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Dispatches - Growing Up Poor

(283 Posts)
TurquoiseKiss Tue 03-Dec-19 10:59:48

Did anyone see this? I'm half way through on catch up - very tough to watch.

Bluebutterfly90 Tue 03-Dec-19 12:42:18

Just finished watching this myself, I recorded it last night.
Unfortunately I had a similar upbringing in the 90s, and I'm so angry that children are still suffering in this way, or even worse.
The current system just isn't working if so many people are having to resort to food banks and charity.
I live around Cambridge too, so we see the inequality regularly and it just seems to be getting worse. As the show said, so many people are one disaster away from being in the same boat.
All I can think about is how many people we could actually help if the super rich and the corporations in this country would just pay their bloody taxes.
I'll get off my soapbox now, but yeah, really upsetting that this is the reality in 2019.

MrsMaiselsMuff Tue 03-Dec-19 12:53:55

I've not watched it yet, but did see a comment on Facebook suggesting that families buy an Aga to keep warm. FFS.

I know through charity work how bad things are, and for so many families. One particular group we're seeing more and more of is families with either a disabled child or a disabled parent. Families that used to get support and respite but now are left to it.

Too many people are happy to turn a blind eye because it doesn't affect them. I have tried having rational conversations with them but all I get back is "that's nice dear" hmm

TurquoiseKiss Tue 03-Dec-19 12:57:57

Agreed, so many of us are one big expenditure away from being in a really tricky financial situation. Hearing Rose's mum say funerals were expensive was heartbreaking when she was talking about having to arrange her own daughters.

Good to see Danielle's mum moved in to a nicer home, and Courtney's family were very brave making the move to Hull for cheaper rent.

Can't help but feel the MH issues and depression suffered by some of the parents will only be exacerbated in their situations? Wishing them all good luck going forward.

Zoflorabore Tue 03-Dec-19 13:03:01

Am also half way through on catch up but need to go to a church event for dd’s school now. From what I’ve seen so far ( the first 2 children’s stories ) I’m shocked at how little food was in the home.

I’m in a poor area myself and due to a recent change in circs have had to make a claim for Universal Credit but we’ve got a good start on food etc. I know one family who live like this but that is down to both parents being alcoholics and cocaine users which angers me.

Will report back once I’ve watched it all.

longleggedgal Tue 03-Dec-19 13:04:55

I haven't managed to watch it yet but hoping to tonight with my two teenage daughters. I think it does kids good to watch things like this to show how others live. I'm not well off at all I'm a single mum to five but I've brought them all up to be generous and good hearted. Me and my eldest did a toy drive this morning to a local charity that helps kids like these who will not be getting anything this Xmas because their parents can't afford it. We took 10 toys and 10 selection boxes that we'd brought between us it cost £50. We decided to not get are monthly Chinese in nov and instead support the charity. It's a shame people are in this situation in these times but if everyone just gave a little something it helps loads.

HigherFurtherFasterBaby Tue 03-Dec-19 13:06:40

I’ll be watching once DC are in bed. I don’t understand how more people are not absolutely furious about this level of poverty in 2019.

Although most seem to think of it as “their own fault” and have zero sympathy.

longleggedgal Tue 03-Dec-19 13:06:39

Our

hanahsaunt Tue 03-Dec-19 13:13:33

I haven't seen it yet as I was at a school meeting last night. Whilst there one of the parents shared that they had hosted a city school for a farm visit earlier in the day. Three children had been unable to come as they didn't have coats to wear and the school had given out all their spares. One of the children was utterly bewildered having been removed from a different county 100s of miles away to here because it was a cheaper authority in which to be housed. The teacher told her of the children who don't eat over weekends. There are children in our lovely very middle class rural school whose families don't have money to spare but they do have enough to eat and clothes to wear. I know about the visible poverty, the foodbanks, the school holiday schemes to make sure people can eat in the holidays, the spare uniform quietly given out in some of our local city schools but children who can't go on school trips for lack of a coat and children who cry because the coat they do have got muddy which will make mummy cry because they are in a motel without a washing machine - it was just quite shocking. We do some but clearly we will do more now that the reality has been brought into focus.

HeIenaDove Tue 03-Dec-19 14:09:30

Unfortunately the people who NEED to watch this............wont.

