisation while working steadily to marginalise an already marginalised group, women. Then you have a group of female people who by virtue of the current transgender identity doxa necessitates "gender dysphoria," yet paradoxically adheres to—and even embraces—the real and symbolic thrust of much of what the female body actually is and produces, a complete opposition to gender dysphoria. Therein lies the greatest contradiction which, not surprisingly, once again holds women hostage: woman is symbolic for those who emulate her, woman is only acceptable inasmuch as she recognises males as females, and women are now relegated to "non-males" by political parties, as "pregnant humans" and "menstruators" by females who reject their bodies yet who hold out for the double-bind of gender in this theatre of cruelty where only a [sic] "man" can truly understood pregnancy, breastfeeding, and motherhood.

The only parallel I can think of is if the KKK were to insist that the Black Panthers stop calling themselves "black", demand that their white hoods be viewed as black, assert that only white people know what it is like to experience life as a black person, and then turn around and maintain that black people are just a group of entitled, bio-essentialist racists.

FRETGNIKCUF Sun 04-Sep-16 07:38:55

Planned parenthood tweeted about the tampon tax and referred to women as menstruators.

Mypurplecaravan Sun 04-Sep-16 07:43:03

It reads as a rambling incoherent rant without any links to what action she is annoyed by.

Have pregnant transmen in America been denied insurance cover for their pregnancies because the policies refer to pregnant women and they are not legally women any more? Or is this more ideological fisticuffs?

StealthPolarBear Sun 04-Sep-16 07:45:02

What are women who have gone through menopause?

Moosa Sun 04-Sep-16 07:46:36

Genuine question. Please can someone please explain the whole trans debate to me from the beginning? I seem to have caught the tail end of it on mumsnet.

I know one transgender person in RL and to me they are just a mate, don't think he/she has an agenda.

FRETGNIKCUF Sun 04-Sep-16 07:47:15


Mypurplecaravan Sun 04-Sep-16 07:47:22

Are planned parenthood anti women?

Tampon tax does not affect all women. My gran has now spent more of her life not menstruating than she did menstruating. Tampons were not an option when she did menstruation. She couldn't give a flying fig about tampon tax as it is not a tax on women only on those who menstruate.

FRETGNIKCUF Sun 04-Sep-16 07:51:43

No the point is that only women have periods not that all women have them.

I think that's an obvious point.

Mypurplecaravan Sun 04-Sep-16 07:51:52

Thanks for the link. I'm not sure I see the anger that article induced. But go new York city on repealing tax on all feminine hygiene products. Isn't that a good thing (even though some stores are still shit about it)

FRETGNIKCUF Sun 04-Sep-16 07:52:35

Why are you talking about your gran? confusedconfusedconfused

FRETGNIKCUF Sun 04-Sep-16 07:53:28

If you don't see the anger induced then this thread probably isn't for you.

FRETGNIKCUF Sun 04-Sep-16 07:53:48

If you don't see the anger induced then this thread probably isn't for you.

SoupDragon Sun 04-Sep-16 07:56:18

Don't read on if you're going to whine about another trans thread

Who made you the fucking thread police?

AltheaThoon Sun 04-Sep-16 07:57:32

Not all women menstruate but all people who do menstruate are women.

SoupDragon Sun 04-Sep-16 07:57:51

What I hate most about this is the whole "if you dont think like this you are wrong/antifeminist/mysoginistic" bollocks.

FRETGNIKCUF Sun 04-Sep-16 07:59:39

yes I am the thread police.

Valuable comment you've made.

dontwannapullahammie Sun 04-Sep-16 08:02:53

Not all women menstruate so where is the issue in referring to menstruators?

This is just another hysterical thread to whip up anti trans feeling on mn

Mypurplecaravan Sun 04-Sep-16 08:04:17

Moose most people just try to get on with their lives. Some transactivists have been very vocal in their anger and some feminists have been even more vocal in their anger. They see the existence of trans men as women who have rejected their womanhood and transmen as men who are trying to take over womanhood and tell us how to do it. To remove all specialness of being female.

Then all trans women are pervert men waiting to rape you (the self declaration of gender -which is a social construct- is what makes this a thorny subject as someone who appears clearly anatomically male with beard and penis can stride into a female changing room and say 'I'm a woman' and any woman who objects even if she has a personal history of having been sexually assaulted by men in changing rooms is perceived to be the bigot by media).

The problem is most transpeople do indeed just want to pass. To live their own quiet lives without impinging on anyone else. But those who object to trans people even existing let alone having any sort of rights put the fear of the bogey men into your head. And some transactivists are just weird and appear to be deliberately trolling.

The same way people have through time immemorial when it was black people sharing bathrooms. Or gay people in swimming pools.

SoupDragon Sun 04-Sep-16 08:04:26

Yes, yes it was a valuable comment.

SoupDragon Sun 04-Sep-16 08:05:13

This is just another hysterical thread to whip up anti trans feeling on mn

You aren't allowed to say that! FRET said so.

Mypurplecaravan Sun 04-Sep-16 08:09:35

Ah sorry fret I thought as a menstruating woman I was someone affected by tampon tax. Which is what that article links to, women being unlawfully taxed. Not anything about pregnant people or menstruators.

So what is it exactly that has the original tweeter so het up?

dontwannapullahammie Sun 04-Sep-16 08:09:36

As Roy Walker says....say what you see!

SoupDragon Sun 04-Sep-16 08:10:05

The problem is most transpeople do indeed just want to pass. To live their own quiet lives without impinging on anyone else.

This, absolutely. Unfortunately, people focus on the ones in the media who make a huge fuss and who might well have other motives. However, the majority is why I will alway refer to them by their preferred pronoun etc.

Moosa Sun 04-Sep-16 08:18:01

Thanks, so presumably it is a vocal minority in America who are spouting the craziness?

I can't see this being particularly relevant in real life.... Or am I being naive?

HermioneWeasley Sun 04-Sep-16 08:22:44

I saw the planned parenthood tweet yesterday and was so depressed that they've succumbed to the madness. I am not a "menstruator" I'm a woman.

Same as when the abortion support network wanted to update their logo etc to include men, as trans men might need abortions.

If reproductive rights stop being a "women's issue" because "not all 'women' " and "some 'men' " then I fucking despair - we lose the language to name the problem. And it's happening really fucking fast.

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