To spay now or after her first seaso

[NewPuppyMum]

DDog is a golden retriever and almost seven months.

We were going to have her done at six months, as per the vet's advice but then another staff member suggested we let her have a season first.

Neighbour suggests the same as her dog had bladder trouble after being done. They have allowed their new dog to have a season and as it was easy they are allowing another before she gets done. They've said better for her development.

A lady today has said no benefit to letting her have a season. She was very forceful in her advice on many subjects and I felt annoyed I felt I had to justify some decisions. Need to work on that. She described what happens when a boy dog does the necessary and how traumatic it will be for my dog. It did sound horrific. She also said many dogs have bladder trouble and treatment is drops in their food.

I also feel bad about a month on lead very early and late for her as she loves to be free and would not like going out in the dark.

There was blood in her bed a few weeks ago. Dh thought teeth related though I'm not sure. She's started doing little wees which could be a sign she's starting. Last week a boy dog tried his luck but the owned said my dog wasn't in season, he just liked her. Someone else has suggested she may have had her season and finished.

We are certain she is not having puppies. I want to do the best thing for her but when everyone says different how does one know which the best option is?

I'd be very grateful for any advice. Thank you 🐕

[LilCamper]

Recent research suggests we should let dogs mature both physically and mentally before spaying. For a goldie that is about 2 years. They need their hormones for loads of things including ligament formation.

[BiteyShark]

It's a hard one as I was all for getting my boy dog done at the earliest e.g. 6 months but then having read more information I have decided to wait until he is an adult to make sure he has stopped growing.

For your dog you have to way up the possibility of puppies on top of that should an accident occur. I suspect there is no right or wrong answer for this one.

[Thattimeofyearagain]

We also were doing to get ddog castrated at 6 months but after looking into it waited until he was about 16 months and his growth plates had closed ( lab x).

[ProfessionalPirate]

The main argument for early spaying is the proven significant reduction in the risk of mammary tumours, a very common disease in unspayed bitches.

• 0.5% for those spayed before first season
  
• 8% for those spayed between 1st and 2nd
  
• 26% for after 2nd season
  

The issues are not the same for male dogs, so not comparable.

[NewPuppyMum]

I do think it is different for boy dogs and would need owners of bitches to tell me their experiences.

It is a difficult one as need to way up the advantages of letting her have a season to see if they outway the risks of mating, pregnancy, the upset of being on lead for weeks on end etc.

[NewPuppyMum]

ProfessionalPirate - it was the vet saying about the risk of breast cancer which initially mad us decide to have her done at six months. I lost my cat to BC so it's a difficult reminder.

[Wolfiefan]

Being on a lead won't necessarily stop a determined boy dog though will it?
I have a giant breed and advice is not to spay before she's two. That's going to make life awkward but their are sensible reasons for this.

[SeeMyVest]

My bitch came into her first season the day before she was booked in to be spayed, cheeky madam.
However, after speaking to several dog owners I think it was for the best anyway. Someone mentioned they may stay in a more "puppy state" i.e. Boisterous if they're arent allowed to mature before being spayed.
The season itself wasn't difficult, very little mess but she was weeing a lot so it sounds as though your dog may be there or getting there ! Sorry to sound crude but does she not look 'different down there?' My girl literally had a baboon butt, very obvious!!
I guess much of the advice is anecdotal but what I don't agree with is the vet pushing her own agenda!!

[Soubriquet]

I would let medium and large breeds mature first for sure

So 2 years for giant breeds and at least 18 months for medium and large breeds.

Even small and toy breeds I would want them to be at least a year old

It's all about weighing up the risks and I think there's more benefit in waiting

Not like your waiting 5+ years

[SparklingRaspberry]

I only read the first line

Please please please do not get her done until she is fully grown! Physically as well as emotionally.

Getting them done before they have fully matured, be it male or female, stunts growth and can lead to future health problems.

I am a veterinary assistant and unless there are complicated health concerns, we do not spay or neuter until they are at least 1 years old, however we do advice to wait until they've fully matured. Most decents vets will not recommend it until they're at least a year old.

