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Advocate and lungworm

(17 Posts)
shoesaregood Mon 23-Oct-17 17:47:25

Just wondering if anyone can advise on advocate and lungworm? We have a 10 week old whippet puppy and he's been wormed previously with panacur, but our vet has advised that this will not protect against lungworm (we're in a high risk area) and advocate is the only product available which will protect him.

I'm a bit concerned about this for a few reasons: one of our pup's litter mates has had a reaction to advocate and also, it seems that contrary to what our vet says, other worming options are available - the practice just doesn't supply them.

Just wondering what wormers others use and if the vet's advice is correct? I'm not comfortable with him having advocate, but I'm also obviously terrified about lungworm.confused

(In case you can't tell this is our precious first puppy!!)

Lonecatwithkitten Mon 23-Oct-17 17:53:42

Milbemax tablets given monthly will also protect against lungworm, advocate is not the only option.

shoesaregood Mon 23-Oct-17 17:59:41

Thanks lonecat, I will talk to the vet - he seems very dismissive of anything which isn't advocate.

Doesn't fill me with confidence about the practice as a whole to be honest. I understand that they have relationships with brands and suppliers, but still!

Floralnomad Mon 23-Oct-17 18:05:52

We are in the SE which is fairly high risk and mine has Milpro / milbemax monthly . Advocate didn't work for us as it seemed to just stay really greasy on his skin .

noitsnotteatimeyet Mon 23-Oct-17 18:41:33

Our Toller has a bad reaction to advocate so we now use a combination of nexgard and milbemax - no fleas, no ticks and no risk of lungworm

usainbolt Mon 23-Oct-17 21:30:32

Nothing will protect against lungworm Advocate etc will kill the lungworn when they are present. It does not stop the dogs getting lungworm.

You can also get a similar level of protection by regular worm counts - then you can treat you dog if needed. If done 3 monthly this will give the same cover as monthly advocate treatment

Floralnomad Mon 23-Oct-17 22:00:19

usain , that's not strictly true though , by giving the stuff monthly your dog is protected as soon as it eats the contaminated snail / slug / fox poo whatever , whereas by doing worm counts the dog potentially has 2/3 months of damage to treat .

usainbolt Mon 23-Oct-17 22:19:05

No *Floranomad you are incorrect.

With lungwrom an infected dog passes out first-stage larvae into the
environment. Your dog picks these up and they make their way to the lung where they develop into adults in nodules in the trachea and bronchi. Here females lay eggs which hatch in the lung. These larvae are carried back up the trachea and are swallowed and then passed out to start the cycle all over again.

The major advantage of wormcounting is that the test will show up the larvae and so you can then treat before the eggs are hatched. There will be no chance for the larvae to lay eggs.

Advocate will NOT protect the dogs the minute they are infected - they will kill the larvae/eggs once it has grown in your dog. The dog has to have lungworm larvae present for the advocate to work.

There is absolutely no difference in protection from wormcounting than advocate. Advantage is you are not putting unnecessary chemicals into your dog and the environment. It is of course vital that you do treat IF lungworm is present. do testing in 24 hours so no delay in treatment.

Floralnomad Mon 23-Oct-17 22:24:40

I stand corrected , but that is not what it says on the Lungworm website , although obviously that is run by / promoted by drug companies . Frankly my dog is 7 , he's never had fleas / worms to my knowledge , is perfectly healthy so I will carry on with the chemicals .

WeAllHaveWings Mon 23-Oct-17 22:51:52

We give milpro (milbemax) once a month for worms and bravetaco once every 3 months for fleas, tics etc. Both are tablets.

Ddog vomits with drontal, and advocate makes him behave strangely so didn’t like giving it.

usainbolt Mon 23-Oct-17 22:56:38

There is a lot of confusion about advocate and its role in "protecting" against lungworm so I was just trying to clarify. It does not protect unless you dog has lungworm it will not prevent your dog getting lungworm.

If I remember rightly a vet on here was also confused but then did some more research and agreed with the findings above re wormcount. It is just an alternative option. Dogs that can not take advocate due to ivermectin (which is fatal to some dogs) do have a safe alternative to monthly medication.

It is interesting that you say your dog has never had fleas or worms yet you carry on medicating anyway - just playing devils advocate grin - Why are you medicating against things he does not have? grin - none of them are preventing any infestation.

Floralnomad Mon 23-Oct-17 23:02:04

Because something must be working otherwise with the amount of crap he rolls about in I'm sure he would have picked up something . He takes Bravecto every 3 months , Milpro monthly , has daily Joint supplements ( dodgy knees) and also has daily Nicotinamide tablets and coatex spray on his food for his SLO . On the whole he is pretty healthy and I have no qualms about him having chemicals , when he has to take as many tablets as me I will worry about it .

usainbolt Tue 24-Oct-17 08:48:54

Each to their own but I do have a concern with the medication becoming ineffective with overuse.

Look at frontline it no longers kills fleas,, medication is having to get stronger and stronger from over use. Milpro itself states on its literature that it may become ineffective over time. It also states that no studies have been done on elderly animals and animals with early kidney and liver disease. So in the theory of treating just in case then we should be treating for this as well as worming and fleas. Dogs are not put at less risk by wormcounting - a bit of effort collecting 3 days of poo samples but absolute peace of mind.

I will treat my dogs WHEN they need it but I will not for many reasons just give out the treatment just in case. Do we give our kids weekly nit treatment just in case, do we worm them with Ovex just in case, shall I take chemo every week just in case to stop cancer.

Daily grooming will protect and inform re fleas, Wormcount will indicate if medication is needed. Then of course it is vital to medicate.

Veterinary medicine needs to look at the major impact of overmedication in many areas antibiotics and unneeded medication for the safety of animals and the environment.

BiteyShark Tue 24-Oct-17 09:07:53

Well I take preventative medicine for certain conditions so I don't think I do anything to my dog that I would not do for myself. If the side effects of medication outweighed the benefits then of course I would stop medication (for me or the dog).

I think you are either happy to not medicate and treat the dog and house if and when they get worms/fleas/ticks etc or you are happy to medicate to prevent and treat so you never get the symptoms (and need to deflea the whole house grin). It's a personal choice between the dog owner (alongside their vet of course).

mrsjoyfulprizeforraffiawork Tue 24-Oct-17 13:25:33

My last dog had Advocate spot-on every month and current dog also - neither has had any problem with it but, of course, that doesn't mean yours won't.

Floralnomad Tue 24-Oct-17 15:24:22

My stance is exactly as stated by bitey

juliainthedeepwater Tue 24-Oct-17 15:37:16

We've always used Advocate Spot On on our whippet (she's almost two now) and have never had any issues. It's good for peace of mind as she's a bit of a snail-muncher!

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