Northernsoullover Tue 03-Dec-19 14:15:37

I had a period of time on Income Support where I was on my arse due to the difference in my rent and the amount I received on HB. Watching this last night made me realise that although it didn't seem it at the time I was a damn sight better off than these families. Largely due to the fact that it was over the summer. If I'd had to do a winter like that I'd have probably been in the same boat.
I wonder if there is anywhere we could donate towards fuel so that people don't have to go cold? I'm off to Google...

diege Tue 03-Dec-19 14:58:14

I thought it was heartbreaking and took me back to the financial effects that we as a family suffered after a bereavement and a recent hospital diagnosis. The buoyancy of the children and their quiet acceptance of the situation ('mum says we don't have that kind of money') broke my heart.

avocuddl Tue 03-Dec-19 15:30:43

I've just started watching and it's heartbreaking.

jenthelibrarian Tue 03-Dec-19 15:45:27

I watched this in angry disbelief, wept buckets over it.

It's inspired me to see if I can volunteer locally for CAB or something similar, we already donate to food banks.

We need basic standards of decent housing, support for mental health services, some sort of simple state non-rip-off funeral provision [that poor family where the daughter died of cancer broke my heart] and that's just for starters.

avocuddl Tue 03-Dec-19 15:51:47

Me too. Going to pop to Tesco soon- think they're donating an extra 20% to any donations at the mo

FoamingAtTheUterus Tue 03-Dec-19 16:00:41

We grew up in very similar circumstances but at least had.home security (( my mum owned our house. )) Most of my clothes as a young child came from the people who she used to clean for, they'd offer up hand me downs so at least I did have good, quality clothing.........teenage years were hellish. There just wasn't the money for fads and trends.

My brother educated himself out if the situation and took full advantage of the system in the 90s. All of us have made having the security of a roof over our heads a priority, other than one sister who is in a similar situation to the.lady in the programme. She's a carer for her disabled DC and racking up debts from the bedroom tax. She can't win, her eldest DC lives in a residential college Monday to Friday so she's pretty much lost all her benefits for
her (( that was her choice as she wanted her to have the experience )) but must be available for all hospital stays as college staff won't support plus all holidays and weekends so can't work. She has to keep the 3rd bedroom to be able to have her son stay as he needs his own room yet isn't exempt from the tax. She's been housed miles from town (( why do they always put housing estates full of poor people miles away from all amenities ?? )) So is frequently walking 6 miles (( 3 miles there and back )) to buy cheap food because her benefits don't stretch to bus fares. And that's shit at this time of year. Plus at the weekend her daughter still needs entertaining and all support now needs funding via her pip. All of this is paid for when they're children yet as adults when respite etc is needed more than ever they're often penalised twice.

I didn't feel that poor tho (( looking back I obviously was )) I think social media makes everyone a lot more aware of both what they're missing out on and how other people are living.

AuntieMarys Tue 03-Dec-19 16:34:48

That poor girl doing her GCSEs. And failing them. I hope the school are supportive.

dottypotter Tue 03-Dec-19 17:04:20

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

dottypotter Tue 03-Dec-19 17:05:18

They always say they are poor yet have money to smoke drink and have pets.

TamingToddler Tue 03-Dec-19 17:09:46

@dottypotter I'll go ahead and assume you didn't watch this show then? All the families had a sudden change in circumstances/ fleeing domestic abuse/partner leaving. Didn't see anyone smoke and drink either, and no pets either.

Agree it was horrific watching and really really sad.

UtuNorantiPralatongsThirdEye Tue 03-Dec-19 17:13:06

biscuit for you dotty

Pinkandpurplehairedlady Tue 03-Dec-19 17:15:49

If I knew how to do the biscuit I’d be giving Dottypotter one.

I’m on full universal credit after working all my life because of mental health issues. I’m also a single mum of two - what would you like me to do? Send them to live with their dad simply because he works and doesn’t need benefit top ups?

Bluebutterfly90 Tue 03-Dec-19 17:17:09

'So depressing' that people turn to the government?

If our government exists only to help people who can already help themselves then it has failed.

dontalltalkatonce Tue 03-Dec-19 17:19:36

Wow, the Tory bots just can't resist a good dig.

diege Tue 03-Dec-19 17:24:54

What a horribly ignorant attitude dotty
As others have said, the theme here is that unpredictable circumstances can land anyone in poverty. As I know from my own circumstances, terminal illness and suicide don't discriminate and can have a devastating impact on finance, regardless of background, career, family size etc.

