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Battle of wills Puppy V Lead V Me

(16 Posts)
Lostriver Wed 03-Dec-14 15:59:38

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Lostriver Wed 03-Dec-14 16:00:13

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

FibonacciSeries Wed 03-Dec-14 16:03:14

Mine was terrible on the lead, I bought the Dog Whisperer's book and it talks about how you have to have 'dominant' attitude, a lot of it is about body language, so now I behave like I won't take any shit from him and he's got lots better. Still not great, but better.

crapcrapcrapcrap Wed 03-Dec-14 19:07:19

Please please don't follow the Dog Whisperer advice. His methods are outdated and cruel (mostly emotionally but sometimes physically too - YouTube "showdown with Holly" to see him hit a dog who is extremely anxious and distressed, guarding her food, and instead of trying to teach her she doesn't need to fear that he'll take it he behaves in a horribly threatening way and then smacks her sad

Science has shown us much better ways of doing things.

At 13 weeks your pup is still tiny. How far or how long is she walking for?

Lostriver Wed 03-Dec-14 19:29:21

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

crapcrapcrapcrap Wed 03-Dec-14 19:43:59

I would start at home or in the garden, teaching her to walk at your side. This can be done successfully using clicker training (although I struggle with leads and treats and a clicker all at once so I use the word "yes!" instead of the clicker). The more you work on it the more likely she is to offer it on walks because her brain will become wired to choosing that behaviour. Then you add a cue word and you can request it when you need it. This takes an awful lot of repetition but perseverance will pay off!

Chrismoosemama Wed 03-Dec-14 20:00:29

Why Dominance is So Last Year.

I second crapcrapcrapcrap's post. Dominance theory has been scientifically discredited for a number of years now. Dogs respond to positive/force-free training methods, there is never a need to 'dominate' or oppress them to get the behaviour you want them to do.

What sort of training are you doing with her? You could easily use a clicker or marker word to teach her that it's far more rewarding to walk nicely to and from school than it is to sit down every few steps and refuse to move. She sounds like a smart cookie. Why should she want to walk to boring old school, when she knows all the delights of the park and woods are in the opposite direction. You need to make it worth her while and convince her that she really does want to go and pick the dcs up after all.

Chrismoosemama Wed 03-Dec-14 20:01:17

Cross posted ... wot she said! grin

insanityscratching Wed 03-Dec-14 20:35:50

Eric still has the occasional stand off too. He has definite ideas of which way he'd like to go but I have ham in my pocket and he likes ham more than anything and he forgets or more likely he's following the ham he's on a sit down protest after walking three paces to get the ham

SpicyBear Wed 03-Dec-14 21:49:57

Is there anywhere really fun you can go to in that direction? Different park for example, or different route to park or woods. Build up a good association with going that way and show her it's worth going with you as it doesn't only mean a short boring walk.

FibonacciSeries Wed 03-Dec-14 22:40:19

Well, the Dog Whisperer's book does not advocate violence of any kind towards dogs, either physical or emotional. For me, the issue was that my puppy was engaging in a battle of wills with me and he could sense that I felt insecure. Now I stand taller when calling him, use a lower pitch voice and am more assertive (not aggressive) and he follows me and has fantastic recall. But YMMV.

crapcrapcrapcrap Wed 03-Dec-14 22:59:36

Fibonacci, dogs can't really sense insecurity. Being assertive is meaningless. Science has disproven this whole idea, and by following his theories you are missing out on the chance to truly understand your dog and have a deeper bond with him. A quick google came up with the following link on the first page of results:

www.care2.com/causes/why-the-dog-whisperer-has-dog-training-entirely-wrong.html

FibonacciSeries Wed 03-Dec-14 23:16:18

Thanks for the link, I will look into it tomorrow (going to sleep now). I don't have a lot of experience with dogs so I'm always willing to educate myself and learn more. I do, however, believe that animals feel insecurity, and this belief is based on my many years of horseback riding. But I can be convinced that there are better ways of training a dog than the ones I'm using. More inclined to look into them when suggested nicely than when there's an implication that I'm being cruel or traumatising my dog, since, as everyone here, I love the stubborn pup to pieces grin

crapcrapcrapcrap Wed 03-Dec-14 23:25:43

I am sure you aren't being cruel, I really am - but Cesar Millan is a cruel man and his methods are based on a made-up notion of "calm assertive energy". He has been challenged repeatedly by the very best trainers and behaviourists and refuses to acknowledge that his methods are now outdated and unnecessary. Which is a shame because a household name like him could be a huge force for good sad

Another link worth looking at if you feel so inclined is www.dogwelfarecampaign.org/press-statement.php

The site isn't very attractive but it was written by Rachel Casey of Bristol University who is a CCAB (certified clinical animal behaviourist) and as you can see the information on it is endorsed by the Dogs Trust, RSPCA, Wood Green etc.

You don't need any calm assertive energy to train your dog. You need a wee bit of science, a lot of patience and a lot of perseverance. smile

Lostriver Thu 04-Dec-14 06:21:21

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Chrismoosemama Thu 04-Dec-14 09:53:15

It's very common for pups to do this. Just carry on being consistent and rewarding the right behaviour and she'll soon move on.

I used to have a pony that would go lame if we turned him a certain way - he didn't like crossing the stream - but would break into a canter the minute you turned him around, no sign of a limp at all! As I said, it's a sign she's intelligent ... and she has bags of personality. grin

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