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Something that has always bothered me - losing virginity (potentially embarrassing, potentially triggering)

(45 Posts)
notusualmnname Thu 20-Apr-17 15:34:39

First off - DM etc can fuck off.
Secondly, am not a troll despite topic matter, have name changed because this is hard enough to type and I certainly don't want to be identified. IDK maybe nobody will even read it or reply but this has played on my mind for so long especially when I am down. Have had a rubbish relationship history and this is one of the things that makes me cringe most about my life.

So when I was 17 I was a virgin, I was massively sexually naive and also embarrassed about being a virgin at 17 even though now in my 30s I know that is fine!

Potential trigger warning reading on.

Was hanging out a lot with older people who were not nice. One night I got really drunk and another of their friends was over - he was in his 30s. I went to bed in the spare room and he came in, was kissing me, telling me how all my other friends bitched about me, then said he would come back in half an hour when everyone was asleep and he 'wanted me naked'.

He left and I didn't expect him to come back or really know if I wanted him to and I fell asleep but then he did come back. Started kissing etc and went to have PiV sex, my reaction (pain, moving away) made him ask if I was a virgin which I denied because I was embarrassed so I said I had only done it once before. And here is the thing that has left me feeling pretty gross forever, before I even knew what was happening and without saying anything he was having anal sex with me. I didn't even know that was a thing that could happen (I really was v naive). I was just in total shock and just stayed still the whole time but sort of relieved because it hurt less than him trying to do it 'normally'. I don't even know if that was me losing my virginity that night, I am pretty sure nobody does it like that before they have had PiV sex, but for me it is this stupid thing that I don't really know when I lost my virginity.

I can't talk to people about this in real life obviously, and actually my first PiV experience was not great either but I really need some perspective on this if anyone has any perspective to give...nicely, please. I am really not trolling and just trying to understand this.

MrsTwix Thu 20-Apr-17 15:53:46

I'm sorry to upset you but that sounds like rape to me. What a nasty thing to have happened to you.

Maybe think about getting someone to talk to?

rapecrisis.org.uk/helplinesemotionalsupport.php

UndersecretaryofWhimsy Thu 20-Apr-17 16:02:27

I can't help but think you may be missing the wood for the trees in asking this question...

To me, you define your virginity, and there is way too much emphasis on penis in vagina sex, and for that matter, penis anywhere sex. (Is a gay woman who never has sex with a man a virgin her whole life? Is a gay man who doesn't do anal - and lots don't, you know - a virgin?)

Also, what you describe was completely non-consensual, ie it was rape. I believe rape is violence, not sex. I think I personally would define the first time I had consensual sex (sex being whatever I defined that way - oral, manual, anal, PIV, it's up to me) as when I lost my virginity.

But it's your life - and your virginity. If you feel you lost it in this incident, that's up to you.

notusualmnname Thu 20-Apr-17 16:11:51

IDK, I have just been a unable to process it all...ever.

UnderSec of course you are right about defining loss of virginity.

Seeing as I am on an anonymous user name I can also say the next time and having PiV sex I was also drunk, one of the older people I was hanging around with started having sex with me and I had fancied him but knew it was all wrong as he had a girlfriend, I was really drunk and thought 'oh well lets just get this virginity thing over with', but within minutes his gf came in and he ran off and she beat me up really badly (deservedly to some extent I know), and the time after that I was coerced into it.

