Advanced search

Venetia: Georgette Heyer Book Club 25

(55 Posts)
HowGoodIsThat Fri 27-Sep-13 20:20:56

Venetia is possibly one of my favourite Heyer novels. Her light comedic touch combines with an acerbic yet sympathetic view of human foibles and is displayed through sharp dialogue, acidic pen-portraits and two of the most humorous-yet-human protagonists since Beatrice and Benedict.

Venetia is surrounded by friends who cling rigidly to social dictates while her family, sublime egotists to a man (and mum), flout them entirely. From a cloistered and confined childhood, she has somehow emerged with a clear-sightedness and a sense of humour that has preserved her from both the narrow-mindedness of her neighbours and the eccentricities of her family. Small wonder then that she should be so seduced by a “a friend to laugh with”.

Damerel is the first person in her to see her clearly as an individual, esteem her for who she truly is and offer her real companionship. She is also the first to view him in such a way. It is a meeting of like-minds and intellectual sparks fly from their first encounter, deepening into affection and then love.

Society stands in their way. It is Venetia’s challenge to side-step the protocols that have always governed her life just as Damerel’s chosen challenge is to return to them. “Will they, won’t they” plays out against a grand supporting cast of finely-drawn, well-rounded comic characters from Aubrey to the appalling Mrs Scorrier to Venetia’s portly newly-found step-father Sir Lambert.

So – what’s not to like? Two mature, funny, clever, likeable people find each other against all odds. A fine supporting cast, lots of lovely literary references and a skilfully rendered Regency world. Georgette Heyer at her finest .

HorryIsUpduffed Tue 05-Nov-13 21:18:48

I have written a rather gigantic essay on Ajax here.

Pachacuti Mon 04-Nov-13 20:40:47

How did I not notice that these were still going? I've been mourning their emise for months .

And I'm with Horry on Ajax vs. Venetia ... grin

LeonieDeSainteVire Sat 26-Oct-13 09:39:53

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

HorryIsUpduffed Sat 26-Oct-13 07:44:34

Because it's much funnier and much cleverer than Venetia, obviously... grin wink

LeonieDeSainteVire Fri 25-Oct-13 22:27:21

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

talkingnonsense Thu 24-Oct-13 20:47:14

I love Ajax too!

HowGoodIsThat Thu 24-Oct-13 19:01:59

<claps excitedly>

I lurve Ajax. And I am doing Frederica for Book Group so that means two corkers on the go at once.

LadyIsabellaWrotham Thu 24-Oct-13 08:41:20

It's Ajax next isn't it? One of my personal favourites - I feel about Romney Marsh the way some of the Tollgate-fanciers do about Derbyshire.

VikingLady Tue 22-Oct-13 22:30:49

Has the next thread started yet? Am a long time lurker!

LeonieDeSainteVire Fri 11-Oct-13 17:31:49

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

talkingnonsense Fri 11-Oct-13 16:25:58

I'm almost afraid to admit that I agre with Horry- I don't find this one funny enough, or the characters as engaging as say Leonie or Kit. But it is probably 20 years since I read it, so I'm going to give it a go with more adult eyes!

MooncupGoddess Fri 11-Oct-13 16:22:09

Yes, she is presented as being very self-absorbed and indeed unmotherly, with the Aubrey comment. If she was that bothered about her children she could presumably have got in touch after Sir Francis' death.

Takver Fri 11-Oct-13 16:12:13

Very true - though it does feel as though Venetia's mother is being criticised for not being suitably 'motherly', IYSWIM - maybe not by the characters, but by GH?

HorryIsUpduffed Fri 11-Oct-13 08:53:48

I take your point about "abandoning" children being taboo for women now but at the time it was the default that the father kept the children, not the mother, in cases of separation or (very rare) divorce. That's what kept women with abusive husbands for so very long - because if your choice is getting beaten up or never seeing your children again... well pass the ice pack sad

I don't think Venetia's mother is scandalous for leaving her children - it's really only Venetia and possibly Damerel, vicariously, that even considers that angle - but for leaving her husband and still having a life.

