Teen dd friendship issues... wwyd?

[thegreatcrestednewt]

DD is in Year 10 - 15. Had a lovely group of friends since starting secondary. But this year they have fractured. There was one big group in the class that dd used to be part of. But now it's two smaller groups, and the girls in the breakway group are being really mean to the other girls - ignoring them, leaving them out, not inviting them to partiesm, blanking them, excluding them, talking loudly about what they've been up to in front of them but not socialising at all with them out of school.

The worst thing is that dd's best friend is the worst one. She's got a new best friend and they're all over each other and exbf is being nasty to dd and the other group.

It's especially nasty because this girl has always been so lvoely. I can't imagine why she's changed so much.

All the girls in the left behind friendship group are upset.

WWRD? Say something to school? Say something to parents of exbf (we are friends), or leave the dc to sort it out themselves? Apparently girls are crying each day and it all sounds like a hot mess.

DD has tried to talk to exbf and say how upset she is at the way she's acting, but exbf either airs DD or pretends she has no idea what she's done wrong. Of course she has!

Help...

[thegreatcrestednewt]

It's been going on for 2 months with no sign of resolving itself/settling down. In fact, things are ramping up.

[thegreatcrestednewt]

Anyone?

[SpoonBlender]

Teenagers. Everything's about social status (real or imaginary!).
There's nothing you can do about the other kids, they're off in their own extremely silly world, and really all you can offer DD is love and support. If she's the type to appreciate it, show her some "why teenagers are fucking idiots - the science behind adolescent minds" type resources. Ask over in the Teenagers group, they've got good resources. Might as well ask support to move this thread there too, really.

[Kiwiinkits]

You can’t do anything about this. Teenage girl bitchiness is just part of the fun. They’ll grow out of it. Encourage your dd in her sports.

[Witchend]

If they've broken into two groups, then I wouldn't expect them to be inviting the other group to parties etc.

I would tell dd to concentrate on the group of friends she now has and leave the other group alone. It'll sort itself out probably if they agree to do that.

[thegreatcrestednewt]

Good idea, Spoonblender!

I didn't say that, Witchend - but I don't expect them to be gloating over it - 'ha, you're coming to my party but you're not!' like 5yos.

DD is pretty level-headed and is fed up with all their nonsense but is sad about it. I have told her to focus on her new group - they're coming to us for a sleepover this weekend.

[MamTDM]

I have recently learned to my cost that saying something to the parent of a teen who's being vile does not end well. He's being even viler and I've lost a friend. Sometimes all you can do is be there as a sounding-board, teach resilience and let them work it out.

[Gwynfluff]

My view is that making this a narrative about ‘bitchy girls’ is really unhelpful. For boys and girls most of the flux in friendship seems to happen in years 7 & 8 after which it tends to settle down as they establish their new secondary groups, which often grow as they meet other people. So it’s quite a late split.

I would support your daughter and encourage her to use it as an opportunity to appraise her friends and reflect on who are her loyal and good friends and support her as much as you can to make arrangements to see them, without the flashy Instagram posts. In many cases the lead character - stereotyped as the queen bee in girls is often a fairly divisive person, who once the group open up discussions is often feared and/or disliked by most people and fairly emotionally exhausting. This is the life lesson to not waste your time on such people.

I’ve got 2 teen girls and a boy about to go into year 7. I always encourage to not get dragged in and to seek out others in the group. But also not to play the same games of showing excluding media photos other making plans to go out without someone in front of them. Also to call out what is bullying behaviour or at least not legitimise it.

[Bouledeneige]

Don't involve school or parents. What are they actually going to do - make everyone be friendly with someone they don't want to be friends with anymore?

Focus your energies on supporting your DC to be resilient, courageous and skilled at developing new friendships - it will last them a lifetime. Friendships will always be in flux throughout life so if you DC learn to be resilient they will thrive and prosper with immense life skills.

[thegreatcrestednewt]

No, boule, but perhaps make the girls realise their shitty behaviour has been noticed and get them to stop it! I don’t care about them being friendly; I just want them to stop being shitty.

Sorry, Mam, that can happen... I don’t know how my friend will react. She knows something is up as she’s being very shifty.

Shame, as I would definitely want to know if dd was being a git.

gwynfluff - how is it unhelpful? That’s what they are. But yes, good advice, which I have given dd. There is usually insecurity or something else negative behind such bitchiness.

Dd has tried calling out bullying behaviour: ‘ I was really hurt when you ignored me today. Why did you do that?’ and exbf either airs her or goes off in floods of tears!

[2cats2many]

I would never want to be friends with people who treated me like that and neither should your DD. Treat this as a lesson in developing emotional boundaries and self esteem.

What has she got going on for herself outside of school? Now might be a good time to join a sports club or society. Instant connection with possible future friends and a chance to be good at something. Both excellent routes to healthy self esteem.

[jenthelibrarian]

Get hold of a copy of 'Queen Bees and Wannabees: Helping Your Daughter Survive Cliques, Gossip, Boyfriends, and the New Realities of Girl World ' by Rosalind Wiseman.

It is American, but it is a fascinating read with some good advice. It helped my daughter take a step back and start looking at the groups with an almost scientific detachment, observing the roles being played.

