Can someone help me with a question about KC registrations!?

(81 Posts)
Loserinlove Sat 12-Jan-19 18:30:38

Is it the person who is kc registered or just the dog please?

OP’s posts: |
Wolfiefan Sat 12-Jan-19 18:31:54

A pedigree dog should have a KC reg. I think you have to have that transferred to your name when you buy it.
The kc also keeps a list of breeders.
Not sure if that helps!

Whoseranium Sat 12-Jan-19 18:40:07

The dog is KC registered and not the breeder though breeders can be part of the KCs Assured Breeder Scheme.

Dogs can either be on the breed register (i.e. they're a pedigree who parents were both registered, of the same breed and the breeding of the litter didn't break any of the KC's basic rules) or the activity register (where individual dogs are registered regardless of parentage in order to compete in KC affiliated dog sport events like agility).

Loserinlove Sat 12-Jan-19 18:43:01

So Iv asked a breeder if she’s kc registered and she said ‘I’m not but my dogs are’. Is that a bad thing?

Sorry I’m new to this and want to make sure I find the right person!

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BiteyShark Sat 12-Jan-19 18:48:19

It means her dogs are registered as a pedigree but as a breeder she isn't. You can get KC assured breeder which just means they have been visited and meet a certain requirement.

Loserinlove Sat 12-Jan-19 18:55:36

Is that a bad thing?

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BiteyShark Sat 12-Jan-19 18:58:00

Personal opinion but for me it didn't matter.

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Whoseranium Sat 12-Jan-19 18:59:26

So Iv asked a breeder if she’s kc registered and she said ‘I’m not but my dogs are’. Is that a bad thing?

It's not a bad thing at all but equally KC registration is no guarantee of a decent breeder. The KC will register any eligible dog regardless of the situation they've been bred in or whether the breeder is making any effort to produce healthy, good tempered dogs.

My advice would be to read as much factual information about dog breeding and puppy raising and decide what you want from a breeder. I'd recommend having a look at the following sites:

Dog Breed Health

UFAW - Dogs

Dog Breeding Reform Group

Institute of Canine Biology (particularly the articles 'Understanding the Coefficient of Inbreeding' and 'Why DNA Tests Won't Make Dogs Healthier')

The Puppy Plan

The Puppy Contract

Unfortunately there's no simple checklist you can go through the find a good breeder and everyone has their own ideas about what exactly constitutes "good" when it comes to dog breeding which often vary greatly.

Do as much reading and research as you can, keeping an open mind, and move on from on there.

Loserinlove Sat 12-Jan-19 19:01:53

Someone on a group I’m on FB recommended this person as it’s where theirs came from.

Thanks for the links I’ll have a read

Why would a breeder chose not to be registered themselves but register the dogs?

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BiteyShark Sat 12-Jan-19 19:07:52

Why would a breeder chose not to be registered themselves but register the dogs?

As I am not a breeder I can't actually answer that but I am guessing:-

Just more paperwork.
It isn't a thing you actually need to be a breeder.
Lots of people don't care that they aren't 'assured' by the KC.

Loserinlove Sat 12-Jan-19 19:09:22

If they aren’t ‘assured’ by the KC does that mean more risks of possible poor health problems that are hereditary?

OP’s posts: |
BiteyShark Sat 12-Jan-19 19:11:33

Mine wasn't assured but they did certain dna tests of my puppies parents to rule out hereditary diseases.

Just because they aren't assured doesn't mean they are bad breeders. You need to read the links PP posted above and ask the relevant questions to any breeder you visit (assured or not).

BF888 Sat 12-Jan-19 19:14:11

I would ask more about what testing she’s had done on the puppies than the KC. There are some none KC dogs which are perfect it doesn’t mean you’re getting a quality dog just by having KC reg.

Genetic testing is vital as some dogs are too close in lines, they may look beautiful on the outside but if lines are too close then genetically problems can arise, there’s no way of knowing without testing.

If you maybe google what testing a breeder should get for puppies or what testing puppies should have and ask her about it.

Also, have you seen the mother of the pups, father of the pups? Have you seen the living conditions of where the puppies and mum are sleeping/staying?

Loserinlove Sat 12-Jan-19 19:16:19

Iv literally just made contact with some within about 2.5 hour drive from me, so far they have been ones recommended on the dog groups I’m on on Facebook and they’ve all been kc. I want to go on waiting lists as I ideally want to bring a puppy home in the summer so I haven’t visited any breeders houses.

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Whoseranium Sat 12-Jan-19 19:17:46

Why would a breeder chose not to be registered themselves but register the dogs?

