Morning Routine

[RedWoodenStatue]

Ok so it's very early days but I just would like some expert opinions please.
Bought puppy home yesterday, good as gold, had cycles of eat sleep play and went to bed last night with 10 mins whining then settled down for 7 hours.
I got up at 5 with DH as he was going to work, let pup in garden and had a play. He then went back in his bed with a chew until 7 when he started crying again so I got up went in garden with him again.
Now what?! I can't leave him to make tea or any thing. He follows me which is fine. But do I just sit with him now?

[adaline]

Our routine when ours was young was about as follows:

6am - up and toilet. Play in the garden or in the house if it was raining.
7am - breakfast
1pm - lunch.
7pm - dinner.

In between meals we followed his lead really - played when he wanted to, let him nap when needed, worked on tricks and commands like sit, stay etc.

I would advise getting him used to being left alone as early as possible - obviously not for hours but leave him while you sort laundry or take the bins out and build up to leaving him while you pop out for an hour or two. It's the one thing I wish I'd done differently with mine! We never needed to leave him alone so we didn't bother and it took a lot of work to undo it and get him happy on his own again.

[RedWoodenStatue]

thanks adaline that's a good tip. He will have to be left alone for 4 hours x 3 times a week from May so will start to think about that now. He's currently sleeping so I've had breakfast. it really is back to the baby days

[Nesssie]

You need to give him a safe space where he can learn to settle by himself. Either section off a corner of a room with a play pen or use a baby gate. Put puppy one side with a toy or chew. Sit the other side so he can see and hear you but can't physically get to you. When he is happy to settle (may be immediately, may take a few goes), then you can sit a bit further away. You can move around the room, pop out of the room etc. All so he knows you are coming back.

Another method is to keep moving around the house. At first the puppy will follow you. Then when he lays down, move again. He'll follow again. As soon as he settles down, move again. Ignore him as you move around, do laundry, tidy up etc Eventually, he'll learn that following you is really boring!

[RedWoodenStatue]

He's just had a really long sleep and is full of beans again😊 we are currently in the garden. if I sit down he will just come and sit next to me, so sweet. If I get up, he gets up😁
His safe space is in the conservatory, he has his bed and toys and blanket there. also has his meals there. He has a very plush cushion in his crate, door always open, and a not so plush cushion out of the crate which he chose to sleep on last night. every time he gets in his crate I give him a treat.

[Nesssie]

If he seems happy then I would let him get on with things, but supervise as a bored puppy can be very destructive! Sounds like he is very content!

You can give him some enrichment ideas if he seems bored - roll a towel up with treats inside or get one of those plastic bag holders and stuff it with different strips of fabric and scatter treats inside. The puppy will have to pull the fabric out of the holes (or buy a snufflemat).
A big pile of grass cuttings, or straw from a rabbit hutch etc, anything he can sniff and explore. When out on walks, look for things you can take home and give him to explore.

[RedWoodenStatue]

Thanks for the tips, all gratefully received.
He's just been in the garden, came straight in and weed on the kitchen floor
He also bought in a half coconut shell in his mouth that must have fallen off the bird feeder!

[Nettleskeins]

We worked on the principle that after two hours he needed to go back in the crate for a long sleep, from an hour to two hours minimum. Then when he woke he went straight in the garden. For the second week or two I basically lived in the garden, as he had a bad association with hard surfaces and mats (came paper trained) and was peeing all over the kitchen unless he was in the garden. Being in the garden we had lots of freedom, and I could praise him when he peed/pooed, and then when we came in (after some result,, I Put in him his crate, sometimes I sat next to the crate on the laptop, sometimes I busied myself in the kitchen. He could see me and here me and quite often he didn't want to be in the crate, but more often he would settle down there and sleep or chew something. I would leave the room for five minutes, or ten minutes, and much longer when he was in deep sleep.

