desperate from advice from mums of teenage boys

[FayeGovan]

hi

I have 2 boys, aged 12 and 14

they are fighting all the time and its driving me crazy and utterly depressing

they are very competitive and like the same sport, which they play then fight about

the youngest is doing better in the sport than the older one and the older one is very jealous, but this takes the form od sneering comments and ignoring the young one, who gets angry and doesn't let the older one win whenever they play

please dont tell me to stop them playing the sport, thats like telling a fish no to swim

we live in a small house, there is nowhere to separate them when they start

they have separate friends but often the friends are away at their dads/grans etc. so then they are stuck in

we have absolutely no family help, no grandads or uncles or anyone to take them away or out for a little while, its just the 4 of us together all the time

please can anyone advise, really anyone who has been in this situation and found something that helps

we have taken away phones/x boxes etc, didnt make any difference, only made them worse as they spent even more time together
I suppose what upsets me most is my children seem to hate each other

I grew up like an only child, elder siblings a lot older than me and left home when I was small, so grew up with elderly parents in a quiet house

I thought having 2 kids close in age meant there would always be a friend there for them to play with, something I never had when I was young

now I can see how wrong I was

on paper they should get on great, similar interests, nice kids, both quite clever and both popular

but every things a horrible fight instead

[Theas18]

THis too shall pass...... its another stage I'm afraid, trouble is they are oler and it may be a few years not months when they were screaming in sainsburys for sweets...

I have GBG and actually we don't have much fighting really. I know this is unusual and it is probably the gender spread (they aren't in direct competition) and they are also 3 school years apart.

Friend has 2 boys 14 months apart, and for many years they just fought all the time. THey are now 18/17 and have settled down a lot and are lovely lads (though they'll have tough year as the eldest is staying at school to do more A2 exams as he missed more than a term of the start of his A2 courses due to ill health- this puts both boys in the same year at the same school and applying to uni at the same times.... they are also extremely sporty/competitive- though different sports)

[FayeGovan]

thanks for answering theas18

I got up early to think about this, I couldnt sleep

I was screaming at them last night and sent them to bed. When I get upset it always tells on ds1, he's the more emotional one of the 2 of them. He came downstairs at midnight crying...I was sitting alone with a glass of wine......he said theres a ghost in my room and I cant sleep....I ended up sleeping in his room. Because we are all so close I notice that whenever we all have a massive fight and I lose the plot one of the kids, usually ds1 cant get to sleep that night and then I feel crap for all the yelling. Me and ds1 are close, dh and ds2 get on like a house on fire and so I make sure ds1 isnt left out and we are close/ Dh and ds1 are very very alike and wind each other up, although both love football and I can see them being close when ds1 grows up a bit. Ds2 is in an academy club and is doing great, something that never happened to ds1 who would have loved to be in an academy.....dh is very involved with ds2 and his club and they are very close, dh and ds1 clash more and so I make sure I take a lot of interest on ds1 to balance things out (also I hate bloody football!!).

anyway as I said I gor up early and have been thinking about all this. I wanted to ignore the two of them today but I need to be a bit more grown up and be the adult here....they know the fighting upsets me, ds1 tries to tell ds2 not to annoy me, but by them its gone on too long and I'm ready to burst at the two of them

I know this is probably normal family life in a family that spends all its time together

I'd dearly love some family nearby to help out, but they are either 300 miles away and have never helped out or been interested or they are dead

its a horrible feeling

[FayeGovan]

mind you this must be harder with girls and periods thrown in

[FFSIvehadenoughofthisnow]

It's interesting that you say you feel you have to pay special attention to ds1 to make up for dh being more involved with ds2. You don't mention how your dh feels about the constant fighting, but both your boys need to feel equally important to their dad, and if ds1 feels that his dad doesn't appreciate him as much as ds2 then this may be adding to your problems.

Maybe you could talk to your dh about making an effort to be more appreciative of, and possibly more involved with, ds1. At the end of the day, being good at sport is not the be all and end all in life, but if your sons think this is what matters most to their dad, and ds1 feels that he doesn't quite cut the mustard in comparison to ds2, then I can see this leading to problems - not only between the boys now, but in the future as well.

That said, of course all siblings fight, especially if they are close in age! But I do think you need to objectively examine the dynamics in your family to make sure everyone feels appreciated by both parents.

Good luck, I'm sure everything will be alright in the end.:)

[FayeGovan]

dh does try to involve ds1, but when he asks ds1 to do anything ds1 says no

ds2 is the easier child to get on with, he has a sunnier nature

ds2 says yes to his dad and ds1 says no

I feel ds1 is left out a bit but he sure doesn't help himself

[JustGettingByMum]

Is your DH asking DS1 to do fun stuff - or jobs?

Really your DH needs to spend time with DS1 on the fun things, including valuing his football even though its not at the same level.

I have 2 boys, 2 years apart and they fought and argued constantly when younger. Now they are 19 & 17 they are lovely and have been for about 3 years. I promise, it does get better, but its not easy and its not all your responsibilty. THEY are responsible for how they behave.

[RubyFakeNails]

My DD1 and DS (both 16 now) are quite close now but between about 11 and 14 they argued constantly it made me murderous.

