Inset - didn't it, historically come out of teacher's leave?

[GeorgianMumto5]

Please can you clarify that for me? Elsewhere on the Internet I have waded into an argument about pupil absence for term-time holidays being OK because teachers make them absent when they have inset/polling days or strike.

If there's comeback, I'd like to get my facts right, re. Inset. Yes, I know I was stupid to wade in, but there it all was, glistening with factual inaccuracies and it got my goat.

Thank you.

[RustyBear]

Yes, inset days came out of teachers' holidays. And teachers have no say in whether or not a school is used as a polling station.

[GeorgianMumto5]

Thanks! Did one of the school holidays get shorter?

[maddy68]

Yes school holidays are now 5 days shorter than they used to be

[ParkerTheThief]

Yes, they were originally called Baker Days introduced by Kenneth Baker in 1988

[soapboxqueen]

Yes. As pp said teacher training days came out of holidays and were known as baker days. Children do not loose a day of education for polling days. Most schools hold a training day which other schools hold at another time during the year. They still get their 190 days.

[Hulababy]

Children still have the same number of school holidays that they used to have. The difference is that the children now have 5 days called INSET rather than holidays, and they can be placed at different times throughout the school year.

Teachers lost 5 days of their holidays.

Days lost due to polling stations are out of the control of the teachers. They are not relevant.

Strike days - well taking strike action is a right for (almost) all workers in the UK. If teachers were no longer allowed to strike, then that rule should also be rolled out across the whole work force. No one is allowed to take strike action. TBH I am not sure how many people would vote for that.

[GeorgianMumto5]

Thanks everyone!

[caroldecker]

No strike action gets my vote

[GeorgianMumto5]

I've not had to weigh in lately, but I did hold my tongue at one contribution to the argument, which was, 'In Sweden and [several other countries] they don't start school until six.'

Right, so emigrate and then go on holiday!

*sigh. I'm actually all for being able to take term time holidays, if only I could, but I'm not all for people thinking it is their right and that they can back up their decisions with dumbass arguments.

[cardibach]

caroldecker really? No power for workers to defend their rights?
OP others have answered your question, they are correct.

[cardibach]

caroldecker really? No power for workers to defend their rights?
OP others have answered your question, they are correct.

[caroldecker]

workers can defend their rights - when they demonstrate their responsibilities. When 30% fail to get a c in maths GCSE after 11 years teaching, the teaching 'profession' has failed. Workers who cannot do their jobs have no right to strike.

[Hulababy]

So you're happy for ALL workers in ALL professions to have no right to action?

And you do know that there will always be a certain number of children that are just not able to pass maths at a C level, or any subject either. A grade C is not a fail. A U grade is a fail. A C is the expected but it can never be everyone who can pass it for all manner of reasons. You are also assuming that the only people who have a bearing on a child's ability to get a specific grade are teachers, and that the only place that has a bearing in a child's ability is school. This, obviously, is not the case.

[caroldecker]

My view is that people should have a right to action when they have upheld their side of the work contract.
I do not believe that teachers as a group have achieved that, even if individual teachers may have.

[cornypedicure]

what part of the contract is that then caroldecker?

[YoniConnect]

At the risk of a flaming, surely the creation of Inset (baker) days was so long ago (1988 - 25 years) that it is now not relevant to refer to them as "lost holidays". Workers in many sectors have had their rights / working conditions changed in the intervening years, ( Sunday trading / bank holiday opening for shop workers / loss of final salary pension schemes pretty much across the board in the private sector) so let's just get used to a teacher's working year of 195 days now!

[caroldecker]

The bit where they teach children to read, write and add up.

1 in 6 adults has lower than an eleven year old reading level

78% lower than c grade GCSE maths

[caroldecker]

Well I thought it was a teacher's job. They have the children for around 25 hours a week, 30 weeks a year for 11 years - over 8,000 hours and the basics - reading, writing and adding up should come into it somewhere.
Or maybe I misunderstand what teachers are supposed to do?

[caroldecker]

No problem with teachers personally - all the ones I have come across have enabled those I know to add up. I just cannot see how you justify a profession which results in 78% of people not managing a grade c in GCSE maths and c.18% of people cannot read as doing their job. I accept not 100%, but 22% a success rate!

sample grade c questions, 8,000 hours, about 12% of a lifetime at school and 78% cannot answer these!

[mnistooaddictive]

Carol have you ever heard of the normal distribution? It is how most things in nature are arranged. Things such as length of caterpillars and number of leaves in a tree etc. most people are clustered around the middle andcthe further you get from the mean the fewer there are. Exam results follow this too. A grade C at GCSE may mean nothing to you but to students who are at the bottom of the normal curve it is really really difficult. They can work really hard and have excellent teaching but find concepts beyond them. There are then those with learning difficulties and behaviour difficulties and mental health issues and the most horrific personal circumstances that all affect their ability to work at school.
Also I don't know where you get your statistics but where I looked it is 40% ish who don't get a grade C at GCSE.

[RustyBear]

The BIS survey caroldecker quoted doesn't show achievement at GCSE, it is a survey, carried out in 2011, of the Maths skills of the adult population, with an age range of 16-65.

[Hulababy]

78% of people don't achieve grade C or above in GCSE Maths?
Where does that stat come from?

[nkf]

Grade c in maths is a lot more than adding up. Grade c in English is a lot more than reading or writing.