JustAnotherPoster00 Tue 03-Dec-19 17:29:47

Wow, the Tory bots just can't resist a good dig.

Whats no point of voting Tory if theres no one below you to kick down and make yourself feel better about your lot in life, they look at those above them and think I cant have that but I'll make sure those fuckers below me dont have what I have

JustAnotherPoster00 Tue 03-Dec-19 17:30:06

*Theres

AuntieMarys Tue 03-Dec-19 17:58:09

There was a dog in one of the families

JustAnotherPoster00 Tue 03-Dec-19 18:00:15

Are you suggesting that they should have eaten the dog or poor people arent allowed pets? Which one because I cant be sure with some people on this site anymore

diege Tue 03-Dec-19 18:08:37

You'd seriously begrudge a family with such stress and constant anxiety having a pet? hmm

Carpathian2 Tue 03-Dec-19 18:09:37

*
*
Whats no point of voting Tory if theres no one below you to kick down and make yourself feel better about your lot in life, they look at those above them and think I cant have that but I'll make sure those fuckers below me dont have what I have

Well said. You've put the stinking attitude of Tory voters in a nutshell.

I used to be like the people in the programme, my lowest point was shoplifting my dc's Christmas presents because I just didn't have the money. My xh, who was always supportive, had just lost his job and had to take out a doorstep loan to pay his rent and provide the basics for us because I had nothing.

Things are much better now, but it's always on a knife edge because my health isn't great and I'm worried that I'll have to give up work. Some people really live in a bubble angry

Blondeshavemorefun Tue 03-Dec-19 18:32:39

Was so sad watching

To sleep in coats

To not eat so their child could eat

The emptiness of fridge freezer and cupboard sad

So wrong in this day and age sad

Gilead Tue 03-Dec-19 18:46:09

You are a deeply unpleasant person Dotty.

FoamingAtTheUterus Tue 03-Dec-19 18:49:56

The lady with the dog had fled domestic violence and moved her children miles away to keep them safe.........dottypotter are you suggesting that those traumatised children having lost their home, school and friends and seen their mother beaten should have lost their pet as well ?? It was obvious that dog is adored. You could see it. To have taken it away would have been barbaric.

AnnaNimmity Tue 03-Dec-19 18:55:07

Really heartbreaking. Horrendous for those families. I work with many people like this and it's not at all unusual.

I can only imagine what Dotty the pp said, but she can fuck right off. The people to blame for this are the government.

Zoflorabore Tue 03-Dec-19 19:05:40

So I watched the programme and it broke
my heart to be honest. The first little girl, Courtney is the same age as my dd, 8 and is wise beyond her years. I felt so sorry for them and yes they had a dog. They also moved over 150 miles away for cheaper housing and a better life.

The second girl who sat her GCSE’s was so troubled, talked about killing herself and then failed all her exams apart from one. I was pleased they got a new build home though.

The last family who lost their daughter/sister/mum. Wow. 2 children left without a mum and yet all the children were helping out at the food initiative that helped them eat. I too am poor due to my son being refused pip after being on dla because he turned 16. We are appealing but it’s a long process. I too have been very desperate during these last 5 weeks ( get my first UC payment on Friday ) but no way can I compare my situation to theirs. We have eaten and had fuel and clothes and a decent home. Nobody should be living like this is 2019.

BumblebeeBum Tue 03-Dec-19 20:52:21

Would this be suitable to watch with a 9 year old please? We’re discussing food banks/homelessness at the moment.

HeIenaDove Tue 03-Dec-19 20:59:35

I wonder how many women watching that were gearing up/psyching themselves up to leave abusive partners and now have decided they are better off where they are because they dont want to risk being in grinding poverty. The mention of SS will have been noticed too

This was posted by @YeTalkShiteHen on a housing thread last year.

YeTalkShiteHen Mon 30-Jul-18 17:20:13
Oh I forgot lawnmowers cost a lot too, so grass would be a challenge.

*My friend who got her property because she was fleeing DV and is on benefits (no she’s not a bloody scrounger) was fined by our council twice because she hadn’t cut the grass because she can’t afford a fucking lawnmower! They fined her £125 each time and then charged £125 for the council to do it! So a £500 fine effectively because she was skint in the first place!

