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Please help - vets? Grapes!

(22 Posts)
Urv Wed 12-Mar-14 09:56:48

Really want some advice. My 43kg 7 mth old ate around 10 (or fewer) grapes. He had vomiting induced within 2 hours at vets but they want to keep him in, on fluids for 48 hours.

That seems really excessive to me. Vet said even if bloods look fine the kidneys still need to be flushed through just in case. He'll hate it there, I'd love to get him after say 24 or even 12 hours. He's insured btw.

Thank you for any advice or opinions.

mistlethrush Wed 12-Mar-14 09:59:10

We had a dog that loved grapes - this was years before it became known they weren't very good for them - she must have eaten at least 10 grapes on numerous occasions and was a lot lighter than that. However, she was a different dog and different dogs have different tolerances to things that are bad for them...

Urv Wed 12-Mar-14 10:03:57

I know! My last dogs were always eating grapes! It's so hard, I wish I'd never taken him to vets tbh.

HoneyDragon Wed 12-Mar-14 10:08:23

Have they indicated any symptoms that have concerned them? Seems a very excessive precaution.

mistlethrush Wed 12-Mar-14 10:08:48

Wiki (I know not the best source of facts but only one I can find with my lack of vet knowledge) suggests that "The estimated toxic dose of grapes is about 19 g/kg" so your dog would have had to eat 0.8kg to get to what is thought to be a toxic dose...

Urv Wed 12-Mar-14 10:08:52

No symptoms.

Urv Wed 12-Mar-14 10:11:25

The vet was young and basically quoting what she'd been told ie not based on years of experience. Also, big practice, insured dog...why not do the lot? Possibly not fair of me but I only want what's best for him, not to do this for the sake of it - he'll be so unhappy.

hellymelly Wed 12-Mar-14 10:17:39

I am another person who had a grape loving dog, before anyone knew they were a problem , and he routinely ate more than 10. I think he was about 10kg in weight (fox terrier). He died of a liver problem at nearly 11, but he never had any kidney issues, so I can only assume they didn't harm him, although I have agonised over it since finding out they are toxic to dogs.

hellymelly Wed 12-Mar-14 10:39:10

That isn't to stop you going ahead with the vet's treatment by the way, i would always stick with the most cautious plan of action, just to reassure you that he will probably be fine.

VetNurse Wed 12-Mar-14 10:59:21

I've seen a greyhound go in to kidney failure after eating 2 grapes so better to be safe than sorry. Every dog has a different tolerance level.

Urv Wed 12-Mar-14 12:52:30

Thanks all. I'm hoping to get him tonight after vomiting and today on fluids. vetnurse don't greyhounds have an interesting metabolism or unusual muscle/fat ratio or something, making them susceptible to reactions to certain things? I may be making that up!

SilverShadows Wed 12-Mar-14 13:33:56

My Dalmatian ate a punnet of grapes at 5 months. They originally wanted to keep in for 3 days due to age but let him come home after about 36 hours once they were happy.

So in my experience they prepare you for longer but it could be shorter.

Lonecatwithkitten Wed 12-Mar-14 15:23:00

The evidence about grapes being toxic came from Bordeaux where one of the most prestigious chateaux lost a dog who snacked from the vine and died rapidly.
It is like chocolate we don't know in advance which dogs are susceptible till they have irreversible symptoms. Hence we always err on the side of caution.

HoneyDragon Wed 12-Mar-14 15:31:30

I'm sure if he seems fine they'll let him home? I've not known a vet keep a dog in and stressed unnecessarily smile

hellymelly Wed 12-Mar-14 15:34:11

That is interesting lonecat- do they affect different breeds differently, or different dogs in general? Our beagle cross that I grew up with ate quite a lot of chocolate (many of the chocolate decorations on the tree one year) with no ill effects at all, she lived to 17 and a half. But i know that dogs have died, so I did wonder how she got away with it. (should add this is before there was any mention of chocolate being toxic, in the days of doggy chocs as treats as dogs were often given chocolate buttons ).

Urv Wed 12-Mar-14 18:27:58

I spoke to 2 vets informally and both advised it was over cautious so I've collected him and will be returning for blood tests tomorrow. Had to sign a disclaimer, they didn't entirely approve but he seems fine and vomited soon after eating them so I'm not too worried.

Thanks for you help

Lonecatwithkitten Wed 12-Mar-14 18:37:55

Helly chocolate is like peanuts and eggs in humans why does one individual have an allergic reaction and another not. Dogs with full on chocolate allergy have an anaphylactic reaction.
Grapes/raisins etc we just don't know why one dog gets kidney failure and another doesn't one possibility is that an allergic reaction causes certain proteins to bind together in the kidney and cause the damage we know some other things do this.

hellymelly Wed 12-Mar-14 18:45:53

Oh, I didn't realise it was an allergy issue, I thought that the theobromine in chocolate was hepatoxic in dogs.

Lonecatwithkitten Wed 12-Mar-14 19:41:06

Yes hepatotoxic, but this also an anaphylaxis which I have seen.

bakewelltartandcustard Wed 12-Mar-14 21:39:58

Vets seem to extract the maximum from insured dogs' owners. My dog had 10 days of treatment and 3 appointments for a minor injury which, in a human, would not have warented seeing a doctor.
Vets also get new owners to start health plans which include 6 monthly checks and blood tests. Our children only see a doctor if they are ill.
Owners are also ripped off with special foods for every breed and age. It's all unnecessary.

Lonecatwithkitten Wed 12-Mar-14 23:14:50

And sadly bakewell clients regularly complain because we didn't do enough for their animal we just can't win.

ADishBestEatenCold Thu 13-Mar-14 00:12:19

Vets seem to extract the maximum from insured dogs' owners

Have you ever done business with any insurer (of any type) who will pay out a single penny more than they have to?

Come to that, do you imagine for a moment that animal insurers don't have their own access to highly qualified animal health professionals (including vets) with whom they can freely consult?

If your vet asks you if your pet is insured, they do so for a number of reasons (for example for administrative purposes) and not least so that they don't offer an impossible hope to some poor, uninsured, devastated owner, who is already struggling to meet the regular bills.
It would be sheer cruelty, for example, to offer such an owner the hope of prolonging their terminally ill dog's life by (say) six months, only if that already distraught and impoverished owner managed to come up with £3000 for palliative treatments or surgeries.

Most vets do not enter the profession with a view to getting rich. Fact.

Animals are expensive to keep and care for. Fact.

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