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Can a teacher or HT answer this please?

(85 Posts)
Lucsy Tue 19-Apr-16 18:29:00

Just how much damage to the schools data will be done by my daughter not sitting her sats. She is in a class of 29, gets FSM ( I think there is only her that does). She is very high achieving

Please - I don't want to debate why she isn't doing them. Only trying to assess how much chaos our decsion has for the school

clam Tue 19-Apr-16 20:45:03

They would be pretty fed up about it, for sure. In a full-ish class, each child accounts for nearly 3% in a league table. A 3% drop not only makes the school look bad compared with others nearby, unfairly, but could also push it down across the boundary for triggering an inspection for lack of progress over the Key Stage.

I presume you're talking about KS2?

DraenorQueen Tue 19-Apr-16 20:49:17

I'd be pretty gutted, to be honest. In our school we work hard to ensure our FSM children are given every chance to succeed and given the nature of our school our FSM data is scrutinised very closely indeed. Clam is completely correct about the possible consequences for the school.
Without debating why you may not want her to do the tests, I'm just going to say I think as a parent I personally think you should keep conveying to her that SATs are just something you have to do. You do your best and it's FINE. Then you move on and look forward to a nice Summer term.

purplemoonlight Tue 19-Apr-16 21:31:14

But it's not really fine, is it, because a lot of secondary schools do (wrongly) set on the basis of SATs.

I completely understand both sides of this argument but I think OP just has to do right by her daughter.

BetweenTwoLungs Tue 19-Apr-16 21:34:35

I'm a Y6 teacher, I'd be pretty gutted. We work so hard, it would hit our percentages and rightly or wrongly it's what we have to work towards as Y6 teachers.

Also my pay is linked to SATs performance (again, rightly or wrongly, it is) so if it pushed our % down my pay would be frozen.

Lucsy Tue 19-Apr-16 21:42:32

I clearly care about the teacher. And the school. I wouldn't be asking what I am asking otherwise.

Yes these are KS2 sats and my daughter is in the top 3 in her class. Perhaps even she would get the highest marks.

I'm furious about the whole situation. For HT, for her poor CT who I have nothing but respect for and who seems to have aged 5 years in the last 5 months.

Will she be marked down as not meeting expected levels? How will they record the data?

HT is passing her levels and teacher assessments on to her high school and they are speaking tomorrow to find out what I do she would need.

Lucsy Tue 19-Apr-16 21:43:21

Wait a sec. You pay is linked to the results?

Is that common? That's disgusting.

pippitysqueakity Tue 19-Apr-16 21:56:18

Well OP, performance pay for teachers is generally based on performance of pupils. How else would they base it? If a high flyer, as your DC would seem to be does not attend the SAT, the scores, on average , would reduce, therefore the performance ( of the teacher ) would be deemed to be less.
I often wonder how other PRP colleagues would fare if their pay increase depended on 30 hormonal 11/12/13 yr olds on one given day.

Letseatgrandma Tue 19-Apr-16 21:58:22

Wait a sec. You pay is linked to the results?

Yep sad

Lucsy Tue 19-Apr-16 22:00:55

Oh god that's shocking. Every day is a school day. Are all teachers paid like that?

Do they think you don't bother? Or don't try? What the actual fuck?
What if you get a low performing group? In a small school it wouldn't take much surely to skew the results % wise.
( and I guess my daughters results being absent really do make a difference then)

I feel guilty

Smartiepants79 Tue 19-Apr-16 22:07:34

Yes, every result matters. I and my colleagues would be absolutely up shit creek if any of our high achievers didn't take the tests. Each of our kids is worth about 13% of our overall scores.
And previous posters are correct, vulnerable groups such as fsm are more closely monitored.
We dislike the tests as much as anyone and even boycotted the whole lot one year ( can't remember how we got away with that) but my performance targets are dependent on these kids doing well.

sunnydayinmay Tue 19-Apr-16 22:08:05

It can make a huge difference. Our school was downgraded to a 3 (Requires Improvement) solely on the Ofsted inspector's view of progress in one subject in Key Stage 2.

