Which pup?

[snala]

So I went to meet the breeder and pups that I've been waiting for, they are only a few weeks old. During the discussion the breeder mentioned that she had a 6 month old that she was thinking about selling. So I asked if I could see him.

He was kept to show but she doesn't think he will quite make it. He is very sociable, house trained and has just started lead training..... And I love him!!!!

I have now come home to decide on which pup I would like and I've got to let her know.

Any thoughts?

[Floralnomad]

Get the puppy not the older one ,it could well have issues .

[moosemama]

Definitely go for the younger pup.

Very often pups that have allegedly 'been held back for showing' turn out to be the ones with problems and/or that have been sold once and returned.

He may have seemed friendly and sociable in his home, but how much has he actually been out of that home, was he fully socialised within his critical socialiation period. I doubt it, given that he's only just started lead training at 6 months old.

Sadly I have seen this scenario far too many times.

[needastrongone]

I agree. With the puppy, you are getting a blank canvas, I would be a little suspicious of the older one, sorry.

[Gooner123]

I agree go with the puppy,6 mths to start lead training sounds way to dodgy,put it out of your mind & think about the little bundle of joy.

[Stockhausen]

Eek, gut says younger!

Is she giving the older one at a discount?

[daisydotandgertie]

I think the six month old is worth considering.

What breed is it?

A puppy could fail to make it to show for a billion reasons - and most of them are irrelevant to a pet.

The lead training comment is odd - does she mean lead training for the show ring, or walking on a lead full stop?

[snala]

Sorry, I'm assuming lead training for the ring. ( I have no intention of showing him)

He will be the same price as the other pups.

[moosemama]

But why would she be lead training him for the ring if she's decided he's not suitable? Something doesn't seem quite right there.

My Aunt and Uncle were offered a six month old dog that had been run-on as a possible show dog. He'd never seen outside the breeder's home and was a nervous wreck. I have heard similar stories time and again. There's actually a MNetter on here who has had a lot of problems with an older pup she took on under similar circumstances.

I'm not saying that it's always the case. I'm sure there are decent breeders who run pups on and then sell them when they don't make the grade - a lot can change in a pup's coat, conformation and temperament as they grown that would mean they might be unsuitable for showing, despite showing potential when very young. Personally though, I wouldn't risk it, but you have met the breeder and seen the dogs and I haven't.

[daisydotandgertie]

I'd expect the price to be in the region of a puppy price - unless specific training has been undertaken in which case I'd expect it to be more expensive.

I think my reaction would mostly be from the gut - exactly what feeling I'd got from the breeder and the set up she ran. I'd also assess how similar her living conditions were to my own to see how easily the pup would fit in with me. Six months is still very young, and realistically you've only lost out on 12 weeks of puppyhood.

However, to balance that she has had two litters very close together. I would have a hard look at why and who the sire and dam were. Is the breed a popular one or not?

[daisydotandgertie]

A serious show breeder would be training ring craft from the very beginning - and lead work could be part of that, but I do think you need to ask more questions and have another visit.

Also look up her history in the show ring - see if her story rings true. What do the breed society say about her?

[snala]

I have been twice to see the pups, once arranged and once unannounced with the children. The current pups are a different dam and sire.

The 6 month old I'm looking at was one of two kept to show.

The breeder does very well at crufts and is showing the pups dad and litter mate this year. She has been breeding for 25 years and is kc assured.

I really don't know what to do, I am going to question the lead training as that is v odd. I may have mid understood.

[FiscalCliffRocksThisTown]

What breed is it?

[MamaPingu]

Would it be daft to ask to take the puppy for a small walk around the street? Just to see if there's any anxiety issues with the pup?
As some have said they can be kept inside their entire lives and then panic once outside their comfort zone

[mrslaughan]

For various reasons we got our puppy from the breeder at 5 months, and he couldn't be more perfect......however I would tread very carefully....I would want to know what she has done with him....has he been to ring craft classes?

Being a KC assured breeder means nothing really, unfortunately.

Viva - another regular poster did a v similar thing, and she has had quite the opposite experience to me.

[moosemama]

That's who I was thinking about mrslaughan and her story wasn't the first time I've come across very similar situations.

[FiscalCliffRocksThisTown]

Why, what happened to viva?

( paranoid as got my pup at 5 months)

[snala]

Thank you all very much for giving me some brill advice. I think I may go for a younger pup as I'm concerned about socialisation.

He seems very quiet and reserved. I don't want a nervous pup!

He's a miniature long haired daschund.

[tabulahrasa]

Um - if you don't trust a breeder to have socialized an older puppy...why are you buying any puppy from them?

[FiscalCliffRocksThisTown]

good question...

[snala]

Because there is a huge difference between an 8 week old pup going to a new home and a 6 month old pup that she was keeping.
I am very happy with the breeder, I just think a younger pup will be better to mould to our busy family. The older pup may not be used to being in such a busy environment and the comings and goings of a family as the breeder doesn't have children.
The pupils quite quiet and reserved I think we would be too much for him.

[snala]

• pup is

[tabulahrasa]

Those first eight weeks are vital too in terms of socialisation - either it's a good breeder and doing everything they can to raise well socialised puppies, or they're not.

[needastrongone]

In an ideal world, the puppy should have been born into a busy household, as the first 8 weeks are vital, ditto what Tabulahrasa said. Hopefully, if the family don't have children, they will have done all that they can to make sure the pups are exposed to as much mild stimuli as possible, perhaps they will have borrowed some kids! It is really important, even at this young age.

What breed is the puppy?

[CaptainTripps]

What breed is the pup????

I was in a similar situation and I got the 6 month old. There were no issues whatsoever. Genuine reason for selling. We walked him a few times and spent lots of time with him.

He is a poppet. And he is house-trained! I have rather nicely skipped that hard work early puppy phase. Go for the older one.

[Booboostoo]

At six months I would only take the pup if you can trust the breeder 1000%.

First of all the background story they have told you has to be true. If the puppy has already been rehomed and returned it could be a big problem.

The breeder should have an environment similar to yours, e.g. puppy brought up in the house, with children, other animals (if you have other animals), etc. The breeder should have spent weeks 8 to 16 of the puppy's life doing intense socialisation with everything and everyone - this is absolutely crucial and if this part is missed out it causes problems some of which you won't know about until the puppy is 12-18 months old.

The breeder should also have done basic training, ideally in a formal environment with other dogs as well as at home. At this age the puppy should have a recall, sit, down, 'leave it' command for food, be house trained, be used to being petted and groomed and the start of walking nicely on the lead. Ring craft skills are irrelevant to you unless you want to show.

Finally I would expect a discounted price for a 6mo puppy as they are much harder to sell.