Even the man I married was sexually abusive (no longer together). I don't think anyone has wanted to be with me out of love, nor will they ever sad

MrsTwix Thu 20-Apr-17 16:19:58

Please get some help with this. It wasn't your fault and it doesn't define you as a person. Getting counselling will make your future a happier place.

picklemepopcorn Thu 20-Apr-17 16:28:32

I'm so sorry you have crap experiences. I don't have any advice, just acknowledging that none of that should have happened, and it must be hard for you now with that in your background. I hope you get some comfort from talking about it, knowing that we all feel for you and it was awful, and that you get some counselling to help you move forward and protect you from more shit experiences.

notusualmnname Thu 20-Apr-17 16:41:33

Thanks. I am actually due to get help with some of the stuff related to my abusive ex and I have been really struggling with everything recently. The older stuff is like background noise to all of that. I think I have no idea what normal consensual sex is which is obviously totally fucked up, I am a parent, feminist and well educated though I know obviously education is not exactly a protecting factor and it is stupid to assume that this kind of thing happens to 'uneducated' people. It is just I suppose people generally wouldn't in real life think I could be so stupid to fail to understand something like this.

AssassinatedBeauty Thu 20-Apr-17 16:45:30

I really feel for you, having had that sequence of events happen to you. It's absolutely not your fault at all. You absolutely could find someone who loves you and treats you with respect, you are definitely not unlovable. I'm angry on your behalf about the complete tossers you've unfortunately encountered.

Have you had any counselling about any of this? I think it's something that you might need some help with to process and deal with.

I agree with the PP about the whole concept of virginity. It's origins are deeply misogynistic and are all about the "value" of a woman to men. I would try not to worry about that and try to focus on how outdated and misogynistic a concept it really is.

MrsTwix Thu 20-Apr-17 16:46:43

It's not you being stupid, it's not an easy thing to deal with. I think the brain goes a bit fuzzy when it has to deal with upsetting stuff sometimes, maybe it's a protective thing?

Given your early experiences of sex were so negative it is likely that those became your normal view of sex, which unfortunately made you more vulnerable to predators and abusers.

However the good news is that you can do something about it. Even by talking here you are taking steps in the right direction. Getting help will help you understand what is good consensual sex and how to avoid the old patterns.

Have you read the pinned post on the relationships board?

UndersecretaryofWhimsy Thu 20-Apr-17 16:48:06

notusual, I am so sorry you've had such horrible experiences.

I am glad you are getting help WRT to your abusive relationship. Please also consider calling Rape Crisis - you can call their national helpline on 0808 802 9999. I would really encourage you to seek some help via them to deal with and process your experiences of sexual violence.

notusualmnname Thu 20-Apr-17 16:53:57

Thank you so much, it is helping to type this to a bunch of strangers and I really appreciate it.

I have never had counselling about any of this though I am due to and am currently having crisis team support as things got really bad.

I really appreciate the misogynistic concept of virginity being highlighted, I cannot believe I have been so strung along by that idea for so long.

Will read the pinned post on relationships. Not that I am keen to ever get into one again (a relationship that is).

flapjackfairy Thu 20-Apr-17 17:00:11

Oh you poor love . How awful no wonder you have been put off relationships. But as someone else has said this does not define you so get some help and sort out your head because you deserve to be loved and i really hope you find happiness in the future .
Sending v best wishes as you move forward xxx

picklemepopcorn Thu 20-Apr-17 17:00:42

I think when those boundaries are broken, it's hard to understand where they should be. My home life was not abusive exactly, but I didn't feel able to stand up for myself, be rude, complain... So when a bloke continued having sex with me despite me saying 'no'. I didn't really know what to do about it. And when the next bloke did...

I'd love to have the uncomplicated enthusiastic view of sex that some people have...

Cartman03 Thu 20-Apr-17 18:00:49

I think for so many women, young and older, sex can be seen as an expression of love - sometimes the ultimate expression - "he must really want me!" and it so often isn't.

OP you were taken advantage of in the most despicable way. It was rape and the guys involved knew you were young and impressionable.

I hope you find some comfort and resolution. Sending you hugs.

MrsTwix Thu 20-Apr-17 18:41:53

Keep strong.

MrsTwix Thu 20-Apr-17 18:45:39

This is an interesting way of looking at it.

m.youtube.com/watch?v=u7Nii5w2FaI

notusualmnname Thu 20-Apr-17 21:12:34

Thanks all, feeling disturbed at myself.

plotmissinginaction Thu 20-Apr-17 21:19:05

That just sounds horrific and very traumatic. I am so sorry. That was rape. My first sexual experiences were abusive, twenty years on I'm still unravelling it all. So glad you are getting help.