My ds1's year were the year 6 immediately before the next inspection. If his class hadn't pulled it off, I know that would have lost our wonderful Head and Deputy.

This is how crazy the system is. A head teacher's career depending on a group of hormonal and tired 10 and 11 year olds.

They would be able to explain the reasons to the Inspector, but the starting point is always the data.

Lucsy Tue 19-Apr-16 22:10:29

I want to do the right thing. I have to protect my daughter and I don't want to mess up dd's teacher. She so good.

Would deregistering her now help? Is it too late for that?

Lucsy Tue 19-Apr-16 22:13:26

The thing is. I know the make up of the rest of the class and it has quite a ghee more children that will struggle to 'meet expectations' than last year. Even without the change in curriculum.

Last year the group was a quite high achieving bunch ( my son was in that group so I know the children quite well) This year not so much

FATEdestiny Tue 19-Apr-16 22:16:25

I have to protect my daughter

Can the school not protect her? (emotionally, intellectually, mentally, physically)

clam Tue 19-Apr-16 22:18:44

"...but I think OP just has to do right by her daughter."

I disagree. I think that's a very selfish attitude.
How many posters do we see on here, particularly at this time of year, desperate to get their child into a school that has a good Ofsted rating? Rightly or wrongly (wrongly, in most teachers' opinions), they think that's the be-all and end-all of a school's worth. Yet it's actions like this, when parents who are about to finish with the primary system, are prepared to sell down the river the school that has worked so hard with their children for 7 years; in all areas, not just the 3Rs.

Every single point from every single child counts in this fucked up system we teachers have to work with. No one is more hacked off with it than the teachers themselves. But to have a bright child (in particular) opt out of SATs and make a hugely negative impact on a school's position and reputation and the teachers' salaries, is a massive slap in the face. I acknowledge that the OP hasn't given her reasons for withdrawing her child, and they may be compelling ones, but I've seen a fair few posters on similar threads vowing to do the same thing, "just because."

As I said, very selfish.

Lucsy Tue 19-Apr-16 22:20:46

It's complex. Dd is vulnerable because of circumstances. She herself is adamant she isn't doing them after watching her brother last year

School and HT and CT are exceptional and do look after her very very well. Daughter told school counsellor she wasn't doing them too.
I don't think the school believe it's good for her to do them either. They aren't being difficult and are actually very supportive.

If very frustrated with me I think

purplemoonlight Tue 19-Apr-16 22:20:58

I think if you can't be selfish when it comes to your own child, when can you be.

clam Tue 19-Apr-16 22:22:08

I think if you can't be selfish when it comes to your own child, when can you be.

Nonsense. What an appalling attitude.

clam Tue 19-Apr-16 22:23:18

She herself is adamant she isn't doing them

So, will you let her opt out of GCSEs if she fancies? Or A'levels? Or is that different, because you can more easily see the benefit to her?

sunnydayinmay Tue 19-Apr-16 22:24:18

I know you don't want to discuss details, OP, but I just think of it as a team effort. The teachers do their bit, the pupils do their bit, and the parents support.

You can protect your daughter whilst still sitting the SATS.

Pipbin Tue 19-Apr-16 22:24:56

Do they think you don't bother? Or don't try? What the actual fuck?

This is why teachers go on strike - no matter what the Daily Mail might say.

Lucsy Tue 19-Apr-16 22:26:00

Clam. Please don't. I'm on this thread purely because I AM interested in the CT and the school
This is specific days issue. She has no issue with any other tests or exams and had no worry or anxiety with the 11+. Part of the problem is currently timing and what else is going on her life. I'm not going to explain that here

Can anyone answer my question about deregging her at this point ?

Lucsy Tue 19-Apr-16 22:26:42

Specific sats issue. Apologies for all the typos

DraenorQueen Tue 19-Apr-16 22:31:25

You mention earlier how high achieving she is. If this is the case and she's been working hard all year and succeeding, she's in a really good place to simply sit the SATs and do well. Can you enthuse her somehow by pointing out how brilliantly she's doing? Encourage some competition with herself?

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