When we discussed Sylvester this came up wrt Ianthe giving Edmund up to Sylvester and Phoebe, and we noted then that the characters were very forgiving and matter of fact about it in general.

Takver Fri 11-Oct-13 08:18:34

Not being picky (honest), but I'm sure I recognise Philip from somewhere. Isn't there a Philip type (suffers on travelling, turns up grumpily to try to sort out impossible young woman) in Abigail's older brother in Black Sheep. The more I think about it the more Black Sheep feels like Venetia re-written with more grown up characters.

I like the Mama sub-plot, its the one bit that feels like she hasn't done it better elsewhere, and would have happily seen more of it.

One thing I do think is interesting, though. Almost 100% of the plot of Venetia, as with all GH's regency romances, would be irrelevant today (no-one cares about divorce, V would just get a job, etc).

But, a woman who leaves her husband abandoning her children is still condemned by society, even if she is suffering borderline or actual abuse (which I think we can infer was the case with Mama), and if she is failing to cope as a parent and genuinely believes that her children will be better off with their father. Basically, saying 'I am not willing or able to be a good parent' and leaving your children is still totally unacceptable in a woman, even though men can and do get away with it all the time.

LadyIsabellaWrotham Thu 10-Oct-13 22:30:15

Having harassed you all into doing this I then realised I'd forgotten it since I read it in August, so I reread it very rapidly only to find that you'd already said everything there is to say.

I did enjoy it - both times. I like all the supporting characters, and like the fact that she gives them all happy endings apart from Mrs Scorrier. Conway will get rid of Mrs S and live happily with his bride (if she can get over the dogs). Edward will marry Clara. Oswald will grow up, and Aubrey will spend vacations with the Damerels. I love Uncle and Aunt Hendred as well - Uncle Philip in particular is not recognisable from any of the other books. And the way the plot is driven by the characters of Conway and Sir Francis, who are never seen, is particularly clever.

Less clever is the fact that I didn't see the reappearance of Mama coming - I think it's the only one of Heyer's plot twists that actually fooled me first time around. What about the rest of you?

And I enjoy the awful Steeples, although I shudder, as intended, at the horrible moment where Aurelia talks about Aubrey, and the uncomfortable moments where Sir Lambert switches from fatherly to lecherous. They seem quite out of place in such a light hearted book. Heyer obviously took to the Steeples, as they crop up again in more likeable form as Mama and Sir Bonamy in False Colours, with sons who she doesn't have to be jealous of, and a rather more sexless stepfather.

LeonieDeSainteVire Thu 10-Oct-13 22:20:03

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

LeonieDeSainteVire Thu 10-Oct-13 22:17:46

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Takver Thu 10-Oct-13 20:04:52

Hmm, quite like Hugo Darracott too, but agree that he isn't dashing.

HowGoodIsThat Thu 10-Oct-13 17:06:34

I agree that he is NICER. Hugo Darracott is also NICER. Damerel just makes my heart beat a bit faster.

HorryIsUpduffed Thu 10-Oct-13 16:18:25

"Recency equivalent of his share of the housework" grin The mind boggles. Speaking to the DC before their sixth birthdays?

Takver Thu 10-Oct-13 15:27:12

Not that I have a soft spot for Miles, you understand blush

Takver Thu 10-Oct-13 15:26:36

Now I think that Miles is much nicer - he's funnier, I love the way he sets up his nasty cousin, and I just think he would be more likely to do the Regency equivalent of his share of the housework once they are married.

HowGoodIsThat Thu 10-Oct-13 15:09:44

I completely agree - I think we have the best to come although I do rank Venetia as top tier. I like Abigail more than Venetia but prefer Damerel o Miles.

<makes note to develop that into a more compelling and erudite analysis for when we get to Black Sheep>

Takver Thu 10-Oct-13 10:17:49

Its true, I was looking at the list of novels with publication date, and realised that a lot of my favourites are later works (and still to come here) - so Frederica / Civil Contract / False Colours / Black Sheep which I think have some of her best characters. Very much the opposite to a lot of genre writers where the early books are great and then they fall off in quality.

Join the discussion

Join the discussion

Registering is free, easy, and means you can join in the discussion, get discounts, win prizes and lots more.

Register now