I bought her one because I’ve been where she is and it’s shit, really fucking shit. And being judged just makes it worse"

SquashedOrange Tue 03-Dec-19 21:00:41

Would this be suitable to watch with a 9 year old please?

Some is, but I'd probably not show the comments about self-harm/ suicide. Maybe just watch Courtney's family.

Akire Tue 03-Dec-19 21:03:22

Was few mentions of self harm and Suicide from adults and children but nothing graphic.

Have seen a lot more poverty on TV before, I think difference was this time it wasn’t on council estates but in very green and expensive areas. Housing Benefit is crazy given it doesn’t cover the rent. Then to say her is a 3 bed that landlord will accept housing benefit for so you have pay the bedroom tax. Not fair. If there was a cheaper 2 bed she would have taken that.

Sadly you can see cycle continue, kids grow up in poverty don’t do well in exams, drop out or low pay job, mental health problems and it keeps going. it’s all very well expecting the kids to just get on with it and solve it themselves but I know from experience not having money to buy books or equipment or space to study is hard. It’s hard to imagine that you are capable of pulling set out of poverty as a hard if you have never seen anything different. Or no one expects much from you, or just expected to get a low paid job anyway.

HeIenaDove Tue 03-Dec-19 21:40:44

Seeing accusations on Twitter that a Panorama pulled a prog on UC last night.

mizu Tue 03-Dec-19 22:02:25

Just watched. Thought the girl in Cambridge in particular was fabulous. Very bright and caring.

HeIenaDove Tue 03-Dec-19 23:08:54

www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/growing-up-poor-dispatches-channel-4_uk_5de650b0e4b0d50f32a8bc34?utm_hp_ref=uk-homepage

purpleme12 Tue 03-Dec-19 23:25:22

I'm watching it now
Rose's mum saying that she's stuck working 16 hours a week cos she said if she did overtime she was actually worse off.
I don't understand this?
I thought people on here say universal credit means it always benefits you working more?
Which is right?

june2007 Tue 03-Dec-19 23:28:52

I think it showed that poverty is complex and not simply solved/ caused It also showed the community that did soo much positive in food banks/food cafes and the waste not/want no coop thing.

HeIenaDove Tue 03-Dec-19 23:43:33

Yes Poverty is complex Its not caused by not having any money. hmm

june2007 Wed 24-Jul-19 18:41:26
Make a a couple of pads out of rags. What do you think people do all around he world

dontalltalkatonce Tue 03-Dec-19 23:50:38

I thought people on here say universal credit means it always benefits you working more?

No, it doesn't. The system wasn't meant to 'make work pay' but to punish people who are working poor. The IT system doesn't know how to deal with fluctuating incomes and pay periods that are often the case for people in low-wage (and seasonal, temp or zero hours/gig jobs) so the UC gets stopped or the payment gets delayed if anything goes awry, cuts off funds for months in which there are two pay periods, all manner of fucked upness. It's a shower of shit because, as housing benefit is paid in arrears, any hiccup like this and the person is in almost immediate rent arrears.

It's cost far more to create and administer UC than legacy benefits but hey, those people should just be able to magic themselves out of poverty! They're just lazy and workshy, because that is the entire mentality behind UC, it's to punish.

purpleme12 Wed 04-Dec-19 00:01:20

Oh I'm scared of going on it. I'm on tax credits I do work and thankfully although I don't have a lot of money I'm not like these people in the programme. I thought I could do overtime when I'm on universal credit but in this programme it said it didn't benefit her

But it is scary as well because like someone said you could easily find yourself in this situation. One of my worst fears getting poorly or something so you can't work.

And the dog was truly adorable.

june2007 Wed 04-Dec-19 00:01:25

Why though do people have no money? Mental health issues, family breakdown, domestic violence, having to care for the sick, benefits not kicking in, poor qualification. I,m mean seriously do I really have to spell it out HeleaDove

HeIenaDove Wed 04-Dec-19 00:13:35

Im aware of that. And ive been saying it for years as my posting history will attest. IVE never told anyone with no money to use rags while on a period.

HeIenaDove Wed 04-Dec-19 00:14:48

Here

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3066503-Universal-Credit-wont-be-paid-in-months-with-5-weeks-WTF-AIBU-to-think-no-one-realises

Its not as if it wasnt well known.