MrsTwix Thu 20-Apr-17 21:27:15

Why do you feel disturbed? Are you ok? Do you have the number for the crisis team if you need to talk? I've found them helpful in the past when I've been low. Take care.

ColdCottage Thu 20-Apr-17 22:52:42

I think you are really brave coming on here and talking about something so painful for you.

As PPs have said from what you have written it was rape. I'm sorry that you have been abused and left not knowing was a kind loving relationship is sexual or otherwise.

I'm really glad to hear you have some support and therapy set up. We all need help, support and someone caring about us in our lives.

I really hope the therapy etc helps and although you say you don't want another relationship there are good people out there and you can find someone who deserves you. Just take your time, check in with people that you trust and know to have good judgement before you get into anything too deep.

Sending positive vibes flowers

notusualmnname Fri 21-Apr-17 07:12:35

I kind of have to talk about this now even if it is just on here. I say 'just' but actually I think this is def one instance where I love MN! I need to stop all this stuff confusing my mind so much.

I know so much of it was wrong and so much of it was all wrong with my ex before he did things that were 'obviously' rape. Eg I used to wake up to find him having sex with me and he used to just say he couldn't help himself and normalise it, and another time he pestered and pestered me for sex so much the day after my daughter was born and he did start to do it but it was such agony that I managed to push him away and he did stop. So he stopped, so I told myself it wasn't so bad even though it was so screwed up of him to want to do it then. I hated all those things but was left thinking these are just how it is. And again, I sound so stupid.

I did have a bit of a meltdown last night being detached from myself and unable to stop shaking looking like an idiot. I was out helping someone with something and they had to walk me back to my car saying I looked ill, v embarrassing and I was not the helpful person I was trying to be. I do have the crisis team coming today though. Generally am a right mess at present.

picklemepopcorn Fri 21-Apr-17 07:38:48

I'm glad you have the crisis team coming. You need to look after yourself. I'm sure the person you were helping will understand. flowers

namegechanged Fri 21-Apr-17 08:11:03

Glad you have people coming today OP. I've nc'd for this. I've been through a lot of what you've had happen to you, just in a different order.

It's confusing because these guys prey on the grey. They'd be very quick to say, "But she didn't say no and that time she did, I stopped." Which is true, but the real question is who wants to have sex with someone who isn't really into it? With someone who wants them to stop or wishes they hadn't started? Or if they can't be 100% sure she's really wanting it to happen? There's only one answer to that.

That these people are sh*theads and take advantage is no reflection on you. It doesn't make you less of a feminist either. Sadly it means you have to deal with the damage they've done though.flowers

notusualmnname Fri 21-Apr-17 08:25:49

Namechanged I am sorry you have had similar experiences, and for all the others who have said similar too.

You are right about the grey area thing.

One thing that has only just occurred to me is that the guy I mentioned in my OP denied everything afterwards even though I was embarrassed about what happened so I told people we only kissed (but keen to tell people I had done 'something' because I was so worried about people thinking I was unattractive to men). I thought he denied it because he didn't want people to know he had done anything with me because I wasn't attractive (and while I actually feel rubbish about how I look now, looking back at me then I was just a bit plain, but not outright awful!). It really never occurred to me it may be because he was quite aware he had totally taken advantage of a drunk girl half his age. I even went to punch him one night when he came over again and sat there smugly grinning and saying 'of course I didn't do anything with her'. Making me so angry to remember.

namegechanged Fri 21-Apr-17 16:37:18

How are you doing now? Have you seen the crisis team?

Wondering too if you have anybody you can tell about any of this in RL. I don't mean details like you've put here, but just the headlines. Saying to someone "I was raped when I was younger and am having difficulty with it." can be enough. But only if you have someone you feel you would want to - and if you would want to.

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