Broadchurch finale. Roll up, Roll up.(725 Posts)
Eyes down for a full house on Monday.
Hopefully we can combine both threads.
In advance, why don't we each post ONE theory, then we can all gloat afterwards about how clever we are
How /Why did Joe suddenly become attracted to a boy after 15? years of being with Ellie ? No inkling before? She's a detective fgs!
Red herrings galore but still so many 'got' the murderer very early on.
I think the whole Broadchurch thing is massively overhyped. It was a good series but too many loose ends.
Like Mayday ( same production company) policeman's spouse is the perpetrator but this time the murderer was caught.
holly- maybe he always was attracted to boys but managed to hide it until he fell in love. Who knows? Danny might have been one of many over the years. One of the points the series put across is that you think you know someone but you don't.
Joe IS driven by self protection in the end as he kills Danny in a fit of fear/rage
That's true, miemohrs, but the reason he created the situation in the first place were these hidden, non-ordinary feelings that just about anybody in the show could have been concealing. He's not "an ordinary man in a moment of madness" at all. He's just someone who suddenly unexpectedly turns out to be an amoral psycho, threatening Danny, trying to blame Mark for driving Danny to him etc. We hadn't seen any of that volatility from him before. That's why I think it doesn't fit with the rest of the story - it's exactly the opposite of that banal, ordinary evil that proceeds from known qualities.
I'm slightly cheered by the news that S2 will continue this story. Even if it doesn't revisit the identity of the killer, it would be great if it dug a bit further into the other stuff going on in the town.
Hopefully they're reading this thread for ideas
But also Danny was saying to Joe (in the hut) things along the lines of "why don't you do these things to Tom" and basically calling Joe an abuser and that's when Joe lost it, because he doesn't think of himself as that "type" of man. He has rationalised it in his mind that he can't possibly be a paedophile/abuser because he's "in love" with Danny, so therefore, in his mind, hasn't done anything wrong.
......which is why this is so true to life.
People do all sorts of hurtful and cruel things that are justified by them because they believe themselves to be motivated by 'love'.
People having affairs constantly dress lust up as 'love'. The third parties (OW/OM) excuse their role in events by insisting that they 'fell in love'.
Abusers tell their victims that they only suppress and control because they 'love them so much'.
Romantic love especially is used by people the world over as a get-out clause for enacting grievous wrongs, or as a smokescreen for less forgiveable feelings, motivations and behaviour.
But also Joe dressed up his abuse of Danny - to himself and others - as doing Danny a big favour: because on one occasion he needed a substitute father figure. Joe stepped in and took horrendous advantage of Danny's vulnerability. Joe said of Danny: "He needs me." In Joe's worldview, he is doing a good turn to Danny. He flies into a murderous rage when Danny - so ungrateful! - says he doesn't want to continue what Joe deludes himself is a loving relationship, in which he, Joe, does all the giving. And Joe is unlikely ever to see the "relationship" in any other way, or acknowledge his abuse of the boy.
Charbon- very true.
cestle- you are right about Joe's delusion. I honestly don't think he saw himself as a paedophile, but was afraid other people would think of him as such.
I really enjoyed it - I was expecting a few more twists in the last episode, but that's probably because I'm Agatha Christie/Midsomer Murders whodunnits.
The 'how could you not know' from Ellie was the big giveaway for me.
The only thing that I found a bit unrealistic was the Joe was so chipper all the way through up till the last episode.
Is the new series a new story?
The writer was interviewed on Daybreak (standing on the beach below the cliffs!) and he said it would be a very different story.
I reckon the actor who played the vicar thought he'd done it till the end - he was doing a good line in agonised torment throughout the series.
The cast had their own sweepstake on who the murderer would be so perhaps he was their frontrunner
I wondered how Ellie accepted so quickly that her husband did it? Did she have some inkling deep down about him?
I think she trusted Alec to get it right. He may have 'taken her job' at the start but by the time it all emerged she knew he well him enough to know he'd not leap to conclusions.
OC had already had a few surprises about her other half before the denouement. The paintballing, for instance. She was probably beginning to realise that there were things happening at home that she had no inkling of. That your oh is a child-molester and murderer is a different scale, though, but maybe her respect of DT's work had bloomed sufficiently by then for her to trust him. Maybe there were enough surprises going on that it all fell into place?
Well he confessed, so it led her with little room for doubt.
Would agree that Rory The Vicar thought he was the front runner. He was shifty all the way through.
The writer said the second series would be in Broadchurch but there wouldn't be a murder.
I thought somewhere on mn someone mentioned that the second series would be all about the trial and how Dr Who stuffs it up and fails once again to get a conviction.
No, that may have been speculation. The writer is keeping Mum. All he has said is that it is in Broadchurch and there won't be a murder. No cast information has been released or confirmed.
Here's an article about if from Digital Spy
eat I said earlier in this thread that Ellie has paid for information related to the case (from her sister), SOCO has no forensics that tie Joe to the murder scene, yes there are the emails but that does not prove murder, so I can imagine the court case will be set for a few twists and turns if Joe's barrister urges him to plead not guilty, or plead diminished responsibility in some way, and they get the confession ruled as inadmissible in some way.
I thought Joe played the scene with Danny and later DT well. What I don't think worked was that as the focus was more on the effect of the murder on the individuals involved and the town, we didn't see Joe being in any way conflicted or troubled. A couple of odd moments, no more.
That could be a "not all paedophiles are obvious" but we had little insight into his character which made the story weaker.
Also Danny, in murder stories there's an emphasis on finding out as much as possible about the victim. Again, maybe this was part of the Broadchurch angle, focussing on the others but I thought we knew too little about what he was like from family, friends, teachers. So the Joe story wasn't as plausible imo.
I thought the show was good. I enjoyed it. feel quite let down by the ending. I kid of sat there and said 'is THAT it"?
I too thought it was very odd how Mark's mistress, ozzy with the hotel, lit the fire.
Among all the red herrings, I had dismissed everyone, dismissed the vicar. But I could not decide between Ellies dh , and Nige the dim plumber. Although I had no motive for Nige.. I did think Ellie's dh was very odd and fishy. But I never guessed at abuse/love. Thats was a bit of a shocker.
I do feel a bit let down.
I thought Joe saying "I'm not that man" when losing it with Danny implied that he had been abused and was desperate not to "be" his own abuser, (just as PQ's character jumped to conclusions re Nigel because she was convinced he would be like his father). That would explain his behaviour and 'relationship' with Danny - and that he was rationalising his behaviour by convincing himself that he was not violent or an abuser because he 'loved' Danny and had (so far) not touched him sexually - Danny wanting it to stop challenged that view of himself (as well as making him panic about the repercussions and not seeing Danny any more) which would be enough of a psychological shock to trigger the violence I would think.
Not sure if that makes sense?! Hope we'll find out in series 2, so much more I want to know!
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