HeIenaDove Wed 04-Dec-19 00:18:51

"The lady with the dog had fled domestic violence and moved her children miles away to keep them safe..."

Yep And i wonder how many women watching will now be less likely to leave an abusive partner as a result of this.

Abuse or grinding poverty. What a choice

christmassymcchristmas Wed 04-Dec-19 00:18:52

Two of the families did smoke though, cigarettes as well. The most expensive way to keep up the habit. There are plenty families in this situation that don't. If only these programmes would feature them it wouldn't give those with a Tory outlook any further ammunition.

user764329056 Wed 04-Dec-19 03:08:11

How very predictable dotty, that age old small-minded attitude, congratulations on your level of ignorance

JustAnotherPoster00 Wed 04-Dec-19 08:34:39

www.theguardian.com/society/2019/dec/04/food-bank-northampton-people-abandoned-by-state?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

A year in the life of a food bank: ‘People who come here have been abandoned’

Natalie Bloomer visited the Weston Favell scheme in Northampton every month for a year. Here is her diary

Gran22 Wed 04-Dec-19 08:36:32

I have a grandchild who is eight in very different circumstances to the girl in Cambridge. It really brings home how messed up the benefits systems are. Thank god they could access food banks, but the house was cold. At least in the old days of open fires people could find something to burn!

No mention was made in two of the families about financial support from the absent parent. Even when dv has been an issue, the courts should step in and make sure responsibility for children is a shared expense. As usual the mothers were the ones trying to hold things together.

The family who moved to Hull showed an important point, there is affordable housing, even social housing, available in less affluent parts of the UK. However, its very likely there are fewer well paid jobs.

purpleme12 Wed 04-Dec-19 08:52:16

I wondered how they moved all their things to the new house but perhaps they took out another loan

june2007 Wed 04-Dec-19 09:14:50

Purpleme12 perhaps they had help from a charity? Perhaps they had friends? Pr yes maybe a lone.

june2007 Wed 04-Dec-19 09:17:48

And refering to my pads out of rags comment. It is actually very easy to do, you can make propper pads out of them and they last years. It,s not so stuipid you just need to get your head around it. And why take a comment from a completely different thread and quote it in another. (Like months afterwards.)

dottypotter Wed 04-Dec-19 12:25:12

Yes there are some genuine cases but you can't deny that there are so many people having children before they are in settled relationships and have somewhere to live. It's not like it used to be people got married settled down supported themselves before they had children. Everything thinks it's the gvts job to help them today. Even if it wasn't this programme there are other programmes where people plead poverty but have phones and smoke and have pets. Stop having children you can't afford. I used to do voluntary work in a housing advice centre the amount of people coming in and saying I'm pregnant what benefits can I get was disgusting. People were expecting the council to house them as well. It's too much. If you don't think this is happening you must be living on another planet.

dottypotter Wed 04-Dec-19 12:29:20

I'm not a Tory either just someone who sees the situation as it is. My parents saved up got married and bought a house. They then bought 3 kids up and both worked. Dad full time and mum part time. They stayed married never asked for a house or any money apart from the normal child benefit that all parents got. How many people are running their lives like that today?

dontalltalkatonce Wed 04-Dec-19 12:31:40

It's not like it used to be people got married settled down supported themselves before they had children.

Oh, yeah, those good ol' days, when if you were raped or groomed or made a mistake and the guy scarpered rather than marrying you, you were forced into a mum and baby home to give your child away. Workhouses if your spouse died and you were poor. Transportation of poor children. hmm

KaliforniaDreamz Wed 04-Dec-19 12:35:51

Perhaps we should revert to Workhouses then Dotty?

The demonisation of the poor certainly signposts this.

OlaEliza Wed 04-Dec-19 12:56:03

You'd seriously begrudge a family with such stress and constant anxiety having a pet?

It makes sense though that if you can't feed your kids then you can't afford a pet.

diege Wed 04-Dec-19 12:58:38

Your parents have been lucky dotty Poverty can be unpredictable, even when you've made the 'right' choices you can be laid low by illness, bereavement, relationship breakdown, poor mental health etc etc. Have some compassion - you sound very bitter and angry for someone brought up by such great role models! hmm

OlaEliza Wed 04-Dec-19 13:04:38

Re pads made of rags, this is effectively csp. And it's what people used up until disposables were made and widespread. I always wonder why the period poverty charities don't give out reusable mooncups or cloth pads. There are even sponges that are reusable. Makes no sense to me to just keep giving out disposables as you have the same problem the next month.