In the early days I noticed that if I sat next to him he would sleep in the crate for two hours, but if I moved at all, he would instantly wake up. So I decided to stick it out, and sit with him for the first week and we got a good association with the crate as a cosy safe place to sleep. Then I stopped sitting there and he was absolutely fine, still slept for two hours, and settled at night etc. I think you might have to create very positive vibes around him being separate from you, even if it is just a few feet away, and then build on that.

Worst for us has been the biting stage, which is still continuing till 5 months but easing off somewhat. You will find yourself putting him in his crate or engaging in play with him, just to stop the biting. Usually it is because they are wide awake OR incredibly tired...

Once our puppy was crate trained toilet and sleep wise (ie toileting outside and sleeping very well at night and for naps in the day) we never put him in the crate to play or his awake periods. We let him wander around the kitchen and hall. To start with my husband and I differed on this, I had this idea in my mind he needed to get used to staying in his crate whilst I cooked or we had supper or in fact did most things (!) but actually he was fine learnign to mooch around and do his own thing, and I think that helps later when you need to leave them in the day.

Four hours sounds a bit long to leave a 14 week old puppy though. 2 hours sleep and then what will happen when they are awake for 2 hours by themselves without someone to either take them out to the toilet or interact with them? Mine couldn't be left for four hours. Two hours if timed right (coinciding with sleep, after a good meal) and 45 mins if they are wide awake and playing in the kitchen by themselves..but not four hours. My puppy is now 20 weeks old.

[Nettleskeins]

We fed at 8am, 12 am and 5 pm. I've moved the feeding now to 9am 1pm and 6pm as he was sleeping so late, and I wanted to walk him before breakfast having read somewhere never to walk a puppy/dog on a full stomach

[MsMightyTitanAndHerTroubadours]

use his staying close to you as a training exercise...lots of praise, say the word "close" or "follow" or whatever, you can get so much done for very little effort when they are tiny and obliging!

i don't entertain early mornings, so any early rising is only rewarded with quiet chatter and garden busies! Or maybe even a back to bed, with shooshing for noise, but when they are super tiny that can be a bit difficult with all the puppercuteness.

Also once out in the garden for toileting there's No More Inside until something is done...again it's very early days for you, but once you have established if yours is a save it up and do a big wee, or more your sprinkler type then that becomes easier to read.

[Nettleskeins]

I agree, you have to stick it out in the garden until there is a "result" and often you have to hang around for quite a while, unless it is first thing in the morning (when it is inevitable) The puppy really cannot understand English at first, and it doesn't know why you are putting in the garden - play? whim? scenery? from its point of view it is just as convenient to pee under the kitchen table or in the corner of the room. The sooner you can put a word to its actions IN THE GARDEN and praise praise praise and reward, the sooner it gets the message that the garden is a good place to toilet. The more often it pees on the kitchen floor, even if you are critical and disapproving, the more likely it is to become engrained - and being disapproving isn't going to stop the association in the puppy;s mind, just make him worried and anxious to hide the puddle in the furtherest corner. whereas you can build an association in the puppy's mind with cold wet muddy grass (in our case we toilet trained in March and the garden was a mudbath) and make him think great, this is just right, I can only pee on THIS SURFACE not nice warm wooden floor or lino or carpet. And puppies don't pee in their crates, so if there is a choice between grass and crate, muddy grass becomes the default setting.

[RedWoodenStatue]

Thanks everyone. Day 3 here. It's going well I think! Puppy is taken out in the garden every half hour and usually wees and poos after abit of wandering about. lots of praise and a treat given.
It's at night I'm a bit confused. He goes in his bed with a treat at 9.30/10pm and don't hear a peep out of him until DH gets up at 5am. I go down with DH and take puppy straight in the garden but he does nothing.
Both mornings tho there has been a poo done overnight on the floor (He sleeps in utility room,) I don't mention it, just clean it up and straight in garden.
is this ok? he's obviously needing to go at night but I don't put paper down. Is He going to get in the habit of pooing indoors at night?

[BiteyShark]

Everyone does different things at night.

For me I didn't want him to toilet inside so I had a baby monitor so I could hear if he got up. I also got up in the night to take him to toilet by setting an alarm as he needed to go when he was a puppy.