We tried lots of different approaches and some worked for a while then things would change (find a new way to irritate each other) and some failed miserably.

I suppose the main 2 things I did were be strict about it and do work behind the scenes.

Being strict manifested itself in 2 ways, I either sent them to their rooms in silence for the minutes of their age (all very super nanny toddler style I know), it was an instant thing as in the minute I heard it no warnings just "right upstairs" if they continued to bicker through the walls or whatever I doubled it. Sounds harsh but I was reaching the end of my tether, I think they found the constant disruption (once they learnt I wouldn't back down and they could complain for ages but they were still doing the 13 minutes) to what they were doing a pain and learnt to just sit quietly together if they couldn't get along. Also a sort of pre-emptive to this was when I became aware of them irritating each other they weren't allowed to talk to each other for an hour. I gave up on this as took too much monitoring.

The nice approaches were when I encouraged them and us to all spend quality time together, cooking, going out for dinners, playing games, cinema, bowling etc. Also on think it was a Tuesday and a Friday we used to have heart to hearts and try and get them to offer each other advice and say nice things to each other.

I don't know if it worked or they just grew out of it, but they spend a lot of time together now and are actually good friends.

[cory]

I'm like Ruby, super-strict about bickering and anything that sounds like a sneery comment. Instant reaction. Zero tolerance.

My take is that sneering at people is a disgusting habit, like picking your nose and eating the snot, and that we shouldn't have to be exposed to that in our own house.

I have uncomfortable memories of being allowed to get away with putting my elder brother down and out-clevering him and I wish someone had broken me of that habit at the same time as they broke me of nose-picking.

[FayeGovan]

thanks maryz

when they fight and I shout "go to your rooms" I honestly cant get ds1 to go, he's bigger than me and I cant just pick him up now. ds1 hates being alone and hates spending time alone in his room. ds2 happily goes up to his room and plays x box.they have separate rooms, thank god!

what worries me is if we limit the tv/x box they'd just be in the same room eg. the living room together even more, so that = more fighting and squabbling

I need to stop being so involved with them, but when its onoly me here day after day, dh at work, how can I stop being involved? As I said we have no family help, no none to give us a break or to give the ds's a break from us, this has made things worse over the years as never having a break winds you up to snapping point at the slightest thing, also knowing no break/help is on the horizon is suffocating.

[wigglybeezer]

I empathise, I have three boys, 13,11& 8. The fighting is the only thing I can't ignore. I don't know what your family budget is but can I suggest sending the boys to PGL type holidays without you to get a break, they are cheap compared to package tpe hols and I think you can use tesco vouchers. You could send them separately and spend one to one time with each or send them together to have a break ( and see how they get on when not competing for your attention). Probably best not to choose football camp.

My oldest is returning from a school trip tomorrow, my nerves have had a lovely rest

[BertieBotts]

Maybe don't ask DS1 to go to his room but tell them to go into separate rooms? It doesn't sound like DS1 follows DS2 up into his when he goes up there to play xbox? And then he could still be downstairs with you for company. I remember when my sister and I were teenagers my mum used to send one of us off for a bath or appear and say "I need one of you to help me with something".

Could you try to sign them up for any other clubs etc so they meet more people? It sounds rotten if their friends are away a lot and they can't get space from each other. I appreciate it's hard to engineer activities for teenagers, but perhaps google for youth clubs or find a brochure for sporting activities if they like sports - something different alongside the football stuff they could do, leisure centres often do things like squash and you might have a climbing wall nearby. (Again google it.) Scouts are for 10-14 years, and from 14 you can sign up to be a leader even if you've never been a scout. Shame they're too young for summer jobs maybe some kind of work experience scheme? Duke of Edinburgh scheme, after school clubs, cadets. Obviously all of these will vary in cost but some of them are cheap or free.

What's the money situation like? Could you send them off on a PGL holiday or something so you and DH get a break?

[BertieBotts]

Ooh great minds think alike wiggly!

[FayeGovan]

thanks for answers

the extra clubs things are no go financially, we arent even having a family holiday this yr never mind them getting separate breaks

and if they dont go to their rooms, apart from the living room we have no spare rooms for them to go to

we've done everything together re climbing walls etc etc

tried it and the only thing they love and want to stick is footy, and its too expensive to send them to things they dont love

[Almostfifty]

If your eldest refuses to go to his room, then make sure there are consequences. He needs to know that you're in charge and if he fails to respect that, then your husband will ensure he does exactly as you've told him

Don't discuss, don't argue, just tell him.

I have four boys and not one of them would dare to refuse to do as I tell them. Not even my 21 year old would ignore me, as it's my house, my rules. They are all much taller and physically stronger than me, but I am in charge.

[pinkpyjamas]

Go for long walks with them in the evenings.

It's free, and it will help to get rid of some of that teenage boy excess energy.
It's also a good way to chat to them and encourage them to get their worries off their chest - less confrontational to talk when walking than face to face.

Get them involved in things that they can do together - my two started up an odd job business helping out the neighbours.

Give them the opportunity to have shared POSITIVE experiences and some good memories of being together.

[FayeGovan]

thanks good advice here!

all peaceful here this weekend, ds2 at a friends!

maeyz, I thought you meant get the punchbag for ME!! stop me walloping someone!