Sarawish Wed 04-Dec-19 13:08:54

I used to do voluntary work in a housing advice centre the amount of people coming in and saying I'm pregnant what benefits can I get was disgusting.

Fuck off Dotty.

Why do voluntary work, if all you can manage is to sneer at those less fortunate.

You are disgusting.

dontalltalkatonce Wed 04-Dec-19 13:15:10

I always wonder why the period poverty charities don't give out reusable mooncups or cloth pads. There are even sponges that are reusable. Makes no sense to me to just keep giving out disposables as you have the same problem the next month.

The outlay for these is not cheap. DD uses them (I use a mooncup but her being a teen, she doesn't want this) and period pants and to get her quality ones I probably spent about 50 quid. Secondly, anyone in great poverty may also struggle to pay for power and gas so washing the resuables could be problematic, especially for those in temp accommodation or B&Bs/hostels. I bought a mooncup years ago and it was about £30 and if you don't get on with it (some people don't) then that's you out £30.

Bluebutterfly90 Wed 04-Dec-19 13:34:46

Wow, pregnant people asking for benefits?
How dare they. Clearly they should be shipped off to a mother and baby home to atone for their sins like the 'good old days'.hmm

Never could wrap my head around the demonisation of single parents, myself. Why judge the parent who stuck around harsher than the one who didn't?

Dotty, you've had a privileged upbringing, and that's fine. That's grand. I'm glad you didnt suffer in poverty. But it wasnt through some inherent superiority that your parents had.

ReanimatedSGB Wed 04-Dec-19 13:53:50

What people did WRT saving for their first home, up to the 1980s, is completely and utterly irrelevant now. Because wages have not kept up with housing costs. The huge increase in buy-to-let not only makes housing less affordable but also leads to large numbers of landlords who are greedy, incompetent or both, so lots of people are living in overpriced, substandard accommodation. The huge sell-off of social housing has also had a massive impact.

I understand why Tory voters have to keep yelling about how poor people only have themselves to blame for their poverty. It's terrifying to have to accept that, yes, it could happen to you as well - you get ill, your partner/child gets ill, your employer goes busts or lays off half the workforce and suddenly you are one of 5000 people with similar skillsets and experience, competing for about 150 jobs which are all that's left of your industry.
The only thing that is going to fix this whole mess is taking money from the very rich and giving it directly to the very poor. Any competent economist will tell you that redistributive taxation is the only option, now, that will work.

Womenwotlunch Wed 04-Dec-19 13:55:49

As others have said, the causes of poverty can be complex.. DV, mental health issues, lack of education , divorce, addiction issues- some families experience many of these.
Dotty’s view of poverty is simplistic and fails to comprehend how these factors contribute to the dire circumstances in which these people find themselves in
I was saddened by the programme and the matter of fact manner in which the children described poverty.

dottypotter Wed 04-Dec-19 13:58:59

It was normal it wasn't a privilege. Everything has gone downhill today. Yes it is pretty disgusting getting yourself pregnant and then saying what can I get. Some people have no shame a lot of people are doing it more than once also. The government are not a bottomless pit of money. If you want to keep having sex and not getting settled and self sufficient what has it got to do with them. No wonder they have had to toughen up.

Womenwotlunch Wed 04-Dec-19 14:00:45

Agree @ReanimatedSGB- housing costS have increased and housing benefit has decreased. This means that many tenants find themselves in arrears.

HigherFurtherFasterBaby Wed 04-Dec-19 14:01:10

My Grandmother (shes 74) grew up in poverty. Her father was much older than her mother and not a well man (tragic, heartbreaking backstory that I discovered last year), and her mother worked 24/7, cook, cleaner, seamstress, all sorts.

It horrifies my now well-off Grandmother that children are STILL in that level of poverty with working parents. She also now panics like fuck about my finances (student, 3DC).

The old style benefits system allowed me to escape an abusive marriage. Were I still with him and contemplating UC... I don’t think I’d have been able to leave sad

Bluebutterfly90 Wed 04-Dec-19 14:01:49

Women get THEMSELVES pregnant?
Wow, that's a trick!

dontalltalkatonce Wed 04-Dec-19 14:02:33

They stayed married never asked for a house or any money apart from the normal child benefit that all parents got.