Being a member of the Assured Breeder Scheme is entirely optional and there's all sorts of reasons why breeders might not be members.

It could be that they won't join on principle because they believe the KC should be requiring the ABS standard from all breeders they register dogs from. Some might not want the extra cost of joining or the faff of having a home inspection and they're already confident in what they're doing as breeders. It might be because they don't meet the standards and aren't interested in doing so. It could be that it's a breeder's first litter and to join the scheme someone must have already bred at least one KC registered litter. It could be that the breeder isn't aware of the scheme.

Not being a member certainly doesn't mean a breeder is dodgy in any way.

If they aren’t ‘assured’ by the KC does that mean more risks of possible poor health problems that are hereditary?

Not at all, and being a member of the scheme doesn't automatically mean a breeder is good either. The requirements for the scheme are really fairly basic and can be met whilst still making less than ideal breeding choices.

Loserinlove Sat 12-Jan-19 19:18:13

I know what should be tested so thanks I will ask. Also how far back ‘should’ they be testing though the family?

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Loserinlove Sat 12-Jan-19 19:19:08

Thanks whose.

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schloss Sat 12-Jan-19 19:27:25

In answer to how far through the pedigrees of the sire and dam should be health tested, it really depends on the breed and the tests. Some breeds have only recently began health testing so it may only be the grandparents/parents who are tested. Others it may go further back into the pedigree. Secondly the breed itself may have some non UK dogs in their pedigrees, although there are equivalent European and American health tests they may not always be available results in the UK. If hip, elbow and eye testing plus possibel DNA testing for some breeds, I always prefer at least 2 generations of results. It isn't just the health testing which is important, it is are the results acceptable.

Whoseranium Sat 12-Jan-19 19:27:45

Also how far back ‘should’ they be testing though the family?

It depends on what testing you're asking about.

With DNA tests it's fine for just the parents to have been tested. It's also fine for a breeder not to have bothered testing a dog whose parent's both tested clear for whatever condition it is as there's no possibility of anything but clear offspring from two clear parents.

With something like hip scores it's better to know as many results as far back as you can. Breeding for low hip scores isn't an exact science and you want to see scores consistently under the breed average in as many relatives as possible.

You can look up an individual dog's health test results using the KC's Mate Select tools but I'd also recommend signing up for a free MyKC account. The latter will allow you to look up dog's whole pedigrees and you can then look at health test results for each of the dogs on it.

BF888 Sat 12-Jan-19 19:36:07

The testing for the puppy, will indicate how close the lines are for inbreeding. ideally it should be between 0-1% but definitely below 3%, some breeders to tread a fine line with it.

I personally would always ensure all tests were done for puppy, even if dam and sire were healthy. For instance I knew of a person who had a puppy who had heart condition (genetics related) the sire was completely healthy and didn’t have said condition although it was discovered it came from his line.

It’s great you’re doing so much research now in time for your summer puppy. I’m sure once you get the puppy you will know exactly what you need to.

Loserinlove Sat 12-Jan-19 19:58:44

Thanks everyone I appreciate all your help.

If it makes a different it’s a dachshund breeder so I know I need to check for cord 1 PRA and Ivdd.....

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Whoseranium Sat 12-Jan-19 20:12:14

Which variety of dachshund? The testing requirements vary between them.

The breed council have a health site which has a page specifically for required or recommended health tests.

I'd also recommend having a look at this site. It's all about IVDD, the screening scheme and how to manage dachshunds to minimise the chances they'll suffer spinal issues.

Ideally you want to find a breeder who is not only heath testing but also breeding for more moderate conformation (i.e. shorter backs and longer legs) to help reduce the risks of spinal issues.

Definitely check the inbreeding coefficient of any litters as well. Some of the dachshund varieties are getting to a pretty poor state in terms of genetic diversity.

Wolfiefan Sat 12-Jan-19 20:33:51

Loser you really need to start by contacting the breed club or society. You have no idea who you are really talking to on FB groups.

Loserinlove Sat 12-Jan-19 20:38:50

It’s the long hair.

wolfie when you say contact them, who? Email the Iv web? And what am I asking them? I see all these names of people and wouldn’t know which ones to trust? Other than asking the right questions and of course I wouldn’t hand any money over before viewing etc..

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Wolfiefan Sat 12-Jan-19 20:42:28

I have an Irish wolfhound. I started by contacting the breed club. I went along to a rally and the secretary introduced me to some good breeders who were hoping for litters soon.
The trouble is that puppy farmers and BYB are so sneaky.

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