It really isn't difficult when they're in season. Just keep them on a lead when out in public and try to walk at the least busy times. Oh and keep away from male dogs which haven't been done

[Wolfiefan]

How on earth are you supposed to know whether the dog walking towards you is a male that hasn't been done?
Seriously I though the advice was don't walk your dog in public when she has a season.

[SparklingRaspberry]

OP, whilst there is a slight chance of this that and the other happening by not getting her done, you are putting her at FAR more risk by spaying so early.

[Veterinari]

Professional that benefit is not 'proven' in fact a 2012 meta analysis concluded it wasn't firm enough evidence to make firm recommendations for neutering, the British small animal vet association don't include a reduced risk of mammary neoplasia in their neutering position statement for this reason.

Research specifically in GR shows that neutering increases risks of several types of cancer and joint diseases. These risks may be related to age at neutering.

I usually recommend GR to be neutered at 18-24 months, depending on the individual dog and owner.

[Veterinari]

NewPuppyMum the risks of malignant mammary cancer in cats is very different - you can't really compare across species.

[ProfessionalPirate]

Waiting for a giant breed is fair enough as they tend to start their seasons much later anyway, and have fewer per year.

A goldie isn't a giant breed though, and I wouldn't want to go beyond 2nd season for any bitch. I don't think people who blindly advocate 'fully maturing' have a true grasp of the situation.

OP out of interest, who is the 'lady' you spoke to today?

[LilCamper]

I for one am not 'blindly advocating', I have read the research papers.

[Wolfiefan]

Veterinari thanks so much for that clear information. I'm aware my pup is a somewhat unusual case!

[Pippin8]

I've read lots of research. My bitch is a large breed & has had 2 seasons, she'll be spayed laproscopically when she's 20 months. This is because I wanted her to be fully grown & mature.

Initially, I did want to wait & let her have another season just so she was over 2. But, she doesn't cope well, she's clingy, lethargic, cries a lot & gets terrible diarrhoea. She also bleeds a fair bit & her breed is prone to pyometra.

[NewPuppyMum]

I know I can't compare dogs with cats! I just was making the point as to why we were taking notice. I lost three pets in five months. It was horrible.

The lady I spoke to today was a dog walker who has had dogs all her life
I felt she was trying to tell me what to do as a "novice" dog owner.

Dh and I will discuss again tonight.

Thank you for all the great advice.

[NewPuppyMum]

Seems that while the mating might be horrible for DDog the resultant difficulties of having her done too early will last for a long time as opposed to a few minutes.

[NewPuppyMum]

We've decided to wait. Dh was saying get her done now but he's read the thread and has agreed we'll wait.

Thanks everyone.

[Ylvamoon]

NewPuppyMum well done! Waiting is best let her be a puppy and grow up into a beautiful mature dog.
BTW I own 3 girls all fully intact. I'm lucky enough to have seasons every 8 months and so far I had no problems or unwanted puppies! It's easily managed if you have a secure garden (girls will be looking for a fella as well!), and take your girl for a long leash walk away from popular dog walking areas.

[finkykuckery]

Our 9 month pup is in her 2nd week now. It's been ok, partly because she's subdued so exercise hasn't been high on her priority list, plus the weather has happily kept her in! We've been told 3 months after 1st season to spay.
Wolfie Fan- You can definitely take out on lead, you do not need to keep indoors. They still need exercise. I have still walked twice daily but kept out of the park. We cross the road every time we see another dog but I am well able to tell a dog intact now or not! Quite easy- look out for the pom-poms! I was not sure of the etiquette but local dog walkers say of course still needs exercise just keep on lead. And she is slow just now as just sniffing every lampost on each walk.

[FleshEmoji]

www.psychologytoday.com/blog/canine-corner/201702/are-there-behavior-changes-when-dogs-are-spayed-or-neutered

Makes a case for not at all.

[BiteyShark]

Think I might have to go and read some more studies on the subject. I do know our vet said they won't do it if there are 'any' behavioural issues as they could be cemented or made worse by neutering.