Well, it's a very good thing then, and lucky indeed, that your father didn't run off. Because I grew up with some children whose fathers did just this in the 70s and their families were thrown into poverty because women couldn't hold certain jobs, sexual discrimination was rife making it hard for many women to get FT jobs, discrimination in housing meant it was to even get a LL to take a single woman with kids but hey, must have been all their fault he ran off.

dontalltalkatonce Wed 04-Dec-19 14:05:45

God, yes, getting themselves pregnant! Those men having sex and not being settled first. It's all going to the dogs! Someone call the Shame Police hmm. Funny how 'the government' hasn't tightened up on men who don't pay to support their kids.

Bluebutterfly90 Wed 04-Dec-19 14:06:14

But seriously, dotty, the only point you're making is that you're shockingly out of touch. Many people are one disaster away from being in poverty. I'm sure its comforting to believe that you are safe if you make all the 'right' choices, but that just isn't true.

HigherFurtherFasterBaby Wed 04-Dec-19 14:11:03

@Bluebutterfly90

Yes, after we’ve emasculated 20 men we spontaneously reproduce.

dontalltalkatonce Wed 04-Dec-19 14:12:08

One of the families lost a child to cancer, the cheek of them, choosing devastating illness and death and then not just reporting to the workhouse! No shame! The fact that so many people think like dotty is the reason so many prefer dogs to people.

HigherFurtherFasterBaby Wed 04-Dec-19 14:13:40

My Grandmothers father was in a workhouse at 4 years old. The stuff I read was horrific.

But hey, at least he earned his keep after his father was murdered and his mother committed suicide, aye?

stophuggingme Wed 04-Dec-19 14:13:56

@dottypotter you have really depressed me. Not just because I despair at the level of swathe cutting ignorance you are displaying here, but also because I fear there are a fair few too many of your ilk out there.

You are reducing yourself to making inhuman and prejudiced decisions about society that if it translates into a vote for the Conservatives means that millions of innocent people who through no fault of their own will be condemned to an early death, trapped in abusive relationships, unable to get a decent job, years of grinding poverty and deteriorating mental health, isolation, unhappiness and a chance to actually get out of a pit and do something with their lives. And why?
Oh that’s right. Because of some anecdotal drivel about a pregnant woman looking for some help because she was pregnant. Or some other guff.

The one thing that this government has excelled at is making self absorbed, ignorant and uncaring people feel good about themselves and these “values”. It actually allows them to throw us all under the bus.

JustAnotherPoster00 Wed 04-Dec-19 14:15:59

It was normal it wasn't a privilege. Everything has gone downhill today. Yes it is pretty disgusting getting yourself pregnant and then saying what can I get. Some people have no shame a lot of people are doing it more than once also. The government are not a bottomless pit of money. If you want to keep having sex and not getting settled and self sufficient what has it got to do with them. No wonder they have had to toughen up.

Ok Boomer

dontalltalkatonce Wed 04-Dec-19 14:18:23

You win, Just grin!

BeBraveAndBeKind Wed 04-Dec-19 14:19:05

@dottypotter*They stayed married never asked for a house or any money apart from the normal child benefit that all parents got.*

Well how lovely for you. My parents saved to get married, had four children and had a house that was tied to my dad's job. Then my dad died leaving my mum a widow with four young children.

She worked long shifts to make ends meet while I looked after my siblings. She met a man who seemed charming but she realised, after they'd bought a house together, that he was an abusive alcoholic who spent the money faster than she could earn it. Cue debt and poverty and doorstep loans and CCJs. Anyone's life can turn to shit at a moment's notice and we should all remember that and show some compassion rather than judgement.

Shinesweetfreedom Wed 04-Dec-19 14:33:19

I really think everybody should be paying more tax so these situations don’t happen.Really if you have a household income of 20 thousand or more,they should increase the tax rate.The extra tax will go to those who have nothing.Those on 20 thousand or more would not miss the extra 300 or 400 hundred a year,and it could help enormously those who have no money.

HeIenaDove Wed 04-Dec-19 15:47:46

"I always wonder why the period poverty charities don't give out reusable mooncups or cloth pads"

Are you pro choice? Because you dont sound like it. You do realize that "my body my choice" MEANS JUST THAT Its not ONLY a womans right whether or not to carry on with a pregnancy It also means a right to choose what to put in or what enters her body.

