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orgasmic births.

(15 Posts)
ReadyToPopAndFresh Thu 27-Feb-14 15:00:55

I was reading about orgasmic births (literally that if you haven't heard of it). And I really like the idea that while the female orgasm is sidelined as not having any "purpose" like the male orgasm.. that actually it's this great thing that can labor safe and less scary and <gasp> even enjoyable for women. It seems to be massively taboo for some reason.

One of the comments however that I read constantly is basically, "ewwww, you're like basically getting off on your baby"

Some how a woman who isn't in pain and actually enjoys the baby coming out is a disgusting pervert where as TTC is literally a man having an orgasm for the purposes of making a baby.. Why is it OK for a man to orgasm to put the baby in but horrible for a woman to orgasm to get the baby out? It seems like a kind of perfect circle to me?

It's like they are not just afraid of women's sexuality but also angry that a woman dars to not be in agony for her birth. How dare she? Also as I have read from the "pregnant and sleeping with strangers thread" women who are pregnant are basically disgusting non sexual creatures.

maybe everyone is just jealous, I know I am

TerrariaMum Thu 27-Feb-14 17:03:47

I haven't been lucky enough to have orgasmic births, but I have noted in both of the ones that I have had so far, for me personally, the pushing stage has been the least painful. In fact, to be honest, I remember pressure not pain.

Anyway, I think Ina May Gaskin talks a bit about what you say about the complete circle. I believe she says 'The same sexy energy that got the baby in there will help get the baby out'

Also, doesn't some of what you say about sexuality and pregnant women as non-sexual fit in with the madonna/whore dichotomy? sorry, typing with yowling 10 mo on my lap so thoughts may not be entirely coherent.

Lottiedoubtie Thu 27-Feb-14 17:05:57

I have no idea about the questions you've asked. But I would like to read more about this concept- any pointers/links?

ReadyToPopAndFresh Thu 27-Feb-14 18:37:07

Ooh lucky you Terraria! Mine definitely hurt but I put a lot of that down to fear. Which has been unfortunately taught to us about child birth, I'd have bloody loved an orgasmic birth.

Also, doesn't some of what you say about sexuality and pregnant women as non-sexual fit in with the madonna/whore dichotomy?

I think so, we're so hung up about women's sexuality it's so frustrating. We can be mothers we can be sexual beings

I think we have this idea about women's bodies that they can only be for one thing so if a woman's vagina is managing to climax with something other than a man it's dirty. The way we get so upset about breastfeeding. Breastfeeding for a lot of women feels nice. It is not sexual, but for me it did feel lovely and my hormones left me all squishy and in love with my babies and my dh. I feel like you aren't supposed to admit it feels nice.

lottiedoubtie

There have been books and a film (which I haven't seen) about the concept of women experiencing orgasm during birth.

Check out the article below and if you are feeling brave check out the comments. The consensus is either it's inappropriate or it doesn't matter (why should it matter that so many women feel birth trauma and pain instead of being told that they can have painless births hmm. But I like that at least one commenter gets "as a man! in there grin

Another middle class non-issue article. My wife has given me two gorgeous) sons and it obviously hurt like merry hell on both occasions. As a man I guess I'm more concerned with whether she had an orgasm during conception.

Another excellent try. And there must be hugely contentious gardening issues to tackle next.

I'm glad my partner didn't use a vibrator during labour. I suspect the midwife would have been slightly taken aback. For the record, I didn't pleasure myself during the birth of my children either. Call me old fashioned, but I didn't think it was completely appropriate.

I'm not going to take up yoga but I will definitely consider a wank at the birth of my first child!And if some of the staff are feeling a bit stressed, well, who am I to deny them their sweet relief?Not sure how all that might go down with the missus mind you.

www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2009/mar/18/orgasmic-birth-climax-labour?commentpage=1

WidowWadman Thu 27-Feb-14 20:38:46

TBH, when I read that IMG suggests clitorally stimulating labouring women, it made me go "eww" a bit, to me that feels a bit intrusive, and if any midwife had suggested/tried that with me I'd have felt assaulted.

It also somehow heaps more expectations on the mother, which then of course leads to heightened guilt and depression in those who didn't achieve that birth orgasm/instant love struckness/surge of energy blah-di-blah, which was promised to them by the internet/NCT/doula.

TheWanderingUterus Thu 27-Feb-14 21:15:57

Lottie, I took part in a research study a few years ago into pleasurable and orgasmic birth. I was sent a copy of the dissertation, happy to email it to you if you pm me your email address (and to anyone else who wants it).

KerryKatonasKhakis Thu 27-Feb-14 21:18:05

I had a doula and she gave me some videos to watch about orgasmic birth. Lots about natural birth, freebirthing and hypnobirthing clips too.

The idea was more about presenting a non-frightening, non-anxiety inducing idea of birth (in stark contrast to the NHS classes) than telling me 'this is how to do it'.

My first reaction was shock when I heard about the idea but hearing the women interviewed and seeing them birth happily (very happily wink) was so refreshing.

As it turned out I had to be induced and had a terrifying EMCS but seeing that birth could be enjoyable, or at least not a tortuous bloodbath, was pretty liberating.

There has been this movement in the west to see birth as natural, joyous and empowering recently (with IMG etc.) but it does get sneered at as being a bit wanky and terribly middle class.

