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Was this rape?

(18 Posts)
WasIt Sat 13-May-17 22:36:31

I've shared an experience that happened years ago with trusted 2 male friends. Both told me it wasn't rape. I'm now a bit confused/upset but ok are they right?

I basically decided to make someone jealous when I was a lot younger. Resulted in hours of "you want me you bitch, not him" type wearing down then a very different sexual experience to what we'd done before after I'd spent hours saying I didn't want them. I was bruised and traumatised after. It wasn't loving, it was me worn down and giving in to an angry man but not participating enthusiastically.

I was wrong to make jealous but I didn't forsee the hours of angry persuasion etc

Smeaton Sat 13-May-17 22:39:58

Is it rape? Simply put. Yes.

As far as I am concerned rape is any sex you don't want to be having. So you not being enthusistic and not wanting to be doing it in my mind is rape.

WasIt Sat 13-May-17 22:41:20

Why do men I trust think it isn't? I know that can't really be answered but it's bothering me

SiouxieQ Sat 13-May-17 22:44:20

Coercion is not consent, no consent=rape.
It doesn't matter what the circumstances are no means no.
Your friends don't understand consent.

SiouxieQ Sat 13-May-17 22:45:53

flowers I am sorry that happened to you, you didn't deserve it. flowers

Smeaton Sat 13-May-17 22:47:44

In my experience, and no doubt I may get kicked for this, but men see things differently.
They're raised, to a certain extent, to normalise things like buying girls drinks to loosen them up, repeatedly asking until they say yes, moaning and being moody because they 'Need' sex. Even in the old movies, when the woman's fighting, the man ignores her. Etc etc, So on and so on.

Basically, if at any point you think,
'I don't want to do this'
Then its rape.

Doesn't matter how far it's gone, what you were doing, how much you made him jealous.

Men normalising their actions doesn't make it any less so.

isupposeitsverynice Sat 13-May-17 22:55:28

Yeah in my experience a lot of men don't really get that consent obtained through coercion doesn't really count as consent. I explained this in excruciating detail to my husband and his friend a while ago which made for a really awkward silence while I watched them mentally re-assess some of their past sexual encounters and clearly come to some uncomfortable conclusions. I think Smeaton has it that the societal narrative is that women play hard to get and/or are frigid and have to be nagged or sweet talked into sex, and that the manliest men are arch seducers that can turn any no into a yes. It's all shit of course. No means no and bullying you into saying yes doesn't make it otherwise. You can always call rape crisis if you feel like you need to talk this through with a professional.

ImperialBlether Sat 13-May-17 22:56:46

Don't ask these men that question. It's clearly rape. I'm really sorry.


Smeaton Sat 13-May-17 23:04:53

Its totally off topic and not exactly sensitive to mention i guess but there's a scene in Family Guy, of depicts Sean Connery as James Bond and he grabs a blonde woman and tell her she's going to have sex with him. She says no, she doesn't want too etc. He repeatedly says she's is until she finally says yes. The 'Punchline' being that Connery turns to the camera AMD says,
"50 nos and one yes means yes"

It kind of sums up how some 'Men' think.

Op I hope you're OK. cake wine to go with The flowers you already got. smile

WasIt Sun 14-May-17 00:13:00

Lol thanks all. I'm actually ok about what happened now, long time ago etc. It upset me more to be told by not one but two trusted men that it wasn't rape as it certainly felt like being raped and I'd trusted them with my experience

kittensinmydinner1 Sun 28-May-17 20:50:55

I think the problem with questions like this is that readers will be reading different meanings.
'Was this rape ?' Without a doubt the answers given above are correct from a moral point of view. In any sense of society, sex obtained by another after a period of relentless badgering /coercion is not 'consensual ' in the true sense of the word.
The ambiguity comes from the Legal definition of rape. Cases where most of us would have no doubt to call it rape - would have a very hard job securing a conviction from a crown court jury. Most jury's have difficulty finding no 'reasonable doubt' from a victim who cannot say they didn't say no. just felt it. Just too difficult to prove.
However - just because it's unlikely to pass a jury - doesn't make it NOT rape.

Penfold007 Sun 28-May-17 21:08:11

If the two 'trusted' men were also the men who had sex with you they are hardly going to admit they raped you. If the coerced and/or forced you into sex it was rape. Sorry.

lougle Sun 28-May-17 21:21:47

I don't think it was rape. I don't think it was sex in a healthy relationship, but it wasn't rape either. You decided to make the man jealous. You succeeded. He decided to try and 'win you back'. You say that he persuaded you to have sex. You say that he wore you down and was angry, and that you weren't enthusiastic, but you weren't forced to have sex. You didn't forsee the effect of making him jealous, understandably. The sex wasn't as you'd had before, but that doesn't make it in itself rape. If you tried to stop it at some point during the act and he refused, then it was rape, definitely. But not enjoying the sex you had or regretting it afterwards isn't rape.

WasIt Sun 28-May-17 22:03:31

I didn't consent to what happened verbally at all. I said I didn't want it during. I was crying.

TheOnlyLivingBoyInNewCross Sun 28-May-17 22:23:26

Have you seen Joe Biden's new PSA? here

It highlights, I think, Smeaton's very pertinent point about the way men regard/normalise their actions.

lougle Sun 28-May-17 22:38:53

Well then it was rape, definitely. If you said you didn't want it, at any point, then you had withdrawn your consent (or hadn't given it in the first place), and it was rape.

Penfold007 Mon 29-May-17 11:22:28

Wasit it does sound like rape. Have a look at this link it might help you process your feelings and decide what you want to do

BloodWorries Mon 29-May-17 11:32:36

If you never relented into saying yes I don't see how anyone could think it wasn't rape. Especially if you were saying no and crying. What twisted morals your friends have. They think having sex with a girlfriend whilst she's crying and saying no/not said yes is normal??? What is wrong with this world.

The bruised and sore said more than enough to me, that alone would of helped to get him found guilty if you have informed the police at the time.

I think it's difficult too. Sometimes DP wants to start something but I say we don't have time, or I need to do x, y or z. He then tries to persuade me and it often works. But I don't personally think this is wrong, at least for us in our relationship. If however I say no I'm not in the mood then that's that and we continue with what we were doing, but that cuddling naked, making tea or anything else. No fuss, no guilt. And it works both ways. And I think it's important to be in a relationship where you can just say 'no' and that be accepted, without the old 'I've got a headache' line. Heck he'd run and fetch me a cold compress, paracetamol and a glass of water to try make me feel better.

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