And that includes whether or not to use a mooncup/cloth pad Lady Bountiful.

Or is the right to choose something else society wants to rip away from women further down the socio economic scale.

FFS!

OlaEliza Wed 04-Dec-19 15:52:08

Carry on polluting the planet then 🤷

OlaEliza Wed 04-Dec-19 15:54:39

I'm sure people using tissue and leaking everywhere because they can't afford pads would rather have something reliable every month instead of wondering where that months protection is going to come from.

Paddingtonthebear Wed 04-Dec-19 15:55:53

* Anyone's life can turn to shit at a moment's notice and we should all remember that and show some compassion rather than judgement.*

This should be printed on peoples payslips.

HeIenaDove Wed 04-Dec-19 15:59:12

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

HeIenaDove Wed 04-Dec-19 16:01:24

Its not just a choice of tissues or mooncups pro lifer.

There is disposable sanpro THEN there are those of us who have to use TENA.

ReanimatedSGB Wed 04-Dec-19 16:02:00

Also, again, those of you insisting that poverty is the poor's own fault would only need to do a very little basic research to understand that completely unregulated capitalism is the source of much of the problems. Casino-style banking practices, predatory monopolies etc have done far, far more damage than the type of social progression which means women can end abusive marriages or have access to contraception.
Don't forget that Brexit itself is and was absolutely fuck-all to do with the EU, or even nationalism. It's a heist, a big scam, perpetrated and funded by a handful of billionaires who don't want to be subject to the incoming EU tax laws which will put a stop to extreme wealth hoarding. That was always what it was about.

Gilead Wed 04-Dec-19 16:17:51

How hard is it to work out that if you can't afford Sanpro, the likelihood of being able to buy powder and run a washing machine is pretty slim?

Dotty your anecdata is unsupported by evidence. Try again.

dontalltalkatonce Wed 04-Dec-19 16:33:35

I'm sure people using tissue and leaking everywhere because they can't afford pads would rather have something reliable every month instead of wondering where that months protection is going to come from.

That they can't wash because they can't afford to, don't have access to anything but a shared sink, have nowhere to dry the things in the one room they are sharing with the whole family in a B&B (that they also have to be out of from 9-5). hmm Not everyone can use a mooncup, either, and I say that was someone has done so for well over a decade.

OlaEliza Wed 04-Dec-19 16:37:34

😂😂😂 I'm not middle class. At all.

And what train stunt are you talking about @HelenaDove? I think you've got me mixed up with someone else.

OlaEliza Wed 04-Dec-19 16:41:10

I grew up in the ends, bruv. What suburb or home county do you come from?

And I'm a heavy bleeder, so I use a cloth pad with a mooncup when necessary.

And cloth pads can be handwashed. Many recommend it rather than machine washing too.

dontalltalkatonce Wed 04-Dec-19 16:50:00

And cloth pads can be handwashed. Many recommend it rather than machine washing too.

And again, a lot of people have a shared sink to use, no place to dry them and/or cultural barriers and issues surrounding menstruation that might not lead to them want to use mooncups and cloth pads. Also, as stated, mooncups don't suit some people, so giving them away when they're as expensive as they are isn't really workable.

dottypotter Wed 04-Dec-19 16:56:02

No I'm not lucky my father didn't run off. Today's generation haven't got the commitment. People break up over the slightest thing. Then expect the gvt to help. They only have the money they are getting from people's tax. Now every person who gets pregnant wants help it's awful. What have people's sex lives and the way they conduct themselves got to do with the Government. No wonder there are so many social problems and mental health problems how many children today are growing up with their natural parents together. It's disgusting. If you can't see it you must have been living on another planet. As I said there are some genuine cases of hardship and illness but in the main people are managing their lives badly and making bad choices. How come also there is so much contraception around now but more and more casual pregnancies is that because people know they can get help from the Gvt. Would they still act like this if you couldn't go running to the Government.

OlaEliza Wed 04-Dec-19 16:57:13

Branded mooncups are expensive, but there are many others now that aren't. And they may be more expensive at first as an initial outlaw but much more economical after that. After a couple of months they have paid for themselves.

If I couldn't afford pads every month, or didn't even have anyway of washing csp, I know what I'd rather.

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