The stuff about the midwife stimulating the clitoris of a labouring woman and having your friends suck on you nipples in the IMG did provoke a visceral 'eww' in me but I think that's because I know any sexual/physical intimacy with my HCPs or friends would have made me incredibly uncomfortable but the women IMG helped were usually staying on the commune and I can imagine the vibe would have been middle miles away from the Leeds General Infirmary.

Not sure what, if any point, I'm making. Just wanted to say I have seen the vids and I was envious of the woman grin

Agree with WW that pushing the 'magical' aspect of birth can make those who need intervention feel failures. I did for a while. But telling everyone it's definitely going to be agony and the worst pain ever is unhelpful and potentially false (and can affect the birth outcome due to anxiety).

ReadyToPopAndFresh Thu 27-Feb-14 22:08:43

when I read that IMG suggests clitorally stimulating labouring women, it made me go "eww" a bit, to me that feels a bit intrusive, and if any midwife had suggested/tried that with me I'd have felt assaulted.

I'm a really private person very shy about HCPs looking at me etc. But to be honest I think when I was choking down the gas and air if someone said they could make it all better with a clitoral massage.. I'd have been all over it blush Maybe the way I wouldn't have wanted a random to give me a back rub but would have happily had one off a midwife (if it had been offered) dunno why the difference in my head? Maybe because it's for medical pain relief?

Didn't doctors used to give women orgasms for their "hysteria"? hmm

but it does get sneered at as being a bit wanky and terribly middle class.

angry argh women and their experiences of one of the most defining moments of their lives just isn't that important to men people. You're supposed to suck it up and be happy you got a healthy baby at the end whatever you have to go through to get there. (So sorry you didn't get the birth you wanted)

The wandering I will PM you I'd love to read it please

TheWanderingUterus Thu 27-Feb-14 22:19:25

Yes doctors used genital stimulation to treat hysteria. The invention of vibrators was to save them from tiring out their hands and also to save time. IIRC it was vaginal stimulation (hence the vibrator). Midwives were often seconded in to do the stimulation when the doctor was too busy.

There is a very good academic (and hard going in places) book on it by Rachel Maines called Technology of Orgasm. It has some pictures which are grinshockconfusedblush!

WidowWadman Fri 28-Feb-14 07:29:02

"argh women and their experiences of one of the most defining moments of their lives just isn't that important to men people."

The sneeriness goes both ways, though doesn't it? For me it was the baby which came out of it, that was the life changer, not the process of getting it out. I find it weird to focus on the process -of course I find it important that the mother sustains as little injury and goes through it with as little pain as possible, but beyond that, naah, don't get it. Doesn't make me a man, though, and I still wish I could punch that person who cheerily told me that "next time you should try going for a real birth so you know what it's like" after I had my EMCS.

ReadyToPopAndFresh Fri 28-Feb-14 08:52:39

I don't understand, how is that the sneeriness going both ways? It's sneerines about a woman's experience and them getting what they wanted. From an elective csec to a birth attended by bloody dolphins.

Someone acted like what happened to you wasn't important and didn't respect your feelings? That's exactly what I am talking about. confused

I didn't get the hynobirthing waterbirth I wanted. The first time I was being prepped for an EMCS and scared to death and then that followed with a baby who didn't breathe and a crash team who had to come and make sure she lived with my husband crying in a corner.

The second time I was literally held down and physically restrained for monitoring.. I was fighting intervention left and right and I am still upset with myself for not standing up and saying I was assaulted. It left me with nightmares for about a year. Despite my son being born with basically fuck all problem one I started to push. (after being told he could die if I didn't let them do whatever they wanted hmm)

The person who said that to you was being an asshole but to me the fact that you are still upset about what they said means that you are affected by your birth experience. I don't know anyone who doesn't have hugely vivid memories of the whole thing..from the toast afterword to the look on the midwives face when they realized something was about to go wrong

I don't get upset about things that people say unless they matter. If someone insulted my choice of clothing I'd be like this confused hmm Because I just don't give that much of a fuck. IN one breath you say how the baby got here doesn't matter and also that you still want to punch the person who judged you.

ReadyToPopAndFresh Fri 28-Feb-14 09:17:14

Oh and just to clarify I say one of the most defining moments in a woman's life not the only one!

ReadyToPopAndFresh Fri 28-Feb-14 10:23:52

forgot to say thank you Thewanderinguterus! It did go through I am going to read it later smile

whatdoesittake48 Fri 28-Feb-14 10:58:20

this makes perfect sense - and I wish I had known about it. i had two water births, which were drug free and good experiences - but to have used sexual pleasure as a way to alleviate pain would have been the icing on the cake.

I admit (here we go...) that if I feel ill, have a headache, period pain or anything which makes me feel uncomfortable - an orgasm (either on my own or with my husband) will make it all feel better.

if only I had thought of it at the time. I literally would have done anything, the first time around...I was oblivious to other people in the room so wouldn't have felt weird about it at all. I mean you are totally on display anyway...

WidowWadman Sat 01-Mar-14 13:53:44

Ready - "Someone acted like what happened to you wasn't important and didn't respect your feelings? That's exactly what I am talking about."

Nope, wrong end of the stick. Someone acted as if the way my child was born, was important, when I really couldn't give a flying fuck, seeing as she was healthy, I recovered quickly and didn't suffer too much pain or lasting injury. Why make it out that the "experience" is more important than the result?

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