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Starting to have MMR doubts and panicking(180 Posts)
I had finally decided to give my dd the MMR and she has her appointment next week. But now I'm having doubts again and panicking. Her uncle has autism and his mum is utterly convinced it happened after the MMR. I know that study was a fake/discredited etc but I'm finding it hard to see past her, and other parents online, strong belief that the signs of autism appeared overnight in their children. And those recent court cases where parents were given compensation on the basis that the vaccines their children had may be linked to their condition worry me too.
What if some autism is caused by the vaccine in some way? What if there is a genetic predisposition to having autism and all it needs is a trigger? What if my dd has a genetic predisposition from that side of the family?
I know I sound paranoid but I'm really struggling with this. On one hand I could give her a vaccination that will protect her from diseases but isn't guaranteed not to harm her. On the other, I don't give her the vaccination but she may catch one of these diseases and may be ever worse off than if the vaccine did harm her. I'm so torn and muddled about it.
I just don't know what to do and I don't know what I expect from posting here but I can't talk to my family about it.
"we've seen that website before, it's just a rabid antivaxxer site, and not at all reliable".
Interesting opinion - but not more than that.
exoticfruits - The Victorian times began to see massive improvements in public health with good sanitation and clean water. Plus the development of anti-biotics and better nutrition. These all play their part. Oh, and we don't have horse muck everywhere now either.
Coorong - "Your data is Correlation - not causation"
As much as it is correlation and not causation that some diseases disappeared around the same time that vaccinatin was introduced.
I just thought I'd come back and update in case anyone was interested. I've decided to vaccinate my dd with the MMR and we have our appointment tomorrow with the nurse to get it done. I finally feel calm and certain about the decision and I'm very glad that the decision is finally made.
The thing that cemented my decision was when I was considering the measles epidemic and had a sudden panicked thought of "what if I haven't had the MMR?! I best check or I could catch it!". That gut reaction made me realise that I was being quite selfish to deny my daughter the protection that I, in that moment of panic, hoped I had.
Another contributing factor was the realisation that if she caught measles and I didn't realise what it was in time to take her to the hospital or doctor, the side effects of the measles that could be managed at the hospital could already have taken hold of my dd and the damage would already be done. I wouldn't be able to cope with the guilt if my lack of reaction to symptoms meant she was damaged or worse.
I know there is still a risk from the vaccines but think I have accepted that should we be so unlucky that any side effects do happen to dd, we will find a way to cope. I will love her no matter what and if any damage would be done by the vaccine, it would be done in an attempt to protect her from the disease itself. I think I would be able to handle that a lot more than damage caused by me denying her the chance to be protected.
A sensible decision Sneezing. I get very irritated with the idea that you can't get these diseases because of better public health etc as if it made a difference. My mother's cousin died of diphtheria as a child, she had good nutrition, clean water etc. Surely you are not saying that we rely on antibiotics to get rid of them without preventing in the first place.
Are you really prepared to or get a tetanus shot for your DC if they cut themselves on rusty wire LaVolcan or that you would take them to a third world country without inoculations? ( without you turning round and saying you wouldn't be taking them there- IF you were...........)
I think good public health is another part of the equation.
Talking of third world countries - my DIL is from Africa. I know she's had vaccinations, I don't know what their sanitary facilities or water quality were like. It's something I would like to find out more from them. I don't think they were going into the bush to squat down or drinking water from a stagnant pond though.
good public health is a wonderful thing
however, entirely useless against such diseases as measles. Or would you disagree?
Measles attacks those with good standard of living and health too! DIL from Africa would be mad not to have her vaccinations IMO.
Good public health makes very little difference to diseases like measles - in fact it can make you complacent. Because we don't diseases for water borne bugs (dysentery) we forget about other bugs like measles - which are not spread by poor hygiene. It's a bit like blaming headlice on not shampooing. No relation.
And don't forget vaccines are used to prevent viruses which cannot be treated with anti biotics (which are used to treat bacteria). Increases I sanitation did not reduce measles, it reduced other bacterial based infections. The great drop in measles occurred in the late 60s 70s following the introduction of the vacccine.
According to WaterAid
"Did you know that the diseases caused by dirty water and poor sanitation kill more children every year than AIDS, malaria and measles combined?"
So I don't know whether clean water and good sanitation is useless against measles, but it will certainly help a person's general health.
DIL did have her vaccinations.
Sorry Rosi7 I find it very difficult to take you seriously after seeing a post of yours on one of Mumsnet cancer forums linking an article about chemotherapy being worse than cancer. I thought it was extremely insensitive to the many people on this website who struggle with cancer daily. NOT helpful whe your going through chemo therapy and making tough decisions. It's not straightforward and comments like yours were akin to those suggesting homeopathy cures.
Absolutely, the sign of a civilised society is running water. But once you've achieved this milestone, as we have, you need to tackle the diseases that arise in dense populations - viruses such as chicken pox, measles, mumps. Now you can be proactive or reactive. Proactive is much better because you cannot predict how an epidemic will spread, nor who will fall. That's where vaccines help. It doesn't matter how clean your water is, how careful you are, viruses are indiscriminate, once they infiltrate your social network.
Measles have one of the highest R numbers (after malaria). an infected person will on average infect 15 others, this compares to an R figure of 1-2 for the flu virus, do you really want to take that risk?
I just pointed out that public health was important, and might have been one reason why Victorian epidemics no longer occur.
And the fact that we now have vaccinations.
So I don't know whether clean water and good sanitation is useless against measles
yes, it is.
I think given that there is almost no one on this thread who's said they have proper, thorough knowledge in this field of medicine, and no one has backed up their arguments with any proper links, (including myself, and except for Bruffin) then I prefer to read the other thread on the same topic where several people who work in this field have been posting. Otherwise it's just a lot of reactionary (including myself) balderdash really.
I am also scared stiff of giving my 12 year son the MMR vaccine. In the past he has tested both positive & negative for Ceoliac Disease (a lifelong autoimmune gut disease). His Gastroenterologist says that in time it will most likely develop matter of time....He has issues with his blood clotting very slowly (though not Hemophilia) and had full blown stomach ulcers. My GP has now written to me asking for him to be vaccinated....I want him protected but feel dammed if I do and dammed if I don't. I have a friend who insists their child became very ill a few hours after having the MMR and they now been diagnosed with Autism.
I would really appreciate peoples views...considering his health issues!
The link with autism has been dismissed outright (irrespective of what you read on this thread). You best bet is to avoid getting medical advice for you son from a bunch of strangers on the internet and ask you GP for a referral to someone who can give you some better information (a paediatric specialist).
Best of luck, if in doubt, ask for a second opinion. A decent GP will take your concerns seriously.
@ Sashh - Hi - what do the Japenese do now since they got rid of the MMR? Do they have a single mumps that it safe and licensed? Can we get it here in the UK?
@ sneezingwakethe jesus - hi - How old is your daughter? The older the better in my view, and also boys tend to be more prone to autism. If you are so worried, just let her have the single vaccines for measles and rubella. Not sure where you live but there is the organisation, Babyjabs who may be able to help. The only single you cannot get is the mumps element but it's more serious (I think) if a boy gets mumps (infertility risk). I relented last year and let my 12 year old sn have the MMR as he was missing one mumps ( I had all the others done as singles 2x but could only get one mumps before they stopped production). As he is a boy, I worried so much that he might get mumps and become infertile - so I had to do it. He was and is absolutely fine. I am glad I did it now, but not glad that I has to succumb in the end to the MMR.
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