You could put paper down or just let him toilet and hope he grows out of it. However, I was concerned about it getting to be a habit e.g. toileting inside rather than toileting itself so I did the above. Others will have done it differently e.g. puppy pads/paper etc

[stucknoue]

I went to work the next day and he was absolutely fine, was sitting in his bed yawning when I returned. We have always gone down 7-7.30, let him in the garden and (unless cold) we leave the door open, we free feed so he can eat when he's ready, not usually until pm.

[RedWoodenStatue]

He doesn't whine atall at night so I've no idea of when he needs the toilet.
The utility room is off the back of the house with entrance to the garden.
He has never poo'd indoors but has had 2 wees on day 1, one in the lounge and one in the kitchen.

[BiteyShark]

With a baby monitor you might find he will wake you making a noise when he gets up.

Going all night without a pee or a poo is sometimes simply too long for some puppies at that age. Mine couldn't hold it all night and it clearly seems that yours can't given the poos. As they get older that gets better but it's not uncommon for puppies to need to toilet in the night when young as you will see from the threads on here.

It's up to you whether you leave it or get up to him in the night.

[RedWoodenStatue]

im not worried about clearing up a poo in the morning, I just don't want him to get in the habit of doing it iyswim
I took him out the garden at 7 and he did poo and wee so had praise and treats.
Thanks so much for your comments. im interested to see how others do it.

[mando12345]

We had the poo overnight some nights for quite a while, only made 100% by cutting the last feed out completely. This did the trick.
You sound like you're doing well though.

[adaline]

im not worried about clearing up a poo in the morning, I just don't want him to get in the habit of doing it iyswim

I think the only way to break the habit is time - puppies are often too young to be able to 'hold' it all night. Mine was up for the toilet occasionally until he was 6-7 months old although 95% of the time he did sleep through.

However he never had an accident indoors at night - he always woke us up to say he needed to go out.

[RedWoodenStatue]

That's interesting adaline thank you.
He's been to toilet outside all day today, he's also barked at the cat

[Gruffin]

When do you give him his last feed? My puppy poops before bed time. He eats his last meal 6-6:30 and then goes to bed (crate) 9:30 and sleeps to 5 am. No accidents nighttime. He’s 9.5 weeks old.
I think if I fed him too late he would need go in the night.

[RedWoodenStatue]

He gets fed at 7.30 and sleeps through the night,.but has had 2 poos overnight at some time. maybe we should bring the feed forward but then would he get hungry over night?! Gosh it's all guesswork

[Nettleskeins]

Mine didn't get hungry at night at 12 weeks and last feed was at 5pm. But I suppose that isn't very helpful sorry...(only got him at 12 weeks) If you crate train, and stay in the same area as them overnight, you can easily see what the interval is. So mine slept 10-3am for example and might wake me up then by whining to be let out of the crate (they won't soil their bed) and then sleep till morning. After a bit he didn't wake me and just slept till morning (7am) and then later still till 8am. When he came out of the crate he did a poo and pee immediately I put him in the garden.

If he had had free access to somewhere to toilet overnight, I suspect he would have not held on. But as Bitey said, their capacity to hold on is not developed till later.

By 15 weeks mine was definitely capable of holding on quite a long stretch say 11-8.30 with toileting of any kind.

But he was in a crate, with the door shut overnight. I had to be aware of his prompts, so I slept next to him. For two weeks.

[Nettleskeins]

Before that point mine was not crate trained at night, I know because he came to me paper trained and was allowed access to paper from his bed at night. It didn't take very long at all to get him to sleep through without needing to toilet in the night. You aren't spoiling him to let him toilet when he needs to at this point. That's my opinion though.

[RedWoodenStatue]

thank you nettleskiens I know it's very early days and he is only 9 weeks. I just want to do the right things.

[RedWoodenStatue]

Success this morning. I went down at 5 as usual and no sign of wee or poo. Let puppy out and he did both in the garden!!
He's back in bed now with a treat, and I'm in bed with a cuppa!
Mini victory!