There is a lot of good coping advice for parents, too, when your instinct makes you wish you could give a few good slappings

[Cottonwoolmouth]

Actually I think if it’s impacting her learning I’d speak to pastoral care at school to see if they can smooth things over.

I’d also speak to your friend about it but in a very non accusatory way and ask her to see if she can find out why the girls have split and if they could patch it up.

Girls at this age can be savage

[thegreatcrestednewt]

Quite agree, 2 cats. So does dd.

School takes up most of her time but yes, she belongs to a sports club outside school.

[thegreatcrestednewt]

I’ve heard if that, Jen, thank you. She has ‘Girl bullying’ too, which is a good read.

Oh yes re the slappings!! We took this girl on holiday a few months ago, and now she’s being horrible. Not just to dd, to lots of people...

Thanks, cottonwool, I was wondering that...

The girls are very reluctant to call out exbf for some reason - it just doesn’t work like that and people will pick on me if they think I’m lonely. Honestly. For articulate girls who talk about everything, really?

[madeyemoodysmum]

At this age I’d expect them to be mixing a bit with the boys again. Has she any male mates to hang with for a change in scene

[bobo26]

I think this is usual teenage girl stuff I'm afraid.

[Gwynfluff]

thegreatcrestednewt I personally find it unhelpful as it implies women can’t make and have good supportive friendships, when they absolutely can. And it can lead to the game playing being intensified - if girl friendships are predicated on such behaviour, why not keep retaliating with the same behaviour?

It also leads to the narrative that boys are these emotionally straightforward creatures who have a ‘good fight’ and move on. And again completely misses how much boys can psychologically gameplay and leave people out and how physical violence is destructive.

In both cases, young people need support when friendships go wrong and help to reflect and look for other allegiances and friends.

Or that’s the approach I’ve taken as the simplistic views have not taken into account my eldest girl finding supportive, emotionally satisfying friendship with a large group of girls. And wouldn’t have been much use when my son came back and reported having fallings out with friends based very much on psychological tactics of being left out/ name calling/ teasing etc (actually way more than the girls) as well as physical attacks that got out of hand or were very persistent.

[AtseneGatnalp]

My youngest is a DD in Year 10. It's horrendous. There have been awful friendship problems (including DD being ostracised). DD was friends with a group who then turned seriously shitty on her. It was awful. However... they just have to get on with it. All I did, for a year, was be the person that DD sounded off at. I just kept telling her that she just had to go in to school, focus on her subjects, and rise above it all. She's a nice person, and the nicer girls would see this in the end. She now has a lovely group of friends. If I'd gone in to school, I think she would have killed me.

[BlueCornishPixie]

If the group has split in two then DD still has plenty of friends. She can't do anything about the other behaviour really apart from ignore it.

The only thing she can do is concentrate on the friends she's got. It sounds like the one half has decided they don't want to be friends with the other, the only thing DD can do is accept these girls are no longer her friends and move on. If she accepts they aren't friends then so what if these girls don't invite her to parties? Anything else gives the girls more power to weald.

One thing I would say is I remember these things happening back in the day, and they were rarely one sided when it was two groups involved. So I would be a little wary of going into the school or anything. If you are good friends with the girls mum you could gently probe to find out what's going on, but it's entirely possible her DD has given her an entirely different story.

[thegreatcrestednewt]

She’s at a girls’ school. She absolutely knows that some girls are lovely, some are bitches.

She has friends who are boys in other schools.

Nah, have spoken to a few parents and dd’s story is right. Her exbf has suddenly changed friendship groups.

Thank you, atsene.

[Titsywoo]

I really feel for you as my dd has had lots of friendship issues throughout secondary. But I would say don't get involved. Be there for your dd to listen and give support and love but talking to parents etc is a mistake. I'd encourage your dd to talk to someone at school if it is affecting her schoolwork or maybe you could find out who deals with pastoral care so you can direct her where to go. This is how teen girls are and you might find in 2 weeks she is friends with them again. Which is why I say listen and not advise. They are so up and down and dramatic and it's better you don't help hype up the drama but stay calm. If you think she is being bullied that is another matter of course and you should talk to the school in that instance.

[Theworldisfullofgs]

You can't make them change. If you involve yourself you become part of the drama.
Equip your dd to understand what's going on in terms of dynamics.

And remember brains don't develop properly until mid 20s. The last bit to properly develop is emotional regulation and that affects perspective taking.

All you can do is support your daughter and not get overly involved.

[AtseneGatnalp]

I hope things improve for your DD, @thegreatcrestednewt. FWIW, mine is at a girls' school, too (has been since Reception) - as was I. I certainly remember the vileness of girls. I'm not sure whether 'all girls' plays a role or not, but it's hard for them - and hard for us, as we just have to stand by and watch, really, so long as it's "just" nastiness, rather than actual bullying.

The other thing I have learnt over many years is that my own children are very rarely 100 percent in the right.

[thegreatcrestednewt]

Have ordered the queen bees book, thank you.

I'm pretty sure in this case dd is tellign the truth as all her friends have said the same. But yes, we have been talking about being 'cool' and how some girls are mean and people are friends with them so they're not left out/picked on/targeted.

I personally find it unhelpful as it implies women can’t make and have good supportive friendships, when they absolutely can.

Fair enough. And I know they can - dd has had lovely supportive friendships through her whole time at secondary - this is the first time there have been any issues. And hopefully I model the same to dd with my friends.