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continuous efforts to withhold critical data on severe adverse reactions and contraindications to vaccinations to both parents and health practitioners

(78 Posts)
rosi7 Mon 04-Mar-13 09:04:12

JoTheHot Tue 23-Apr-13 18:12:48

That is good. You're comment that the OP's link made for 'very interesting reading indeed' mislead me.

LadyGranulomaFortesque Tue 23-Apr-13 12:44:41

JoTheHot, seriously?

That's my point. lol

JoTheHot Tue 23-Apr-13 12:38:04

Poster 1: I've found something on google which I don't understand, but it fits in with my prejudices, so I'm re-posting it here.

Poster 2: Your link is incoherent, unscientific rubbish summarily contradicted by the following verifiable evidence: link, link, link.

Poster 1: I didn't understand the original piece, so don't expect me to understand your rebuttal. I'm right. My gut instinct tells me as much, and it's infallible. You're a sheeple. You're also rude and patronising. Get off, leave me alone, pineapple fritters anyone, what day is it, I'm Elvis you know....(sound of white coats flapping).

LadyGranulomaFortesque Tue 23-Apr-13 10:39:18

Just wanted to say thank you to Rosi7 for this paper. It has made for some very interesting reading indeed.

I am appalled but not surprised at the consistent attempts of some posters in this and other threads to stick their fingers in their ears and yell lalalalalalala in the face of something that doesn't toe the party line yet which cannot be explained away.

Poster 1: I have found evidence to suggest that we may not have the full picture on vaccine safety
Poster 2: Yeah but your kids will die if you don't get them vaccinated
Poster 1: Yes, but how do you explain some of these findings
Poster 2: The person finding them is a dick and your kids will die if you don't get the vaxxed
Poster 1: Yes but the evidence is here in front of your eyes and is compelling
Poster 2: Shut up shut up shut up. Oh and your kids will die if you don't get them vaccinated

specialsubject Fri 05-Apr-13 18:24:05

Rosi7 seems to have gone very quiet. Perhaps she is on holiday in Swansea?

rosi7 Fri 15-Mar-13 14:24:12

Hide reality, Catherina? Interesting suggestion - I rather face it and learn from my mistakes.

CatherinaJTV Fri 15-Mar-13 11:59:46

I hope you can hide the idea that your older children are somehow "damaged" by vaccines from them. Your post makes me really sad.

rosi7 Fri 15-Mar-13 11:51:08

The fear game is quite strong. Not for me anymore. I know what I am talking about.

I do have four children in their twenties now. Two of them have never been vaccinated at all. All I regret is that I have not been informed and strong enough 25 years ago not to vaccinate my first two children. I can see the difference very clearly. But some people probably want to make me believe that it is all imagination and if enough people tell me the sky is pink - I certainly will believe it.

Life is a risk - and I would rather choose to have healthy children with a good immune system than children who are burdened with poison and chronic diseases for the rest of their lives.

bruffin Fri 15-Mar-13 11:18:37

And having a strong immune system can lead to death with certain strains of flu.

CatherinaJTV Fri 15-Mar-13 11:16:21

note that "management of measles" can include weeks in intensive care...

rosi7 Thu 14-Mar-13 20:11:54

Certainly, prevention is better than cure. The best prevention is to keep your immune system strong.


I do not believe the story anymore that vaccines keep you healthy.

bruffin Thu 14-Mar-13 19:23:33

Prevention is better than a cure.

Tabitha8 Thu 14-Mar-13 18:30:19

I'm not sure that we would normally be looking to cure the following, more to manage them:
Chicken pox
The common cold
Whooping cough

Note, I left Small Pox off the list.

rosi7 Thu 14-Mar-13 11:08:36

Seriously, Sashh. Vaccination is a holy cow.

And if you want to find out - go dig it out and ask those who have truly been healed. There is so much more around than pills and vaccinations. But probably in your paradigm those who have been healed with alternative methods do not exist and if they do - they were not truly ill but only pretended to be or were diagnosed wrongly.

It is only for those who have eyes to see and ears to hear. Not for those who are happy to carry on living in their narrow paradigm.

sashh Thu 14-Mar-13 05:48:41

Also as pointed numerous times its the dose makes the poison.

The same with chocolate. It's a poison, but you have to eat a lot.

We have all been brainwashed to believe there is no other solution and that therefore we have to use the solution bearing these risks.

Seriously? Please do tell what the cures are for

Chicken pox
Small pox
The common cold
Whooping cough

I know when Elizabeth I had small pox she was wrapped in red. Was that the cure?

bruffin Wed 13-Mar-13 08:54:06

Its not denial to want to some solid evidence that something works beyond a placebo affect.
We should become bretharian, now that is really healthy wink

rosi7 Wed 13-Mar-13 06:02:22

Sorry, Bruffin, it is the other way round - it is the denial of the bad while concentrating on the good - without taking into consideration that there might be healthier solutions in terms of securing human health.

We have all been brainwashed to believe there is no other solution and that therefore we have to use the solution bearing these risks.

You live in a different paradigm, Bruffin, but it is also a paradigm ignoring the fact that with our pharmaceutical approach we are slowly but surely destroying our whole planet as we do not consider the long-term consequences of the whole of the model and so far we do not support proper research to find better solutions.

bruffin Tue 12-Mar-13 23:03:09

Nobody has said there aren't problems, but it is the denial of the good they do you while concentrating on a risk that is far less than the original disease that is the problem.

edam Tue 12-Mar-13 22:50:13

There clearly are some people who are extremists. However, vaccines, just like any other drug, do have the potential to cause harm. The Centers for Disease Control in America issued an interesting statement on the pandemic flu vaccine that was used throughout Europe in 2009 - which researchers now know caused an increased risk of narcolepsy. So let's not assume all concern about vaccines is hysterical scare-mongering. (It's not used any more, and quite right too, but sadly it's too late for some of the people affected.)

bruffin Tue 12-Mar-13 22:41:57

Actually want don't agree with rosi definition

clay soils

bruffin Tue 12-Mar-13 22:09:57

Aluminium and Hydrogen are both naturally occurring and important elements within the soil system

Don't agree
Also as pointed numerous times its the dose makes the poison. It does no harm in normal doses. It takes industrial exposure or kidney failure for it to become toxic because the human body gets rid of it easily.

rosi7 Tue 12-Mar-13 21:51:58

This is only partly right, Bruffin.

It is true that aluminum is the third most abundant element on earth. But it is also true that as a pure element it would not exist at all in the world if human beings had not used chemical reactions to extract it.

But the interesting side of aluminum is that so far no living organism has been found on earth that could make any positive use of it.

And yes, you have to declare it as a poison for the nervous system as indeed it is.

bruffin Tue 12-Mar-13 19:14:17

What do you mean if?
You cant declare it a poison we shouldn't inject into our bodies, if you nothing about it as element.
Its the third most abundant elements on earth. Its naturally occurring in the soil and water. You get some through meat but mostly through grains and vegetables.

Tabitha8 Tue 12-Mar-13 18:20:25

If there is aluminium in a tuna sandwich, is it in the bread or the tuna?
(I'm interested also in knowing why it is there).

CatherinaJTV Tue 12-Mar-13 16:40:07

the pharmaceutical industry is withholding information. "Our side" (ie the likes of Goldacre and Chalmers, who are very much pro-vaccine) are writing books about it. That doesn't mean that one should not vaccinate or that colour heals allergies.

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